Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and publishing source data

2011-11-28 Thread 80n
On Sun, Nov 27, 2011 at 11:54 PM, Frederik Ramm wrote: > > > Whatever you publish could have other ingredients than just data; perhaps, > a few hundred hours' worth of a cartographer's editing in Illustrator. > *That* you don't have to release; it is yours to keep. That can't be right. If I ta

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and publishing source data

2011-11-28 Thread Richard Fairhurst
Frederik Ramm wrote: > I think that anything said until here will not be disputed by Richard Indeed not. :) > the bit that *can* be disputed is whether or not it is permissible > to label your resulting image a database and then not release > the database behind it. Yep. I read the EU Database

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and publishing source data

2011-11-28 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, On 11/28/11 10:43, 80n wrote: If you cannot reproduce the Produced Work 100% faithfully from the Derived Database in what sense does the Derived Database contain all of the information required to create the Produced Work? It doesn't, and it doesn't have to. Only in so far as the *database

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and publishing source data

2011-11-28 Thread 80n
On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 9:53 AM, Frederik Ramm wrote: > Hi, > > > On 11/28/11 10:43, 80n wrote: > >> If you cannot reproduce the Produced Work 100% faithfully from the >> Derived Database in what sense does the Derived Database contain all of >> the information required to create the Produced Wor

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and publishing source data

2011-11-28 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, On 11/28/11 11:58, 80n wrote: That's a very fine line you are trying to draw. Yes, I agree it is difficult. I think that it is entirely possible to arrive at an identical end product through different processes, where one process has different license implications than the other. For e

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and publishing source data

2011-11-28 Thread 80n
On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 11:25 AM, Frederik Ramm wrote: > Hi, > > > On 11/28/11 11:58, 80n wrote: > >> That's a very fine line you are trying to draw. >> > > Yes, I agree it is difficult. I think that it is entirely possible to > arrive at an identical end product through different processes, wher

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and publishing source data

2011-11-28 Thread Jonathan Harley
On 28/11/11 11:55, 80n wrote: On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 11:25 AM, Frederik Ramm > wrote: Yes, I agree it is difficult. I think that it is entirely possible to arrive at an identical end product through different processes, where one process has different lic

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and publishing source data

2011-11-28 Thread Eugene Alvin Villar
On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 6:00 AM, Ed Avis wrote: > I see that you and Frederik disagreed here.  (FWIW I think he is right - a PNG > file can clearly be seen as a database of pixel values.  It is an image too, > and perhaps even a map or a photograph, but legally it would be hard to argue > that it

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and publishing source data

2011-11-28 Thread 80n
On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Eugene Alvin Villar wrote: > On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 6:00 AM, Ed Avis wrote: > > I see that you and Frederik disagreed here. (FWIW I think he is right - > a PNG > > file can clearly be seen as a database of pixel values. It is an image > too, > > and perhaps eve

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and publishing source data

2011-11-28 Thread Eugene Alvin Villar
On Tue, Nov 29, 2011 at 12:31 AM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Eugene Alvin Villar > wrote: >> >> On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 6:00 AM, Ed Avis wrote: >> > I see that you and Frederik disagreed here.  (FWIW I think he is right - >> > a PNG >> > file can clearly be s

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and publishing source data

2011-11-28 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, On 11/28/2011 12:55 PM, 80n wrote: I could render a map from OSM and then render something else on top of it, say a commercially acquired set of hotel POIs. That would clearly be a Produced Work; I could point anyone asking for the source data to the planet file and the rende

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and publishing source data

2011-11-28 Thread James Livingston
On 28 November 2011 21:55, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 11:25 AM, Frederik Ramm wrote: > >> I could render a map from OSM and then render something else on top of >> it, say a commercially acquired set of hotel POIs. That would clearly be a >> Produced Work; I could poin