[L-I] An update on the historic victory of people over privatization in Cochabamba, Bolivia

2001-01-20 Thread Macdonald Stainsby
List members: Any comments on the following? Macdonald * An update on the historic victory of people over privatization in Cochabamba, Bolivia "Aguas del Tunari/Bechtel ... are currently suing the Government of Bolivia for close to US $40 million. They want Bolivians to

[L-I] 100 000 in Berlin honor Communist heroes

2001-01-20 Thread Macdonald Stainsby
- Via Workers World News Service Reprinted from the Jan. 25, 2001 issue of Workers World newspaper - LUXEMBURG & LIEBKNECHT: 100,000 IN BERLIN HONOR MEMORY OF COMMUNIST HEROES By John Catalinotto Berlin Some 100,000 people walked

[L-I] Indigenous Summit on FTAA.

2001-01-20 Thread Macdonald Stainsby
For Rad-Greens: Any movement built on anti capitalist environmentalist issues that leaves this behind *again* will be useless and bound to fail. Make the links and make the alliance. -Macdonald INDIGENOUS PEOPLES AND THE FREE TRADE AREA OF THE AMERICAS: AN ALTERNATIVE SUMMIT, CALL FOR PAPERS, PA

Re: [L-I] Any translators? This from another list...

2001-01-20 Thread Macdonald Stainsby
I would also like to point out that what I posted here (from another list) is also from a subscriber to this list. In other words, if Alexander (or anyone else) would like to take it upon him/herself to translate, you can direct your questions about the KPRF directly to them. They have been quie

Re: [L-I] Socialist Democracy at Home and Abroad

2001-01-20 Thread Nestor Miguel Gorojovsky
En relación a [L-I] Socialist Democracy at Home and Abroad, el 19 Jan 01, a las 9:13, Tony Abdo dijo: > Nestor, I believe that I probably was not clear in what I was saying > about Third World country Social Democratic Movements. > > You wrote.. > extremely favourable conditions (such as tho

[L-I] Organization of a Revolutionary Party

2001-01-20 Thread Macdonald Stainsby
"Forwarded from Anthony" on Marxmail: > If you look at the left in the United States since the Civil War you will > find a huge selection of organizational forms that were tried and ALL FAILED. Actually, both Lou and Anthony are *close* to correct, but they are too hard on us in general. We have

[L-I] Argentinean background to better understand the Water War in Cochabamba

2001-01-20 Thread Nestor Miguel Gorojovsky
En relación a [L-I] An update on the historic victory of people, el 20 Jan 01, a las 2:22, Macdonald Stainsby dijo: > List members: Any comments on the following? > > Macdonald > A couple of. Duménil and Lévy (1999a, 1999b) [available, if I am not wrong, at http://www.cepremap.cnrs.fr/~levy; th

Is Party for Democratic Socialism pro-socialist? (was Re: [L-I] 100 000 in Berlin honor Communist heroes)

2001-01-20 Thread Nestor Miguel Gorojovsky
En relación a [L-I] 100 000 in Berlin honor Communist heroes, el 20 Jan 01, a las 2:55, Macdonald Stainsby dijo: > > > > - > Via Workers World News Service > Reprinted from the Jan. 25, 2001 > issue of Workers World newspaper > - > > LUXEMBURG

Re: [L-I] Any translators? This from another list...

2001-01-20 Thread Nestor Miguel Gorojovsky
En relación a Re: [L-I] Any translators? This from another list, el 20 Jan 01, a las 5:46, Macdonald Stainsby dijo: > > Sincerely, > > Vladimir Sovetsky A nom de guerre? Is "Vladimir child of the Councils" a true Russian name? Just curious, actually. Néstor Miguel Gorojovsky [EMAIL PROTECTED]

[L-I] Ответ: [L-I] To moderators from Russia - to Mark Jones

2001-01-20 Thread Svetlana Baiborodova
>I am sure we'd all want to welcome Svetlana to this list. It is very good to >establish cordial relations with Russian leftist and working class organisations. I >hope that she will play an active part in our discussions. When comrades honestly >and sincerely strive to understand each other's pos

[L-I] Ответ: [L-I] To moderators from Russia - to Louis Proyect

2001-01-20 Thread Svetlana Baiborodova
>>I and my comrades in Russia want to read Vladimir Bilenkin`s point of view >>on problems disturbing us in living discussion with all other participants >>of your list. >>I hope, you will heed our request and correct the situation. >> >>Comradely, >>Svetlana Baiborodova > >I think Vladimir was th

[L-I] Re: Socialist Democracy at Home and Abroad

2001-01-20 Thread Tony Abdo
Nestor, I don't know that there is a scientific/ 'leninist' definition of Social Democracy. You have pegged it with two aspects; trade unionism and 'cooptation of the workers by the bourgeois state in an imperialist formation'. But can't workers be coopted by the bourgeois state outside the i

[L-I] Illiterate blacks

2001-01-20 Thread Louis Proyect
Svetlana: >May be I am mistaken because of my imperfect English but, in my opinion, the >fraze from that letter "They bused illiterate blacks to the polls ", means >not that the author considers that all Negro race is illiterate, but the >indication to the fact that the operatives from the democr

[L-I] To Mark Jones - Ответ: [L-I] To moderators from Russia

2001-01-20 Thread Svetlana Baiborodova
>I am sure we'd all want to welcome Svetlana to this list. It is very good to >establish cordial relations with Russian leftist and working class organisations. I >hope that she will play an active part in our discussions. When comrades honestly >and sincerely strive to understand each other's pos

[L-I] My two cents (was: Re: [L-I] ïÔ×ÅÔ: [L-I] To moderators from Russia - to Louis Proyect)

2001-01-20 Thread Nestor Miguel Gorojovsky
En relación a [L-I] ïÔ×ÅÔ: [L-I] To moderators from Russia - to, el 20 Jan 01, a las 19:36, Svetlana Baiborodova dijo: > ... you have not seen, that the indicated phrase belongs not to Vladimir but to > his friend, whose letter was published on the Leninist-International list. [...] I agree wit

[L-I] Re: ïÔ×ÅÔ: To moderators from Russia -to Louis Proyect

2001-01-20 Thread Tony Abdo
I absolutely agree with you, Svetlana. Vladimir and I have both been deprived of our right to discuss these issues. And most importantly still, other participants on this list have been deprived of the right to see the issues debated. This trigger happy attitude towards expelling people

[L-I] Re: [L-I] Ответ: [L-I] To moderators from Russia - to Louis Proyect

2001-01-20 Thread Macdonald Stainsby
- Original Message - From: Svetlana Baiborodova <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Svetlana, neither Louis or Mark are moderators here. I hope you stay, but Bilenkin is not- EVER- welcome here. I hope that can be clear. No Myers, no Bilenkin. Only one Jones. Macdonald Stainsby

[L-I] Re: [L-I] Re: ïÔ×ÅÔ: To moderators from Russia -to Louis Proyect

2001-01-20 Thread Macdonald Stainsby
> I once again call upon the moderators to cancel their expulsion off > list, of Vladimir, Owen, and Steve. It would be an act of characer > to admit the mistake, rather than compounding it. It is no sin to do > something mistakenly, and then to rectify it. I like you Tony. But it ain't g

[L-I] Ответ: [L-I] Re: [L-I] Ответ: [L-I] To moderators from Russia - to Louis Proyect

2001-01-20 Thread Svetlana Baiborodova
>Svetlana, neither Louis or Mark are moderators here. > >I hope you stay, but Bilenkin is not- EVER- welcome here. I hope that can be clear. >No Myers, no Bilenkin. Only one Jones. > >Macdonald Stainsby, >Co-Moderator > Oh, I am sorry for my mistake. It was found that you are the boss of this

Re: [L-I] Illiterate blacks

2001-01-20 Thread Macdonald Stainsby
> Revolutions of the 20th century have been made by illiterate people. > > Louis Proyect > Marxism mailing list: http://www.marxmail.org/ Far more often than by the literate, I would almost guarantee. If the revolution was socialist, the illiteracy wasn't going to last for long. Macdonald

[L-I] Re:Svetlana to Moderation team

2001-01-20 Thread Macdonald Stainsby
Ugh. I hate the word "boss". It's sufficient grounds for suicide. I am a co-moderator. Two women- Yoshie Furuhashi and Mine Aysen Doyran- are my co-moderators. I speak clearly because I already know they agree to these points and I merely received your message first. Bilenkin was dumped "unanimous

[L-I] Russian officials boycott George W. Bush's inauguration celebration in Moscow

2001-01-20 Thread Macdonald Stainsby
strana.ru January 19, 2001 Russian officials boycott George W. Bush's inauguration celebration in Moscow It has become known to Strana.Ru that there is a maturing opinion among the invited leading Russian representatives of the presidential administration and the government to boycott the recept

Re: [L-I] Re: Socialist Democracy at Home and Abroad

2001-01-20 Thread LROBERTS46
I have many friends who are supporters of the PRD. Many Californians and trade unionists support them. But the PRD was criticized for not supporting the Zapatistas clearly enough. Some Mexican friends of mine state that the leadership of the PRD were former PRI folks. Yes, I would say that

[L-I] Re: ïÔ×ÅÔ: To moderators from Russia-to Louis Proyect

2001-01-20 Thread Tony Abdo
Let me see if I have all this right? Johannes wanted Vladimir off list, with Steve and Owen off? Nestor wants Vladimir on, but Steve and Owen off.Mark is not a list moderator, yet assures us that certain folk shall not return.And Lou is against having people use the word illiterat

RE: [L-I] Re: oTWET: To moderators from Russia -to Louis Proyect

2001-01-20 Thread Mark Jones
Tony: > Mark is not a list moderator, yet assures us that > certain folk shall not return. I'm not a moderator so can't keep people off the list. Those who have left all seem to be highly active (fissile, in some cases) on other lists, so anyone wanting to debate them still can. >what about th

[L-I] Ответ: [L-I] Re:Svetlana to Moderation team

2001-01-20 Thread Svetlana Baiborodova
>I like you Tony. But it ain't gonna happen. >The mistake was waiting so long that all of these characters got comfortable. Beyond >that, as far as Bilenkin goes, he was only partially removed because of his >endorsement of racist filth against US Blacks. >I am a co-moderator. Two women- Yoshie F

Re: [L-I] Any translators? This from another list...

2001-01-20 Thread Alexander Domrin
Yeah, but it might be a pseudonym too - in the best traditions of Lenin-Trotsky-Stalin... Have a nice weekend, Alexander At 12:36 PM 1/20/2001 -0300, you wrote: >En relación a Re: [L-I] Any translators? This from another list, >el 20 Jan 01, a las 5:46, Macdonald Stainsby dijo: > >> > Sincerel

Re: [L-I] Illiterate blacks

2001-01-20 Thread Alexander Domrin
There is a tendency on this list to give a highly sophisticated explanation to often ordinary events. The question is NOT about problems of education in the U.S. The question is did "they" REALLY provide free transportation to poorly educated voters to get their votes? Or did "they" NOT? Is it T

[L-I] Baiborodova-Bilenkin-Myers-Shein

2001-01-20 Thread Alexander Domrin
I wonder why Svetlana is so upset because of Bilenkin's expulsion only and not about expulsion of Myers. In the end, it was Myers who arranged a tour to England and somewhere else for Oleg Shein (Bilenkin would say, "bused literate Shein to Europe"), co-chairman of Defence of Labour trade union

RE: [L-I] oTWET: [L-I] Re:Svetlana to Moderation team

2001-01-20 Thread Mark Jones
Svetlana Baiborodova wrote: > > I go away, be happy! Svyetichka, this already your 5th or 6th curtain call, are you going or staying? Privyet, Mark ___ Leninist-International mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To change your options or unsubscribe go to

Re: [L-I] Re: oTWET: To moderators from Russia -to Louis Proyect

2001-01-20 Thread Carrol Cox
Mark Jones wrote: > Tony: > > >what about the general question of 'free speech'?Should > > it be limited in a 'free society'? > > This is a very interesting question. What did Lenin and/or Marx have to say about > it? Freedom of speech refers only to the use & abuse of state power. it is i

RE: [L-I] Re: oTWET: To moderators from Russia -to Louis Proyect

2001-01-20 Thread Mark Jones
Carrol Cox wrote: > > Freedom of speech refers only to the use & abuse of > state power. it is irrelevant in the present context. Damn, and here was I hoping to drag Lenin into it somehow. You're right of course. As ever. Mark ___ Leninist-Internati

Re: [L-I] Baiborodova-Bilenkin-Myers-Shein

2001-01-20 Thread Mine Aysen Doyran
Racist Bilenkin & secterian Myers had no positive business here. The decision was made in the interest off all. There is no reason to occupy ourselves with dead horse topics. Let's move on, comrades!!! co-moderator Mine Alexander Domrin wrote: > I wonder why Svetlana is so upset because of B

RE: [L-I] Baiborodova-Bilenkin-Myers-Shein

2001-01-20 Thread Mark Jones
> I wonder why Svetlana is so upset because of Bilenkin's expulsion only > and not about expulsion of Myers. A very interesting question. Ho-hum, I suppose we shall never know, know that Svyeta has *gone*. Mark ___ Leninist-International mailing lis

[L-I] Re: [L-I] Re: ïÔ×ÅÔ: To moderators from Russia -to Louis Proyect

2001-01-20 Thread LROBERTS46
SIUE ___ Leninist-International mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To change your options or unsubscribe go to: http://lists.wwpublish.com/mailman/listinfo/leninist-international

[L-I] Re: [L-I] Re: ïÔ×ÅÔ: To moderators from Russia -to Louis Proyect

2001-01-20 Thread LROBERTS46
SEIU unfortunately uses Alinsky organizing like UFW does. We ___ Leninist-International mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To change your options or unsubscribe go to: http://lists.wwpublish.com/mailman/listinfo/leninist-international

[L-I] Re: [L-I] Re: ïÔ×ÅÔ: To moderators from Russia -to Louis Proyect

2001-01-20 Thread LROBERTS46
SEIU unfortunately uses Alinsky organizing methods. This goes back for some time to Sweeney. UFW uses then also as does ACORN. We have been critical of it for a long time and the racism and sexism that goes with it. (White males usually ran things with women and folks of color at the bottom