Since 1993, margin debt has grown more than three times faster than household
debt and overall credit market debt. During the second quarter of 1999
alone, margin debt ballooned by 13 percent. The Financial Markets Center's
web site has posted a new page on margin borrowing that features comm
I resign.
Michael Perelman wrote:
> Henry, although Max's comments were not very constructive, they do not merit
> this sort of response. I do not want to see the list devoted to this
> nastiness.
>
> I meant it that I wanted this stuff to stop. If you persist, I will have to
> request that yo
Just when I start deleting msgs instead of saving most of them, I need
something I deleted!
There is someone who is organizing a protest in SF claiming that cars and
drivers are being slighted, while bikes and pedestrians get all the resources.
I want to write a letter to the Chronicle and would
Hopefully this won't get lost in the flood on nonsense that has been flowing
the past few days.
A month or so ago, someone posted a quote from some congressman who said
that he knew there was no crisis in Social Security, but he could say
that publicly because no one would believe him. I would l
"Max B. Sawicky" wrote:
> I have a unique escape from these tedious debates on how many
> zillions were cruelly exterminated at the hands of fascism,
> communism, or imperialism. I simply disclaim support for
> any of them and try to live different. It's not that hard,
> actually.
>
> just my
.. . . The last sentence demonstrates the worthlessness of
his chosen method. The error range (97,808,000) is larger than his
"estimate" (61,911,000). I don't have to be a statistician to know that
when your estimate is smaller than your error range, your method is about
as good as a ouija board
I wrote:
>So what are socialist goals? Under capitalism, my short list includes (not
>necessarily in order of importance):
>
>* Defending workers against the attacks by their employers
>
>* Trying to get a _good deal_ out of economic growth, gaining wages that
>rise with or faster than labor-pro
You foks picked up on the first quote from Reinhardt that I posted, but
you haven't said anything about the second one.
How does Reinhardt put a value on the time people spend on the phone
with the clerks at the HMO begging and pleading for payment? Is it
efficient, in his terms that the HM
Archie Brown fought in Spain with the Abraham Lincoln Brigade, later went
undergound in the US, and was a member of the ILWU.
Sam Pawlett wrote:
> Michael Yates wrote:
> >
> > The section of the Taft-Hartley law which forced union officers to sign
> > oaths that they were not communists was stru
Brad misses my point. My point is that the deaths in Indonesia -- see his own
quote below -- need to be attributed to liberal U. S. capitalism. Along with
those in other places I mentioned. But Brad seems to treat them as bad behavior
of the Suharto regime, with no connection to American milita
>And no piece of rotting carrion has the right to put *any* words into my
>mouth for *any* purpose whatsoever.
>Brad DeLong
Have a care now. I maintain a strictly kosher household.
Louis Proyect
(http://www.panix.com/~lnp3/marxism.html)
Would it surprise you to learn that I have downloaded and printed the
online version of Dr. Rummel's tome, Lethal Politics? I don't know if it is
the same as the printed version, but I assume, since it is linked to his
academic website, that old Doc Rummel wouldn't have allowed it to go up if
it d
The Hong Kong Standard - July 21, 1999
Jiang says rural poverty is threat to security
STORY: BEIJING: President Jiang Zemin has called on the
ruling Communist
Party to return to its roots and ease rural poverty by 2000
as a matter of
national security.
> >And no piece of rotting carrion has the right to put *any* words into my
> >mouth for *any* purpose whatsoever.
> >Brad DeLong
>
>Have a care now. I maintain a strictly kosher household.
>
Louis Proyect
touché...
Jim:
I am fully aware of the contxt of your post in reponse to a neo-liberal
economists ratning.
Henry
"Craven, Jim" wrote:
> In response to Henry's note about Pol Pot, if indeed it was a reference to
> my reference to Pol Pot, let me add a note of clarification. My reference to
> Pol Pot, whi
Brad De Long wrote:
> ... Since Rummel is the only person to undertake a serious,
> comprehensive study of this century's many oceans of blood--any
> look at governments in the century as a whole has to start from his
> work.
>
> footnote 1/Some of the es
.. . .
Special thanks to Max S. I know that he is chomping at the bits to
participate in the flaming. His humor is especially effective in
stirring up peoples' worst instincts. Yet, he has shown admirable
restraint.
>>
Why my dear fellow. I have no desire to participate in
this unseemly brouh
DeLong:
I'm *very* tired of being deliberately lied about by things that I wouldn't
let into the compost heap.
Well, Michael, have you quit?
"Henry C.K. Liu" wrote:
> An sample of DeLong's you know what (towards Gene Coyle):
>
> A suggestion: wouldn't it be good if you would read a little befor
I had written: >>The point is not to make a virtue of necessity: repression
of independent trade unions in China, for example, might be necessary from
the point of view of promoting economic growth there (and winning the
battle of international trade), but that doesn't mean that socialists
should
Henry, although Max's comments were not very constructive, they do not merit
this sort of response. I do not want to see the list devoted to this
nastiness.
I meant it that I wanted this stuff to stop. If you persist, I will have to
request that you take a break from pen-l.
"Henry C.K. Liu" wr
An sample of DeLong's you know what (towards Gene Coyle):
A suggestion: wouldn't it be good if you would read a little before you
post? It does help keep you from looking *really* *stupid*.
Brad DeLong
Yes, Michael, you need to moderate all the posts, not just selectively.
We Chinese have declar
An example of MBS restraint:
mbs
[ just a sessile sucker on a tentacle of international unionism ]
An example of Henry's heaving heavily:
No, Yes.
Rod Hay wrote:
> Henry: Do you deliberately garble what people have to say, or do you just
> not take the time to read things carefully?
>
An exa
It is time to put the record straight and to expose this tiresome propaganda on
Pol Pot.
The Khmer Rouge, Communist guerrilla movement in Cambodia, was founded in 1963
by
Pol Pot. The organization engaged in guerrilla warfare against the government
of
Prince Norodom Sihanouk and later the CIA i
I want to remind PEN-L'ers that DeLong has a tendency to use false figures
in order to scandalize postcapitalist governments. He really doesn't come
up with them himself but relies on the work of highly dubious sources such
as Rudy Rummel. For example, Rummel asserts that the USSR was guilty of
mo
Brad,
What are you some kind of missionary or something? I mean, what's the
point, just how much of the US left misses Stalin or Pol Pot anyhow?
Steve
On Wed, 21 Jul 1999, Brad De Long wrote:
> >
> >Why my dear fellow. I have no desire to participate in
> >this unseemly brouhaha of brutish
No, Yes.
Rod Hay wrote:
> Henry: Do you deliberately garble what people have to say, or do you just
> not take the time to read things carefully?
>
> Rod Hay
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> The History of Economic Thought Archives
> http://socserv2.mcmaster.ca/~econ/ugcm/3ll3/index.html
> Batoche Books
>
In the current issue of CHALLENGE, Kevin Stiroh, and economist at the NY
Fed, writes that
"Increasing globalization, deregulation, and computerization are all in
some sense transitional processes; that is, if they continue, the world
eventually will be a single market with completely free trade,
For those of you who may not know who RM is:
Roderick MacFarquhar (Ph.D., London School of Economics, 1981)
Roderick MacFarquhar is the Leroy B. Williams Professor of History and Political
Science and former Director of the John King Fairbank Center for East Asian
Research. His publications incl
>
>Why my dear fellow. I have no desire to participate in
>this unseemly brouhaha of brutish, ill-mannered badinage.
>I prefer to reserve my pasquinades for the ears of the
>cultivated. Better to contemplate the supernal oneness,
>the music of the spheres, the lives of the saints.
>Or last nite'
Both Brad and Henry have written that they have been treated abusively.
Both are correct. We cannot keep going over our past hurts if we are
going to stop this. Just stop now!
--
Michael Perelman
Economics Department
California State University
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Chico, CA 95929
530-898-5321
fa
Good God! An economist that cannot count or add.
DeLong's stream of consciousness:
(A) Frist, no data avialabe, so 30 million murdered by Mao in the GLP sounds
right because of China rejected "free" markets.
(B) Communist systems never keep data.
(C) 30 years from now, a Chinese K. will releas
.. . .
The point is not to make a virtue of necessity: repression of independent
trade unions in China, for example, might be necessary from the point of
view of promoting economic growth there (and winning the battle of
international trade), but that doesn't mean that socialists should
apologize
In response to Henry's note about Pol Pot, if indeed it was a reference to
my reference to Pol Pot, let me add a note of clarification. My reference to
Pol Pot, which I should have clarified, was a reference to the vulgar or
propagandized view and the attribution to Pol Pot personally for all the
>I want to remind PEN-L'ers that DeLong has a tendency to use false figures
>in order to scandalize postcapitalist governments. He really doesn't come
>up with them himself but relies on the work of highly dubious sources such
>as Rudy Rummel. For example, Rummel asserts that the USSR was guilty o
>>> Rob Schaap <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 07/21/99 04:12PM
Blokes like Giddens write whole (unreadable) books about 'structuration'
(we author our structures, which author us etc etc), but wassit mean? I
mean it sounds right, but how do you use it?
((
Charles: Yea Rob, we need some way to
[apologies for duplicates through cross-posting]
Subject: KPFA TO BE BROADCAST LIVE OVER INTERNET To: "undisclosed-recipients:;"
KPFA TO BE BROADCAST LIVE OVER INTERNET
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Contact: Sameer Parekh 650 812 9400x134> 510 291 2283
Within the next few days, KPFA programmers will
Teach , brother !
Charles Brown
>>> "Craven, Jim" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 07/21/99 02:46PM >>>
I prefer to think of the Summers types, the neoliberal globalists, as the
neo-Eichmanns. They are the technicians and ideological
theoreticians/apologists of death of innocents while keeping their hands
>Are there still political provisions in American labor law or law in
>general? The anti-communist charter of T-H was an appendage to the Smith
>Act, no?
I'm no lawyer, but my recollection is that the anti-communist affidavit
provision was in Taft-Hartley itself, not the Smith Act.
Getting T-H
>Brad De Long tells us frequently of
>
>>horrible crimes committed in the name of Reason or Utopia?
>
> But he doesn't notice, it seems to me, horrible crimes committed by the
>ideolog[ue]s at home, e. g. >crimes in Indonesia...
>
>Gene Coyle
What I said, at:
http://econ161.berkeley.edu/TC
I am sick and tired of this renewed sniping. Henry did not cast the
first stone in this round, but he has been heaving heavily ever since.
The debate started out very promising. How do we understand the
contradictory nature of China? -- as Louis P. seems to be suggesting.
It is like the role o
Different people seek medical care for different reasons. A number of people
are so alone that they seek medical attention as the only attention that society
will give them. Others, shy away from medical care, but that sometimes
increases costs as well. Universal health care needs to be coupled
No, seriously(?), I am only guessing that this has something to do with the
Cultural Revolution but the reference escapes me (not unlike 'struggle
sessions', re-education, and the ever popular PC which I always thought was
a RYM II joke about members of the PLP).
Ann ( also out of her depth)
Medically unnecessary and inappropriate car usually
refers to treatments prescribed by physicians, not
to those sought by patients. For example,
antibiotics to treat likely viruses, X-rays of
bones likely unfractured or, if fractured, not
requiring treatment, C-sections without
real justificatio
>>Uwe Reinhardt, a health-care economist at Princeton University, writes
that "Efficiency very often doesn't please consumers,"<<
Max wrote: >Now there's lots of reasons to criticize this point, but it
speaks to a welfare concept that is not fundamentally pitched to the
interests of capital, even
>>> Louis Proyect <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 07/21/99 02:43PM >>>
All of these societies are based on a contradiction. They are trying to
co-exist economically with a hostile capitalist world, while building a
just system. Not only do you have contradictions externally, there are
internal contradictions
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
>But a key criticism of the HMOs is that they take away decision-making
>power from the MDs, so that decisions aren't made with the patient's
>interest in mind.
Of course, a key criticism of fee-for-service medicine is that it gives
too
much power to MD's who fatten t
Max Sawicky wrote:
>
> ...In the U.S., if we universalized a system where health
> care was "free," we would see greater increases in the
> share of GDP devoted to health care.
If that were so our non-free health care would be less expensive, per
capita, than the free health care vended out by
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>Medically unnecessary" could span a wide
>range, from hypochondriacs who consume
>resources to no purpose whatsoever, to
>those in varying states of health who choose
>treatments with a very low probability of efficacy,
>partly because the decision to elect such treatmen
>>> Jim Devine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 07/21/99 01:28PM >>>
I would characterize the way in which the "superstructure" and the "base"
relate in the following terms, which sort of apes the "equilibrium
thinking" of economics: when the superstructure and base are in sync, there
is limited conflict be
>>
Hmmm... My view was that people hate going to the doctor--it takes a
lot of time, and it is scary at a pretty deep level--and thus that
the psychic cost of showing up at the doctor's office was already
(for most people) more than enough to put worries that free care
would be unnecessary and
Brad De Long tells us frequently of
horrible crimes committed in the name of Reason or Utopia?
But he doesn't notice, it seems to me, horrible crimes committed by
the ideologs at home, e. g. crimes in Indonesia, Mexico, Nicaragua, El
Salvador ($1 million a day for the military for years), G
Jim Devine:
>No, all that I really feel secure about knowing concerning China is very
>vague and so I stick to the level of principle.
The problem about arguing principles is that nobody learns anything except
what beliefs people live by. As soon as I am finished researching and
writing about Col
Today's (7/21/99) Wall Street Journal reports on how the U. S.
government is muscling Indonesia to protect the profits of U. S. power
companies such as Mission Energy, a subsidiary of Edison International,
parent of Southern California Edison.
Which way do you root on this one? If the strong
Brad De Long wrote:
> I'm out of my depth...
>
> Brad DeLong
As usual.
Henry C.K. Liu
Henry: Do you deliberately garble what people have to say, or do you just
not take the time to read things carefully?
Rod Hay
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
The History of Economic Thought Archives
http://socserv2.mcmaster.ca/~econ/ugcm/3ll3/index.html
Batoche Books
http://members.tripod.com/rodhay/batoche
>>
Uwe Reinhardt, a health-care economist at Princeton University, writes that
"Efficiency very often doesn't please consumers,"
That's because, like many mainstream economists, he confuses efficiency
with profitability for capitalist enterprises or the operations of "free
markets" (as in free tr
At 04:47 PM 7/21/99 -0400, you wrote:
>. . .
>The point is not to make a virtue of necessity: repression of independent
>trade unions in China, for example, might be necessary from the point of
>view of promoting economic growth there (and winning the battle of
>international trade), but that does
This is a great quote. Though Reinhardt, being in the
pocket of HMO industry, may define efficiency as
what maximizes HMO profits, my economics
textbook defines efficiency as "producing the
precisely the goods that consumers want"
(something like that anyway).
Ellen
[EMAIL PR
July 21, 1999
1:10 p.m. (PST)
PEN-Lers,
Here's the latest news on the Pacifica Foundation's hostile takeover at KPFA
radio in Berkeley. Please distribute widely. Thanks.
Seth
>From: Andrea Buffa <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>Jim Devine:
>>No, all that I really feel secure about knowing concerning China is very
>>vague and so I stick to the level of principle.
Louis wrote: >The problem about arguing principles is that nobody learns
anything except what beliefs people live by. <
Louis, you quoted me out of context. W
>I prefer to think of the Summers types, the neoliberal globalists, as the
>neo-Eichmanns. They are the technicians and ideological
>theoreticians/apologists of death of innocents while keeping their hands
>"clean" from directly pulling the trigger. They have as much death on their
>hands as any P
>>> Doug Henwood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 07/21/99 11:15AM >>>
(A). I'm not willing to go all the way with this analysis, because I
think there's some salvageable value to the bourgeois subject, but
still, the BS effaces a lot of what it depends on, like the
exploitation of the proles and the mar
Oh, now I see where you guys are coming from.
But frankly, aren't you understating the the magnitude and probability of downside
risk of liberal (pseudo autonomous subject) practice ? I mean how can you ignore WWI
and WWII , for example ? The Viet Nam war ? and many more ? The U.S. liberal b
>>Howdy y'all
>>
>>Whilst on holiday in Finland I have been reading Irving Louis Horowitz's
>>latest book, "Behemoth: Main Currents in the History and Theory of Political
>>Sociology" (Transaction, 1999)...
>
>
>Is it worth reading? Would you recommend it?
>
>Brad DeLong
Yes to both questions. I
And didn't the AFL-CIO remove its anti-communist provisions from its constitution
within the last few years ?
Charles Brown
>>> Michael Yates <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 07/21/99 09:44AM >>>
The section of the Taft-Hartley law which forced union officers to sign
oaths that they were not communists was
-Original Message-
From: Brad De Long [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 1999 12:09 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [PEN-L:9438] My Ideologies
>
>
>Brad, for us ignorati could you briefly explain what belief in the
>"autonomous subject" entails and why you think it
Michael Yates wrote:
>
> The section of the Taft-Hartley law which forced union officers to sign
> oaths that they were not communists was struck down finally by the
> courts many years ago.
>
Thanks to Michael E and Michael Y for corrections on Taft-Hartley. Are
there still political provision
>
>
>Brad, for us ignorati could you briefly explain what belief in the
>"autonomous subject" entails and why you think it is false?
>
>
>Bill
That I have a very hard time believing that my deep opinions, my
views, my tastes and preferences are in any sense "mine", or
constitutive of "me" in a
>>Uwe Reinhardt, a health-care economist at Princeton University, writes
that "Efficiency very often doesn't please consumers,"<<
Max wrote: >Now there's lots of reasons to criticize this point, but it
speaks to a welfare concept that is not fundamentally pitched to the
interests of capital, even
I prefer to think of the Summers types, the neoliberal globalists, as the
neo-Eichmanns. They are the technicians and ideological
theoreticians/apologists of death of innocents while keeping their hands
"clean" from directly pulling the trigger. They have as much death on their
hands as any Pol
> >>
>Uwe Reinhardt, a health-care economist at Princeton University, writes that
>"Efficiency very often doesn't please consumers,"
>
>That's because, like many mainstream economists, he confuses efficiency
>with profitability for capitalist enterprises or the operations of "free
>markets" (as in
Henry wrote:
"What do we do with white mice that eat black cats?
Answer: Put them through creative destruction."
Without getting involved in these exchanges over the PRC etc., I would like
to have the above explained to me, please?
Ann
>>
No you wouldn't.
mbs
Louis wrote: >I think part of the problem in writing about China is that is
one of the most complex political questions of the 20th century. A
socialist revolution was made based on the peasantry rather than the
working-class. Mao understood the need to take this route since the
working-class was
Brad De Long wrote:
>
>To which of my ideologies are you referring?
>
>(A) My--ideological--belief that the liberal ideological commitment
>to the autonomous subject is a good (although false) stance to adopt
>because it is less likely than other stances to lead to horrible
>crimes committed i
'slamming' (not to be confused with 'churning'?) is I think what this is
called and of course, is illegal. so much for the 'public interest'...
Ann
- Original Message -
From: Ellen Frank <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, July 19, 1999 11:32 AM
Subject: [PEN-L:92
I wrote:>> Materialists shouldn't ignore constitutions entirely, since they
do help structure actual government practice, but I don't think the most
important Marxist questions of class power can be answered by examining
constitutions.<<
Henry writes: >Constitutions are important. A constitution
Henry wrote:
"What do we do with white mice that eat black cats?
Answer: Put them through creative destruction."
Without getting involved in these exchanges over the PRC etc., I would like
to have the above explained to me, please?
Ann
- Original Message -
From: Brad De Long <[EMA
Charles writes: >Without disagreeing with Jim D.'s generally couselling
critical thinking and a grain of salt in reading official statements and
constitutions, it struck me that he is pointing to the lack of
correspondence between superstructure and infrastructure here; whereas,
historical materia
>(A) My--ideological--belief that the liberal ideological commitment
>to the autonomous subject is a good (although false) stance to adopt
>because it is less likely than other stances to lead to horrible
>crimes committed in the name of Reason or Utopia?
Brad, for us ignorati could you briefl
Uwe Reinhardt, a health-care economist at Princeton University, writes that
"Efficiency very often doesn't please consumers,"
That's because, like many mainstream economists, he confuses efficiency
with profitability for capitalist enterprises or the operations of "free
markets" (as in free tr
From World Socialst Web Site
US warplanes continue killing in Iraq
Seventeen dead, eighteen injured near Najaf
By Martin McLaughlin
21 July 1999
Use this version to print
The section of the Taft-Hartley law which forced union officers to sign
oaths that they were not communists was struck down finally by the
courts many years ago.
michael yates
Sam Pawlett wrote:
>
> Henry C.K. Liu wrote:
> >
> > The differences are fiundamental.
> >
> > Ideologically, capitalis
>Brad De Long wrote:
>
>>
>>To which of my ideologies are you referring?
>>
>>(A) My--ideological--belief that the liberal ideological commitment
>>to the autonomous subject is a good (although false) stance to
>>adopt because it is less likely than other stances to lead to
>>horrible crimes co
Summers redux? Here's a quote from Uwe Reinhardt, Princeton, a leading
health-care economist:
A Wall St. Journal article on Tuesday, July 20th reports that many
managed care patients have nowhere to go for after-hours care except
emergency rooms. That has the drawbacks of long waits, hours in s
On Tuesday, July 20, 1999 at 20:40:50 (-0700) Brad De Long writes:
>>Brad De Long wrote:
>>
>>>Maybe I'm hopelessly old-fashioned, but I had always thought of
>>>"ideology" as something different from "knowledge"
>>
>>Which just proves you're in the grip of ideology!
>>
>>Doug
>
>To which of my i
Henry writes: >I agree that for the US, where the prospect of a socialist
system replacing capitalism is practically nil in the forseeable future,
labor unism by and large have a progressive role to play.<
it's a good sign when someone is willing to change his mind about such
important issues. S
-- Forwarded message --
Date: Tue, 20 Jul 1999 04:34:21 -1000
From: Gerard Greenfield <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Discussions on the Socialist Register and its articles
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Vietnam: The collapse of nationalised coal production
Brad De Long wrote:
> >"Henry C.K. Liu" wrote:
> >
> > > Devine attacks China for opposing capitalist unions.
> > > He defends Harry Wu, even after he has been given some basic facts.
> > > He wants to promote Western democracy in socialist China.
> > > He buys into all the propaganda slanderin
What do we do with white mice that eat black cats?
Answer: Put them through creative destruction.
Henry C.K. Liu
Brad De Long wrote:
> >Brad De Long wrote:
> >
> >>Maybe I'm hopelessly old-fashioned, but I had always thought of
> >>"ideology" as something different from "knowledge"
> >
> >Which
Sam,
I agree that for the US, where the prospect of a socialist system replacing
capitalism is practically nil in the forseeable future, labor unism by and large
have a progressive role to play.
I am not all together with you in your attitude of the state in a scoialist
country. The Chinese gove
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