Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-31 Thread Sabri Oncu
How many troops does the Arab League have and how many of them can they afford to send to Iraq? And who is going to pay for them? -- Yoshie Yoshie, As an old saying goes: Follow your own path, let the Americans talk! Sabri

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-31 Thread dmschanoes
Follow your own path, let the Americans talk! Sabri Last time I checked, I was classified as an American, as are thousands, hundreds of thousands, maybe millions who demonstrate their complete opposition to US military and economic occupation, and the possibilities of proxy

U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-31 Thread Charles Brown
From: Doug Henwood Who opposes U.S. withdrawal from Iraq? ^^^ Charles: Is this unanimous ? Madamechair I support the motion. Call for unanimous consent. Any objection ? Hearing none .. The position of the Communist Workers Party - and apparently that of many Iraqis - is for a

U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-30 Thread Charles Brown
From: Bill Lear Let me get this right: since only 1,000 out of 24 million came out for a very vocal demonstration, that shows how cowed they are; therefore,10,000 in the U.S., keeping proportions constant, shows the same thing? ^^ CB: Aren't a lot of Americans cowed ? ( As in standing

U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-30 Thread Charles Brown
It probably would have taken a civil war (i.e. chaos) for Iraqis to overthrow Saddam. Would those who now oppose U.S. withdrawal from Iraq because it will lead to civil war have opposed a revolt against the Baathists ? Charles

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-30 Thread Doug Henwood
Charles Brown wrote: It probably would have taken a civil war (i.e. chaos) for Iraqis to overthrow Saddam. Would those who now oppose U.S. withdrawal from Iraq because it will lead to civil war have opposed a revolt against the Baathists ? Who opposes U.S. withdrawal from Iraq? The position of

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-30 Thread Yoshie Furuhashi
At 12:08 PM -0500 3/30/04, Doug Henwood wrote: a UN force without the U.S. to replace the U.S. Who do they think will contribute the troops to make up a UN force without the US? -- Yoshie * Bring Them Home Now! http://www.bringthemhomenow.org/ * Calendars of Events in Columbus:

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-30 Thread Devine, James
Doug Henwood wrote: a UN force without the U.S. to replace the U.S. Yoshie asks: Who do they think will contribute the troops to make up a UN force without the US? the Arab League has been mentioned... JD

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-30 Thread dmschanoes
___ QA certified-- quality guaranteed by TA Inc. - Original Message - From: Devine, James [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 5:52 PM Subject: Re: [PEN-L] U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper Doug Henwood wrote: a UN force without

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-30 Thread Yoshie Furuhashi
Doug Henwood wrote: a UN force without the U.S. to replace the U.S. Yoshie asks: Who do they think will contribute the troops to make up a UN force without the US? the Arab League has been mentioned... JD How many troops does the Arab League have and how many of them can they afford to send to

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-30 Thread Yoshie Furuhashi
Is this the same Arab League whose summit just collapsed or is this a different Arab League? * No lost sleep over the postponed summit By Danny Rubinstein The Palestinian leadership was not especially disappointed yesterday when it learned of the postponement of the Arab summit conference

U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper (Milan Rai on UN occupation of Iraq)

2004-03-29 Thread Yoshie Furuhashi
polls of Iraqis to reflect Iraqi opinions accurately, for Iraqis can't speak their minds freely: * U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper By Bassem Mroue, Associated Press Writer Published: March 29, 2004 BAGHDAD, Iraq (AP) The U.S.-led coalition on Sunday shut down a weekly newspaper run

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper (Milan Rai on UN occupation of Iraq)

2004-03-29 Thread Doug Henwood
demonstrating in front of U.S. troops: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper By Bassem Mroue, Associated Press Writer Published: March 29, 2004 This is what happens when an Iraqi journalist expresses his opinion, said the white-turbaned Darraja. What is happening now is what used to happen during

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper (Milan Rai on UN occupation of Iraq)

2004-03-29 Thread Yoshie Furuhashi
At 1:06 PM -0500 3/29/04, Doug Henwood wrote: Under such conditions, you can't trust any Western opinion polls of Iraqis to reflect Iraqi opinions accurately, for Iraqis can't speak their minds freely: They don't seem shy about expressing their opinions to reporters for foreign wire services or

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper (Milan Rai on UN occupation of Iraq)

2004-03-29 Thread Bill Lear
On Monday, March 29, 2004 at 13:16:10 (-0500) Yoshie Furuhashi writes: ... Yes, more than 1,000 supporters of cleric Muqtada al-Sadr demonstrated peacefully, but that is a tiny minority in the nation of 24,683,313 (July 2003 est., http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/iz.html), and

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper (Milan Rai on UN occupation of Iraq)

2004-03-29 Thread Louis Proyect
Bill Lear wrote: Let me get this right: since only 1,000 out of 24 million came out for a very vocal demonstration, that shows how cowed they are; therefore, 10,000 in the U.S., keeping proportions constant, shows the same thing? I don't think the issue is whether you can protest in the streets in

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper (Milan Rai on UN occupation of Iraq)

2004-03-29 Thread Yoshie Furuhashi
On Monday, March 29, 2004 at 13:16:10 (-0500) Yoshie Furuhashi writes: Yes, more than 1,000 supporters of cleric Muqtada al-Sadr demonstrated peacefully, but that is a tiny minority in the nation of 24,683,313 (July 2003 est., http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/iz.html), and even

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper (Milan Rai on UN occupation of Iraq)

2004-03-29 Thread Doug Henwood
Bill Lear wrote: On Monday, March 29, 2004 at 13:16:10 (-0500) Yoshie Furuhashi writes: ... Yes, more than 1,000 supporters of cleric Muqtada al-Sadr demonstrated peacefully, but that is a tiny minority in the nation of 24,683,313 (July 2003 est.,

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-29 Thread Yoshie Furuhashi
At 2:49 PM -0500 3/29/04, Louis Proyect wrote: I don't think the issue is whether you can protest in the streets in Iraq. Obviously you can. This is not exactly Pinochet's Chile, although down the road it might come to that. It is really more a question of determining what Iraqis think about the

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper

2004-03-29 Thread Yoshie Furuhashi
Bill, you're trying to reason, which is often a dead end. Even though half of Baghdadis polled expressed dislike of Bush and Blair and thought the U.S. was after their oil, and almost a fifth expressed support for attacks on U.S. forces, their expression of worry about what might happen (e.g.

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper (Milan Rai on UN occupation of Iraq)

2004-03-29 Thread Devine, James
In response to Yoshie, Bill Lear wrote: Let me get this right: since only 1,000 out of 24 million came out for a very vocal demonstration, that shows how cowed they are; therefore, 10,000 in the U.S., keeping proportions constant, shows the same thing? Saith Doug ironically, Bill, you're

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper (Milan Rai on UN occupation of Iraq)

2004-03-29 Thread DMS
At the risk of overposting: Those who express ambivalence or reluctant support for the US occupation of Iraq are practicing a form of less-evilism. And like all forms of lesser evilism, this one is based on self-delusion. To be precise-- the delusion is that somehow someway the actions of the

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper (Milan Rai on UN occupation of Iraq)

2004-03-29 Thread Louis Proyect
Devine, James wrote: As for the fear of what might happen if US forces pulled out, I think there's a very good reason to trust the poll results. People are almost always afraid of what will happen if the state (in this case, the US armed forces) goes away. This is not just about whether to trust

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper (Milan Rai on UNoccupation of Iraq)

2004-03-29 Thread Carrol Cox
DMS wrote: So a question, and I won't bother you about this again: When US fatalities increase to 10 or 20 a day from the current 1 or 2, when every shopping mall is filled with SUVs saying bring them home, when every Senator questions our course in Iraq because of the increasing

Re: U.S.-Led Coalition Shuts Down Iraq Paper (Milan Rai on UN occupation of Iraq)

2004-03-29 Thread michael
Jim, you are an excellent psychologist. I have been busy all day and have not been able to wade through the entire thread, but I think that everything has already been said. I suspect that we have pushed Chechnyia as far as we usefully can. Devine, James wrote: (I can understand it if