Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-21 Thread Justin Richer
John, what you've described is more or less manual registration as it stands today. But with Dynamic Registration and an open registration endpoint, a smartphone client (for instance) actually *can* be a confidential client now. It can store runtime secrets, and can therefore protect a client_s

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-20 Thread John Bradley
Dynamic registration provides: 1 A client_id 2 (Optionally) a client secret that is used at the token endpoint per OAuth. to authenticate the associated client_id 3 a URI that can be used to update the client_id (this is a REST concept and may be thought of as a instance of client_id rather than

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-20 Thread John Bradley
Dynamic registration provides: 1 A client_id 2 (Optionally) a client secret that is used at the token endpoint per OAuth. to authenticate the associated client_id 3 a URI that can be used to update the client_id (this is a REST concept and may be thought of as a instance of client_id rather than

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-20 Thread Phil Hunt
Phil On 2013-05-20, at 8:45, Justin Richer wrote: > > On 05/17/2013 07:29 PM, Phil Hunt wrote: >> He's saying every client gets a registration token and a client token. > What's a "client token", exactly? There are three potential places for OAuth > tokens in and around dynamic registration,

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-20 Thread Justin Richer
On 05/17/2013 07:29 PM, Phil Hunt wrote: He's saying every client gets a registration token and a client token. What's a "client token", exactly? There are three potential places for OAuth tokens in and around dynamic registration, and none of them are called "client token". 1) The registra

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-18 Thread Phil Hunt
John Thanks. This is *very* helpful. I will consider for next week. Phil On 2013-05-17, at 23:56, John Bradley wrote: > From what I have seen deployed, there are four common flows for registration. > > 1 2 developer uses a tool to register a client ID and place that in the > client code for

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-18 Thread John Bradley
From what I have seen deployed, there are four common flows for registration. 1 2 developer uses a tool to register a client ID and place that in the client code for deployment of a native App that is distributed via an app store for a 3rd party API. The developer may later need to make change

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread John Bradley
From what I have seen deployed, there are four common flows for registration. 1 2 developer uses a tool to register a client ID and place that in the client code for deployment of a native App that is distributed via an app store for a 3rd party API. The developer may later need to make change

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Phil Hunt
John, Thanks for jumping in. 1. I do buy the implied argument that some client credential types do expire (eg. bearer assertions). Therefore the expiry issue has to be dealt with. I would prefer to handle this by allowing an exception whereby expired assertions could be used to re-register (

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Donald F Coffin
-Original Message- From: Phil Hunt [mailto:phil.h...@oracle.com] Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 12:01 PM To: Donald F Coffin Cc: Mike Jones; oauth@ietf.org Subject: Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10 That is incorrect. A client

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Mike Jones
. -- Mike From: Phil Hunt [mailto:phil.h...@oracle.com] Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 2:57 AM To: Mike Jones Cc: oauth@ietf.org WG Subject: Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10 Or, are you saying reg access token is

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Phil Hunt
; From: Mike Jones [mailto:michael.jo...@microsoft.com] > Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2013 3:27 PM > To: Phil Hunt; oauth@ietf.org WG > Subject: Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access > Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10 > > This is nothing more than an

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Donald F Coffin
michael.jo...@microsoft.com] Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2013 3:27 PM To: Phil Hunt; oauth@ietf.org WG Subject: Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10 This is nothing more than an RFC 6750 bearer token. These can expire, as explained in

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread John Bradley
1 No reasonable security profile is going to let you use the same symmetric password over long time periods. It will be brute forced given enough time. The rotation time will depend on entropy and the rate an attacker can submit attempts.I would expect profiles to look at SP-800-63 for gu

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Phil Hunt
Justin, Your reason was you copied connect. Ok. I was looking for a technical reason. A security reason. BTW. Mike Jones says expiry wasn't the reason. Phil @independentid www.independentid.com phil.h...@oracle.com On 2013-05-17, at 9:01 AM, Justin Richer wrote: > The separation betw

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Justin Richer
The separation between these two is necessary: Not all clients have client_secret, and you want the lifecycle/management of the registration to be protected. This is what the registration access token was made for. In older versions of Connect's registration, the client_secret was forced on all

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Phil Hunt
resent the client's registration. > > -- Mike > > From: Phil Hunt > Sent: 5/17/2013 9:53 AM > To: Mike Jones > Subject: Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access > Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10 > > Well why not just use the client toke

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-16 Thread Mike Jones
-boun...@ietf.org [mailto:oauth-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Phil Hunt Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2013 2:35 PM To: oauth@ietf.org WG Subject: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10 All, In the dynamic registration draft, a new token ty

[OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-16 Thread Phil Hunt
All, In the dynamic registration draft, a new token type is defined called the "registration access token". Its use is intended to facilitate clients being able to update their registration and obtain new client credentials over time. The client credential is issued on completion of the initia