Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Justin Forder
Vadim You are absolutely right, and Rickard pointed out earlier that choice by source is implemented in the file logging in jBoss, and not in the console logging. He said he would fix this. regards Justin In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Vadim Tkachenko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >According t

[jBoss-User] Changing naming port

2000-08-25 Thread John McDonald
I changed conf/jnp.properties: jnp.port=2100 and java.naming.provider.url=localhost:2100. I get the following exception:   It worked in pr_3, but it doesn’t work in pr_4. Is this a bug or is there a work around?   [Naming] Naming started on port 2100 [Naming] Initialized [Transaction

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Ole Husgaard
Sebastien Alborini wrote: > I think the logging process is too complex (four levels, Information > Error Debug Warning), and few people use this complexity in jboss code. > I would propose only 2 levels: > - Information-Error always printed > - Debug-Warning printed only if debug flag is true, thi

RE: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Rob Castaneda
Oops! I'm a goose. should have been www.log4j.org -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Rob Castaneda Sent: Friday, August 25, 2000 12:41 PM To: jBoss Subject: RE: [jBoss-User] Logging what about log4java? www.log4java.org They have do

RE: RE: [jBoss-User] Preferred Dev Tool: Visual Café or Visual Age w/jBoss?

2000-08-25 Thread Brett Palmer
I have used VisualAge, JBuilder, Forte, and VisualCafe (a while ago). Each has different strengths and weaknesses. Here's a summary (IMHO): 1. VisualAge * Doesn't support JDK 1.3 and only has a preliminary release for 1.2.2. - JBoss 2.0 requires JDK 1.3 * Pretty complicated but lots of cool f

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Jeremiah Johnson
Wow - I guess I just assumed that parameter would be available available in the MBean View to be changed at run-time. If a problem arrises, I may want to up logging level to see more details without restarting the system. Does it make sense for me to add this as a requirement to #127? I guess

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Vadim Tkachenko
According to Justin Forder: > Sebastien Alborini <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >Hi, > > > >I think the logging process is too complex (four levels, Information > >Error Debug Warning), and few people use this complexity in jboss code. > >I would propose only 2 levels: > >- Information-Error alwa

RE: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Rob Castaneda
what about log4java? www.log4java.org They have done a lot of thinking on it's framework, maybe some ideas You can control patterns of what you want displayed and configure different appenders for where you want the logs directed do you guys have any thoughts on this? -Rob -Origina

[jBoss-User] deployment failded and building - 2 questions

2000-08-25 Thread joel cordonnier
I'm a jboss new user, and I have the following problem: When deplying the TestBean example as provided with the jboss source distribution, there is no problem. But when I try to deploy the sample 'Interest bean' explained in the documentation, I have the message: Deployment Failed ../jboss/dis

RE: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread marc fleury
we can do better with a JMS based logger, where we provide "filters". We had such code demoing at JavaOne, and I am thinking about open sourcing it... worked with SpyderMQ marc > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Dan Christopherson >

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Justin Forder
Sebastien Alborini <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Hi, > >I think the logging process is too complex (four levels, Information >Error Debug Warning), and few people use this complexity in jboss code. >I would propose only 2 levels: >- Information-Error always printed >- Debug-Warning printed only if

Re: [jBoss-User] Anybody know why JDBC + SQL NPE errors happen

2000-08-25 Thread Justin Forder
Makes sense. Does EJX always work that way? If we had a DTD for jaws.xml, it would tell us. Justin In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Jay Walters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >Ha I figured it out. If you have a jaws.xml file with a tag >in it to indicate your default type mapping, move that tag

Re: [jBoss-User] Anybody know why JDBC + SQL NPE errors happen

2000-08-25 Thread Justin Forder
Sebastien Alborini <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Justin Forder wrote: >> >> Jay >> >> I find them pretty annoying too. I don't think they happen if you have >> the full set of deployment descriptors (ejb-jar.xml, jboss.xml, >> jaws.xml). >> >> They are coming from JAWSCMPField, which is a metadat

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Dan Christopherson
I see four log levels as minimal, rather than complex. Right now on my project we're using 6: Trace, Debug, Info, Warn, Error, Critical. Granted, this works best if you have an infrastructure that lets you split things up according to level (and facility is even better) On Fri, 25 Aug 2000, Seba

Re: [jBoss-User] Finder methods fail deployment in jBoss 2 pr3

2000-08-25 Thread Justin Forder
Bill I'm not sure if anyone got back to you on this... I was just trawling through my mail backlog and saw it. You are right: there was a change in JAWS defined finder code recently to get away from substituting text in the SQL given to a PreparedStatement, and to use PreparedStatement parameter

RE: [jBoss-User] Problem with BMP Entity Bean create not working

2000-08-25 Thread marc fleury
OK, jay just sent me an email, did a clean checkout, and it IS fixed :))) This message is to say, PLEASE DO CLEAN CHECKOUTS of CVS. The update stuff is a bit finicky (won't update if he detects "conflicts) so a rm (or delete :) jboss cvs checkout (or click click click ) jboss will always be a

Re: [jBoss-User] Please Help - Minerva - XML

2000-08-25 Thread Aaron Mulder
I did see this (or something similar) once when I added an environment entry to a bean in EJX but did not specify a value for it. I wanted the value to be an empty string, but instead no value tags were written to the XML at all. I found you could manually add the empty tags to the XML.

Re: [jBoss-User] JBoss performances

2000-08-25 Thread Justin Forder
Rickard Öberg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >One thread is ok, but it fails with many threads. I'm guessing a problem >in JAWS. Keep me informed (the thread safety changes we discussed yesterday are all in CVS). -- Justin Forder -- --

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Sebastien Alborini
Hi, I think the logging process is too complex (four levels, Information Error Debug Warning), and few people use this complexity in jboss code. I would propose only 2 levels: - Information-Error always printed - Debug-Warning printed only if debug flag is true, this flag would be a parameter o

Re: [jBoss-User] Anybody know why JDBC + SQL NPE errors happen

2000-08-25 Thread Sebastien Alborini
Justin Forder wrote: > > Jay > > I find them pretty annoying too. I don't think they happen if you have > the full set of deployment descriptors (ejb-jar.xml, jboss.xml, > jaws.xml). > > They are coming from JAWSCMPField, which is a metadata class that is > shared between EJX and jBoss, and whi

[jBoss-User] timer Notification

2000-08-25 Thread Prasant Komtamsetty
Hi  Guy's i am unable to get any timer notifications , with the follwoing code, i am a newbie to all these JMX stuff Please help. I have created Sun 's implementation  of Timer Bean  in the JBOSS server. and use following code to get notifications       myMBeanServer.invoke(myObjectName, "a

RE: [jBoss-User] Anybody know why JDBC + SQL NPE errors happen

2000-08-25 Thread Jay Walters
Ha I figured it out. If you have a jaws.xml file with a tag in it to indicate your default type mapping, move that tag after the tag. Oh so intriguing. There is some code which processes the new mapping when the tag is hit, and if it hasn't already hit the which you reference you get all th

RE: [jBoss-User] problem to deploy sample test: I need HELP

2000-08-25 Thread Yan Tang
Thank you! It worked. Yan Tang PentaSafe Security Technologies, Inc. Phone 713-523-7079 X1126 -Original Message- From: Luan O'Carroll [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, August 25, 2000 3:34 AM To: jBoss Subject: Re: [jBoss-User] problem to deploy sample test: I need HE

Re: [jBoss-User] Anybody know why JDBC + SQL NPE errors happen

2000-08-25 Thread Charles Crain
I hear that this is a known issue...it is just an artifact of the way things are done right now. I think one of the JBoss guys said this portion is undergoing a rewrite that will fix these exceptions. BTW, I get them too, both when using MySQL and when using PostgreSQL. -Charles Jay Walters w

RE: [jBoss-User] Problem with BMP Entity Bean create not working

2000-08-25 Thread marc fleury
Jay, I see you opened a bug I will try to tackle it marc > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jay Walters > Sent: Friday, August 25, 2000 6:59 AM > To: 'jBoss' > Subject: RE: [jBoss-User] Problem with BMP Entity Bean create not > workin

RE: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread marc fleury
Yeah we are going to rewrite that... hehe I said it! marc > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Rickard Öberg > Sent: Friday, August 25, 2000 4:50 AM > To: jBoss > Subject: Re: [jBoss-User] Logging > > > Hi > > Justin Forder wrote: > > C

RE: [jBoss-User] Container managed persistence

2000-08-25 Thread marc fleury
> Justin Forder wrote: > > I haven't got all the details straight, but this looks to me like a > > caching problem. The only way I can think of that updates can get > > "undone" in the way you describe is if more than one instance of the > > entity is being held in jBoss. > > > > Marc - any thoug

RE: [jBoss-User] R M-H Examples (and Ken's stuff)

2000-08-25 Thread marc fleury
hello, we are fixing this will let you know (Test 1 and 2 work, test 3 (external ref) fail for now... ) marc > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Matthew > Cooper > Sent: Friday, August 25, 2000 12:32 AM > To: marc fleury > Cc: jBoss >

Re: [jBoss-User] JBoss performances

2000-08-25 Thread danch
Rickard Öberg wrote: > > Hey > > Rob Castaneda wrote: > > Inprise had some example test code that they used to compare against other > > servers. Full documentation and code available at: (Actually the > > documentation was removed due to legal threats from a competitor that they > > had compare

Re: [jBoss-User] Anybody know why JDBC + SQL NPE errors happen

2000-08-25 Thread Daniel G. Koulomzin
Hey all, I have a complete set of mappings in jaws.xml and still get the error. Its EXTREMELY annoying, since it tends to chew through my terminal's buffer very fast, making it hard to find out if anything wierd happens early in the deployment process. -Dan Carlos Valiente wrote: > Justin For

RE: [jBoss-User] JBoss performances

2000-08-25 Thread Rob Castaneda
hmm, yeh it comes with IAS 4, I can send it to you if you like. The download I gave you was the WebLogic 4.5x version of the test -Rob -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Rickard Öberg Sent: Friday, August 25, 2000 5:12 AM To: jBoss Sub

RE: [jBoss-User] Anybody know why JDBC + SQL NPE errors happen

2000-08-25 Thread Jay Walters
I have all the mappings (I think) and still get these errors. I've got defaultjaws.xml and jaws.xml containing all the mappings and still see this - you are correct in that everything works fine, so it's good enough for a beta, but it should be fixed for production. Cheers -Original Message-

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Justin Forder
Rickard Öberg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Hi! > >Justin Forder wrote: >> Are there any documentation conventions for MLETs? >> >> A good UNIX configuration file would be largely composed of explanatory >> text and commented-out examples. > >IMHO the current MLet conf style is seriously flawed. No

Re: [jBoss-User] Container managed persistence

2000-08-25 Thread Charles Crain
Actually, I subscribe to the JAWS mailing list as well, and there is a thread of someone describing exactly this same problem that I have seen. So, I know I am not on crack...but it still may be an old version problem on my part. Here is the message from the JAWS list: Hi, now I have tried my

RE: [jBoss-User] Problem with BMP Entity Bean create not working

2000-08-25 Thread Jay Walters
Looks still broken to me as of 9 AM EDT CVS, but perhaps I've messed up my server and/or config files trying to work around the problem... -Original Message- From: Ole Husgaard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, August 25, 2000 5:32 AM To: jBoss Subject: Re: [jBoss-User] Problem wit

Re: [jBoss-User] JBoss performances

2000-08-25 Thread Rickard Öberg
Rob Castaneda wrote: > Inprise had some example test code that they used to compare against other > servers. Full documentation and code available at: (Actually the > documentation was removed due to legal threats from a competitor that they > had compared their server to) > > http://www.inprise.

Re: [jBoss-User] Bugs in AutoDeployer/JRMPContainerInvoker

2000-08-25 Thread Rickard Öberg
Hi! Jeffrey Bonevich wrote: > The java.lang.Char problem I know about, but its the general instability > of the server once you have a bad deploy that I am more concerned > about. Anything to be done about that? Yes, I am currently adding some stuff to the shutdown code to handle problems durin

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Rickard Öberg
Hi! Justin Forder wrote: > Are there any documentation conventions for MLETs? > > A good UNIX configuration file would be largely composed of explanatory > text and commented-out examples. IMHO the current MLet conf style is seriously flawed. Not only is it a bad thing to have anonymous tags (

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Justin Forder
Justin Forder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Carlos Valiente <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>Is there any way to configure logging verbosity? > >To get rid of the JAWS trace, I'm afraid you need to alter a compile- >time flag and recompile. It's the debug flag in JDBCCommand.java. > >If someone expla

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Justin Forder
Rickard Öberg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >Hi > >Justin Forder wrote: >> Carlos Valiente <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> >Is there any way to configure logging verbosity? >> >> To get rid of the JAWS trace, I'm afraid you need to alter a compile- >> time flag and recompile. It's the debug flag i

Re: [jBoss-User] Bugs in AutoDeployer/JRMPContainerInvoker

2000-08-25 Thread Jeffrey Bonevich
Rickard Öberg wrote: > > Hey > > Jeffrey Bonevich wrote: > > Never heard back if you figured anything out on this one. Failure of > > deployment seems to really screw up the server - subsequent deployments > > keep failing or trying to deploy other, previously deployed beans. > > Seems pretty s

[jBoss-User] Tomcat+namig service

2000-08-25 Thread David Stupnanek
Hi, I am trying to create servlet client, using Tomcat (inside jBoss). In servlet init javax.naming.NameNotFoundException: comp not bound exception is raised. Please, what I need to configure to run naming service. I am totaly confused what is wrong, so I am sending part ofjboss.conf and

Re: [jBoss-User] Bugs in AutoDeployer/JRMPContainerInvoker

2000-08-25 Thread Juha-P Lindfors
On Fri, 25 Aug 2000, Rickard Öberg wrote: > > Hey! Just had an inspiration - a "deployment debugger" tool that would > > tell you if your bean is deployable in jboss without actually deploying > > it. Just a thought... > > Well, the Verifier should take care of that. Juha, any way to use it >

Re: [jBoss-User] JBoss performances

2000-08-25 Thread Rickard Öberg
Hey Rob Castaneda wrote: > Inprise had some example test code that they used to compare against other > servers. Full documentation and code available at: (Actually the > documentation was removed due to legal threats from a competitor that they > had compared their server to) > > http://www.inp

Re: [jBoss-User] Bugs in AutoDeployer/JRMPContainerInvoker

2000-08-25 Thread Rickard Öberg
Hey Jeffrey Bonevich wrote: > Never heard back if you figured anything out on this one. Failure of > deployment seems to really screw up the server - subsequent deployments > keep failing or trying to deploy other, previously deployed beans. > Seems pretty serious, unless the recommendation is t

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Carlos Valiente
Justin Forder wrote: > > To get rid of the JAWS trace, I'm afraid you need to alter a compile- > time flag and recompile. It's the debug flag in JDBCCommand.java. Thanks for the hint, Justin (and Rickard, too). Everything goes *much* faster with logging set to "Errors" -- "Es tristi di pidil,

Re: [jBoss-User] Bugs in AutoDeployer/JRMPContainerInvoker

2000-08-25 Thread Jeffrey Bonevich
Rickard - Never heard back if you figured anything out on this one. Failure of deployment seems to really screw up the server - subsequent deployments keep failing or trying to deploy other, previously deployed beans. Seems pretty serious, unless the recommendation is to shutdown the server aft

Re: [jBoss-User] Anybody know why JDBC + SQL NPE errors happen

2000-08-25 Thread Carlos Valiente
Justin Forder wrote: > > Jay > > I find them pretty annoying too. I don't think they happen if you have > the full set of deployment descriptors (ejb-jar.xml, jboss.xml, > jaws.xml). I think you might need a complete set of *mappings* in jaws.xml. I have the three deployment descriptors but get

Re: [jBoss-User] Container managed persistence

2000-08-25 Thread Nils Hartmann
Rickard Öberg wrote: > > Justin Forder wrote: > > I haven't got all the details straight, but this looks to me like a > > caching problem. The only way I can think of that updates can get > > "undone" in the way you describe is if more than one instance of the > > entity is being held in jBoss. >

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Rickard Öberg
Hi Justin Forder wrote: > Carlos Valiente <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > >Is there any way to configure logging verbosity? > > To get rid of the JAWS trace, I'm afraid you need to alter a compile- > time flag and recompile. It's the debug flag in JDBCCommand.java. > > If someone explains how t

Re: [jBoss-User] Anybody know why JDBC + SQL NPE errors happen

2000-08-25 Thread Justin Forder
Jay I find them pretty annoying too. I don't think they happen if you have the full set of deployment descriptors (ejb-jar.xml, jboss.xml, jaws.xml). They are coming from JAWSCMPField, which is a metadata class that is shared between EJX and jBoss, and which currently brings too much of its EJX

Re: [jBoss-User] Container managed persistence

2000-08-25 Thread Rickard Öberg
Justin Forder wrote: > I haven't got all the details straight, but this looks to me like a > caching problem. The only way I can think of that updates can get > "undone" in the way you describe is if more than one instance of the > entity is being held in jBoss. > > Marc - any thoughts? (In anoth

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Justin Forder
Carlos Valiente <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Is there any way to configure logging verbosity? To get rid of the JAWS trace, I'm afraid you need to alter a compile- time flag and recompile. It's the debug flag in JDBCCommand.java. If someone explains how to configure logging at run-time, I shall

Re: [jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Rickard Öberg
Hi! Carlos Valiente wrote: > > Is there any way to configure logging verbosity? Check /conf/jboss.conf. First parameter is what to let through the filter. /Rickard -- Rickard Öberg Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.telkel.com http://www.jboss.org http://www.dreambean.com -- ---

Re: [jBoss-User] Container managed persistence

2000-08-25 Thread Justin Forder
Nils I haven't got all the details straight, but this looks to me like a caching problem. The only way I can think of that updates can get "undone" in the way you describe is if more than one instance of the entity is being held in jBoss. Marc - any thoughts? (In another post, Nils says he is us

Re: [jBoss-User] problem to deploy sample test: I need HELP

2000-08-25 Thread Ken Jenks
>joel cordonnier wrote: > > It's always the problem: > > > > javax.namimg.NameNotFoundException.InvalidName at > > > >sun.com.enterprise.naming.java.javaURLContext.getRelativeName(javaURLContext.java:424) > > at > > > >com.sun.enterprise.naming.java.javaURLContext.getComponentContext(javaURLC

Re: [jBoss-User] problem to build Session Bean

2000-08-25 Thread Ken Jenks
At 10:30 AM 8/25/00 +0200, you wrote: >Hi! > >When compiling a simple client of an session bean, i >need to include a .jar library that contain >javax.rmi.PortableRemoteObject, used for narrowing. > >but i don't find the .jar file include in my >-classpath ... when compiling. Check out the Gettin

[jBoss-User] Logging

2000-08-25 Thread Carlos Valiente
Is there any way to configure logging verbosity? -- "Es tristi di pidil, piru is mas tristi di pidil un duminiu .es" -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Problems?: [EMAIL PROTEC

Re: [jBoss-User] problem to deploy sample test: I need HELP

2000-08-25 Thread Rickard Öberg
Hi! joel cordonnier wrote: > I'm a new Jboss user, and I have problems to deploy > the sample file com.web.interest.* described in the > pdf documentation. > > And it's the same with the test file 'TestBeans.jar' > provided with the source dictribution. > > It's always the problem: > > javax.n

RE: [jBoss-User] Preferred Dev Tool:VisualCafé or Visual Age w/jBoss?

2000-08-25 Thread Peter Jasko
Forte has some very nice features. I haven't really tried them all though because Forte is just too slow to load, has a slightly idiosyncratic editor and has quite slow GUI response(on a Dual PIII 550Mhz, 256Mb RAM, SUN JDK 1.3). I'm back to using a text editor with ant which is very effective. P

[jBoss-User] problem to deploy sample test: I need HELP

2000-08-25 Thread joel cordonnier
Hi ! I'm a new Jboss user, and I have problems to deploy the sample file com.web.interest.* described in the pdf documentation. And it's the same with the test file 'TestBeans.jar' provided with the source dictribution. It's always the problem: javax.namimg.NameNotFoundException.InvalidName at

[jBoss-User] CMP EntityBean Update

2000-08-25 Thread Ingo Bruell
Hi, now I have tried my first time to change an EntityBean value with a set...() Method but the value in the database was not changed. After shutting down jBoss, the change was lost. And why is there a commit after I have get a value ? Here the log from jBoss: snip [wb/User] Tx is tx:X

Re: [jBoss-User] Problem with BMP Entity Bean create not working

2000-08-25 Thread Ole Husgaard
Jay Walters wrote: >[cut] > [Category] Caught exception java.lang.NullPointerException > at > org.jboss.ejb.plugins.NoPassivationEntityInstanceCache.get(NoPassivat > ionEntityInstanceCache.java:118) >[cut] Known problem. I think that Marc Fleury has fixed it in CVS now, but haven't had t

[jBoss-Dev] Performance fix, EntityBeans

2000-08-25 Thread Rickard Öberg
Hey all As Marc outlined there was a performance problem with EntityBeans. The JAWS handling took way too much time resulting in bad performance. I just got my registered version of OptimizeIt today (VERY nice tool BTW!), and used it to check EntityBean usage. Found the problem right away: the o

[jBoss-User] problem to build Session Bean

2000-08-25 Thread joel cordonnier
Hi! When compiling a simple client of an session bean, i need to include a .jar library that contain javax.rmi.PortableRemoteObject, used for narrowing. but i don't find the .jar file include in my -classpath ... when compiling. tanks for any help Joel Cordonnier _

Re: [jBoss-User] problem to deploy sample test: I need HELP

2000-08-25 Thread Luan O'Carroll
You will need to set the TOMCAT_HOME and SERVLETAPI_HOME environment variables to point to the root directory of your tomcat installation. I then modified the classpath in the jboss bin/run.bat file following the "gotTomcatHome" label to include the tomcat jars as follows: set CLASSPATH=%CLASSPAT

Re: [jBoss-User] R M-H Examples (and Ken's stuff)

2000-08-25 Thread Matthew Cooper
Marc - is there any ETA on this at all? we are hitting this too and would like to know how long it might hang around. If you let me know when you think it's fixed we will build ofmr CVS and test it right away for you. Matty. marc fleury wrote: > > we are onto that, some stuff with the metadata