Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-11-12 Thread Ralph Goers
The development team I work with has tried many frameworks and has landed on using GWT in combination with Spring. They love using GWT as they say it saves them a tremendous amount of time. Ralph On Nov 11, 2010, at 7:45 AM, phil swenson wrote: > This is similar to what you guys are talking ab

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-11-11 Thread Mark Volkmann
I think the question is whether you can implement ALL the view code in a server-side framework. If you cannot because there are some dynamic things you want to do client-side to provide a better user experience, then why not implement ALL the view code so it runs client-side? It seems that the most

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-11-11 Thread phil swenson
Separation of view code from controller/model is what the view layer is for (jsp/.erb./.haml/.gsp/etc) All this does is move more of your logic into javascript in the browser instead of in your rendering template. You can do this with any web framework anyway if you like... but I will note it's h

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-11-11 Thread Mark Volkmann
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 9:45 AM, phil swenson wrote: > This is similar to what you guys are talking about from 37 signals: > > http://thinkvitamin.com/mobile/new-rails-like-framework-from-37signals-for-html5-mobile-apps/ > > I personally don't get the advantage of doing everything in javascript >

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-11-11 Thread phil swenson
This is similar to what you guys are talking about from 37 signals: http://thinkvitamin.com/mobile/new-rails-like-framework-from-37signals-for-html5-mobile-apps/ I personally don't get the advantage of doing everything in javascript on the client (less data to transport)? On Thu, Oct 28, 2010 a

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-11-01 Thread Mark Derricutt
The main problem I battle with with that you can get around this by having more, finer grained resources which only expose the information they need, and can be secured at that finer grained level, but then you increase the roundtripyness of your system. This has occasionally led us to keeping mor

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-10-31 Thread Cédric Beust ♔
On Sun, Oct 31, 2010 at 1:22 AM, Mark Derricutt wrote: > After a year or so of doing a RESTful application, with ext.js all on the > front end I'm thinking one of the problems/issues I have with this model is > that you tend to bleed A LOT of internal implementation details out to the > client in

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-10-31 Thread Mark Derricutt
One of the other interesting problems we've come up against is that we use flot.js for client side charting, it's a pure javascript charting framework. At some point awhile ago we were asked if we could also include our charts on the PDFs we generate on the back end - in order to do that we'd prob

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-10-31 Thread Mark Derricutt
After a year or so of doing a RESTful application, with ext.js all on the front end I'm thinking one of the problems/issues I have with this model is that you tend to bleed A LOT of internal implementation details out to the client in order for it to do its work. -- "Great artists are extremely s

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-10-28 Thread Moandji Ezana
Another +1 forI server-side frameworks not generating client-side views, but just feeding data. However, the other things frameworks do remain valuable (routing, marshalling, etc.). Mwanji -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The Java Posse" group. To po

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-10-28 Thread Dominic Mitchell
On Thu, Oct 28, 2010 at 6:02 PM, Mark Volkmann wrote: > I agree! I prefer implementing services that return JSON and creating > HTML views of that data using jQuery in the browser. I recommend > running JSLint on all your JavaScript code. It has saved me a lot of > debugging time. > Thank you for

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-10-28 Thread Mark Volkmann
On Thu, Oct 28, 2010 at 12:17 PM, Fabrizio Giudici wrote: > But I don't like JavaScript (*) at > all and I wouldn't like to use it in any way. I used to feel the same way. Reading "JavaScript: The Good Parts" changed my mind. -- R. Mark Volkmann Object Computing, Inc. -- You received this me

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-10-28 Thread Juan Marín Otero
I have been developing web apps this way for a while and enjoy it very much. No more JSF, thank you (although, as with everything, there is a place for that, too) On Thu, Oct 28, 2010 at 1:17 PM, Fabrizio Giudici < fabrizio.giud...@tidalwave.it> wrote: > On 10/28/2010 07:02 PM, Mark Volkmann wr

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-10-28 Thread Fabrizio Giudici
On 10/28/2010 07:02 PM, Mark Volkmann wrote: I agree! I prefer implementing services that return JSON and creating HTML views of that data using jQuery in the browser. I recommend running JSLint on all your JavaScript code. It has saved me a lot of debugging time. Architectural speaking, only

Re: [The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-10-28 Thread Mark Volkmann
On Thu, Oct 28, 2010 at 11:39 AM, clay wrote: > Five years ago, there were intense debates of web frameworks. There > were Java framework wars among Struts vs JSF vs Tapestry vs Wicket vs > Spring vs etc along with the the prominent non-Java frameworks such as > PHP, ASP.NET, Rails, etc. > > Recen

[The Java Posse] Are Traditional Server-Side Web Frameworks Dead?

2010-10-28 Thread clay
Five years ago, there were intense debates of web frameworks. There were Java framework wars among Struts vs JSF vs Tapestry vs Wicket vs Spring vs etc along with the the prominent non-Java frameworks such as PHP, ASP.NET, Rails, etc. Recently, I've been working on rich web applications that use: