[geo] Re: your BBC quote

2012-03-23 Thread Stephen Salter
Dear Alan The difference between my Commons statement and your position is too subtle for me. Do you mean that you are not alarmed about the possibility of the need for geoengineering becoming apparent? I could not possibly ask everybody because I do not have a complete list. However in

Re: [geo] Re: your BBC quote

2012-03-23 Thread Jamais Cascio
If I may, I think the difference is subtle but critical. The implication of the statement "...we fear it will be [needed]" is that we may be forced into a situation where we use geoengineering, but it's the correct remaining response. What Alan's arguing might be summed up as a fear that we wil

RE: [geo] Re: your BBC quote

2012-03-23 Thread Hawkins, Dave
: geoengineering@googlegroups.com [mailto:geoengineering@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jamais Cascio Sent: Friday, March 23, 2012 12:17 PM To: s.sal...@ed.ac.uk Cc: Alan Robock; geoengineering Subject: Re: [geo] Re: your BBC quote If I may, I think the difference is subtle but critical. The implicatio

Re: [geo] Re: your BBC quote

2012-03-24 Thread Emily
hi all, although I comment infrequently on this list, I am very interested in the discussions and really benefit from your expertise, so thank you for that. I'd like to offer three views on this discussion: 1) we are ALREADY geo-engineering the climate as well as many other aspects of our E

Re: [geo] Re: your BBC quote

2012-03-24 Thread James Fleming
Dear Stephen, Since you persist, I have to request that in the future you please speak for yourself, not as a spokesman for any ersatz geoengineering community. Please note that I am not asking to be added to your list of exceptions, but *I am asking you refrain from such generalizations.* Jim Fl

Re: [geo] Re: your BBC quote

2012-03-24 Thread Ken Caldeira
That's right, Stephen, you should learn from Jim's example: “Quite a few people fall into the category that I call ‘sincere but deluded scientists’ — that is, they are pathologically enthusiastic about their research, but not able to really rein in their enthusiasm,” Fleming said. http://thetartan

Re: [geo] Re: your BBC quote

2012-03-24 Thread Andrew Lockley
Just to provoke a little debate... Are there ANY scientists out there who think we should use geoengineering INSTEAD of emissions reduction? IE advocating BAU+GE ? I suggest there are not, but I'd be interested to see if I'd get pilloried for speaking for the community. A On 24 March 2012 14:0

Re: [geo] Re: your BBC quote

2012-03-24 Thread Alan Robock
Dear Ken, Actually, the GISS ModelE has a little too much sea ice. However, if you look at Fig. 9 of our first geoengineering paper, http://climate.envsci.rutgers.edu/pdf/2008JD010050small.pdf , you will see that we indeed had an increase in sea ice in the very location that the Hadley model

Re: [geo] Re: your BBC quote

2012-03-24 Thread Ken Caldeira
Your explanation may be right and mine is probably wrong, but surface albedo change does affect downward shortwave because there are reflections off of cloud bottoms. This effect is strongest in the arctic where there is both high cloudiness and high surface albedo, making multiple reflections imp

Re: [geo] Re: your BBC quote

2012-03-24 Thread Stephen Salter
Hi All Andrew's question reminds me that there was once a debate on our Hose of Commons when one member said of another. 'The Right Honourable gentleman has the manners of a pig.' The was a general outcry of 'Withdraw, withdraw'. The member said 'Very well I withdraw my statement.

Re: [geo] Re: your BBC quote

2012-03-24 Thread Mick West
The polar plots were done by [Add->Image Overlay] in Google Earth, then stretching the image to cover the globe, and aligning the continents. Fortunately you used lat/long as the projection, as everything lined up very well, although of course it skews the area representation somewhat in the 2D ver

Re: [geo] Re: your BBC quote

2012-03-24 Thread Alan Robock
Dear Mick, Thanks so much. Alan [On sabbatical for current academic year. The best way to contact me is by email, rob...@envsci.rutgers.edu, or at 732-881-1610 (cell).] Alan Robock, Professor II (Distinguished Professor) Department of Environmental Sciences Rutgers University 14 College Farm