Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-18 Thread hector
Douglas Otis wrote: 1) Why? There is use in specifying an API here. Every other protocol we've named so far as examples have an API, whether de facto from lots of experience, or implicit from the spec that defines it the protocol, or something actually explicit defining the API.

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-18 Thread Douglas Otis
On Jun 18, 2009, at 11:18 AM, hector wrote: Douglas Otis wrote: 1) Why? There is use in specifying an API here. Every other protocol we've named so far as examples have an API, whether de facto from lots of experience, or implicit from the spec that defines it the protocol, or

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-18 Thread hector
Douglas Otis wrote: On Jun 18, 2009, at 11:18 AM, hector wrote: Douglas Otis wrote: 1) Why? There is use in specifying an API here. Every other protocol we've named so far as examples have an API, whether de facto from lots of experience, or implicit from the spec that defines it

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-18 Thread hector
Douglas Otis wrote: On Jun 18, 2009, at 11:18 AM, hector wrote: This is why I as seeking an answer to why just d= and not anything else. What it for a reputation system? The response from a closed group of large email providers regarding how they would like to have their reputation

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread MH Michael Hammer (5304)
] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend) tThis update resolves that confusion. It defines additional, semantic labels for the two values, clarifies their nature and specifies their relationship. More specifically, it clarifies

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread Dave CROCKER
MH Michael Hammer (5304) wrote: +1 From: ietf-dkim-boun...@mipassoc.org [mailto:ietf-dkim- Hmmm. Noting two quick +1s to Murray's text and in the interest of still trying to bring this quick errata/update effort to a close, I'm inclined to suggest adding his explanatory text to the

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread Bill.Oxley
] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend) Importance: High MH Michael Hammer (5304) wrote: +1 From: ietf-dkim-boun...@mipassoc.org [mailto:ietf-dkim- Hmmm. Noting two quick +1s to Murray's text and in the interest of still trying to bring this quick errata/update effort

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread Suresh Ramasubramanian
On Wed, Jun 17, 2009 at 9:07 PM, bill.ox...@cox.com wrote: +1 +1       tFor signers and verifiers that have been using the i= tag as the         primary value that is delivered to the assessor, a software change to         using the d= tag is intended.       /t s/intended/required/

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread hector
API Definition? The socket example? Come on. BTW, What is the definition of an Application Programming Interface and what portion of DKIM is like an API definition. This is incomprehensible, overdone to get some simple concept across that only needs 1 or 2 paragraphs. Dave, these paragraphs

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread Douglas Otis
On Jun 17, 2009, at 8:08 AM, Dave CROCKER wrote: So, here's a suggested merging of the two: This currently leaves signers and assessors with the potential for making different interpretations between the two identifiers and may lead to interoperability problems. A signer could intend one to

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread Murray S. Kucherawy
BTW, What is the definition of an Application Programming Interface and what portion of DKIM is like an API definition. I'm quite comfortable with drawing an implicit you must be this tall line and assuming someone reading this, i.e. an implementer (e.g. YOU), will know what an API is. Or

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread Murray S. Kucherawy
So, here's a suggested merging of the two: tThis currently leaves signers and assessors with the potential for making different interpretations between the two identifiers and may lead to interoperability problems. A signer could intend one to be used for

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread Murray S. Kucherawy
If you going to this level, you need to be more specific with software engineering terminologies and how it applies to SMTP. Murray's API is not going to be same as MY API or that guys API and it may not be just in C or C++, but in multiple of languages, and the API be COM interface, a .NET

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread Murray S. Kucherawy
Any reputation assessment system should not: 1) limit what is to be assessed. The proposed text does not put any limits on what gets assessed. If an assessor wants more information, it is free to use a verifier that provides more information. 2) allow inclusion of un-assessed information

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread hector
Murry, How else can this be said? Think SMTP and think how a SMTP system will provide the process environment variables to either embedded filtering system or external SMTP filtering system. Most SMTP servers with an ACL or similar concept, including SendMail with its mfilters, our ours with

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread hector
Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: All the errata is saying is that all DKIM APIs must return, at a minimum, the d= and the evaluation result. There are no other limits imposed. The concern I have is that an SMTP vendor may erroneous model his Assessor hook by recording two data points on the

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread Douglas Otis
On Jun 17, 2009, at 2:24 PM, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: You have generalize ASSESSORS to have two minimum inputs: BOOLEAN (DKIM verification result) STRING (DKIM D= value) Correct. 1) Why? There is use in specifying an API here. Every other protocol we've named so far as

Re: [ietf-dkim] Modified Introduction text forrfc4871-errata (resend)

2009-06-17 Thread Dave CROCKER
Suresh Ramasubramanian wrote: tFor signers and verifiers that have been using the i= tag as the primary value that is delivered to the assessor, a software change to using the d= tag is intended. /t s/intended/required/ possibly? while you are right,