FW: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-26 Thread Glen Parker
Tom Lane wrote: >Personally I don't think that this is a "transitional issue" and we will >someday all be happy in upper-case-only-land. Upper-case-only sucks, >by every known measure of readability, and I don't want to have to put up >with a database that forces that 1960s-vintage-hardware minds

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Robert Treat
On Saturday 24 April 2004 09:21, Shachar Shemesh wrote: > Robert Treat wrote: > >Oh well... let's see if we can find a way to support both... > > You are welcome to join the other leg of this thread, then. That one is > not CCed to advocacy, as it is 100% technical. > I'm already there... Robert

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Stephan Szabo
On Sat, 24 Apr 2004, Shachar Shemesh wrote: > Stephan Szabo wrote: > > >Are we going to get rid of the current behavior entirely? > > > I doubt that will be a good idea. You want to let applications created > for previous versions of PostgreSQL continue to work. The idea, I think, > is to have eit

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Shachar Shemesh
Robert Treat wrote: IMHO apps that apply quoted identifiers willy nilly are busted anyway, Not really. Sometimes the app itself will be very consistent, never applying quotes, but an underlying driver will always apply quotes. The result is a mixed behaviour. There is nothing you or me can do a

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Robert Treat
On Saturday 24 April 2004 08:09, Shachar Shemesh wrote: > Robert Treat wrote: > > Anyone who has studied software useability will > >know that uppercase should, in general, be avoided as it hurts > > readability. > > You convinced me! let's change the SQL standard. > We plan to, right after we h

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Shachar Shemesh
Robert Treat wrote: On Saturday 24 April 2004 01:23, Shachar Shemesh wrote: Tom Lane wrote: PS: I resisted the temptation to SET THIS MESSAGE IN ALL UPPER CASE to make the point about readability. But if you want to argue the point with me, I'll be happy to do that for the rest of the thr

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Robert Treat
On Saturday 24 April 2004 01:23, Shachar Shemesh wrote: > Tom Lane wrote: > >PS: I resisted the temptation to SET THIS MESSAGE IN ALL UPPER CASE > >to make the point about readability. But if you want to argue the > >point with me, I'll be happy to do that for the rest of the thread. > > Yes, it's

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Shachar Shemesh
Stephan Szabo wrote: [ Tom, we know your opinion on the first part of the next paragraph, so you don't need to reply to that part. ;) ] Are we going to get rid of the current behavior entirely? I doubt that will be a good idea. You want to let applications created for previous versions of Postgr

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Dave Page
> -Original Message- > From: Stephan Szabo [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: 24 April 2004 08:43 > To: Shachar Shemesh > Cc: Tom Lane; Robert Treat; Dennis Bjorklund; Bruce Momjian; > PostgreSQL-development; PostgreSQL advocacy > Subject: Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefe

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Stephan Szabo
On Sat, 24 Apr 2004, Shachar Shemesh wrote: > Tom Lane wrote: > >So what I'm holding out for is a design that lets me continue to see the > >current behavior if I set a GUC variable that says that's what I want. > > > >This seems possible (not easy, but possible) if we are willing to > >require th

[HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-23 Thread Shachar Shemesh
Tom Lane wrote: Personally I don't think that this is a "transitional issue" and we will someday all be happy in upper-case-only-land. Upper-case-only sucks, by every known measure of readability, and I don't want to have to put up with a database that forces that 1960s-vintage-hardware mindset o