On 2014-10-06 06:59, Ivan Herman wrote:
> Of course, I could expect a Web technology related crows to use HTML
source editing directly but the experience by Daniel and myself with the
World Wide Web conference(!) is that people do not want to do that.
(Researchers in, say, Web Search have prove
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
> One problem with allowing HTML submission is ensuring that reviewers can
> correctly view the submission as the authors intended it to be viewed. How
> would you feel if your paper was rejected because one of the reviewers could
> not view portions of it? At
Luca Matteis writes:
> On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 4:34 PM, Ivan Herman wrote:
>> The real problem is still the missing tooling. Authors, even if technically
>> savy like this community, want to do what they set up to do: write their
>> papers as quickly as possible. They do not want to spend their t
Sarven Capadisli writes:
> I will bet that if the requirements evolve towards Webby submissions, within
> 3-5 years time, we'd see a notable change in how we collect, document and mine
> scientific research in SW. This is not just being "hopeful". I believe that if
> all of the newcomers into the
On 10/6/14 7:43 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
I don't believe that HTML is a good authoring format any more than PDF
is. I don't think see this as huge problem. HTML needs to be part of the
tool-chain, not all of it.
+1
--
Regards,
Kingsley Idehen
Founder & CEO
OpenLink Software
Company Web: http:
Hello,
My apologies if this is a repost (errors were encountered and my last post
bounced from the listserv)...
On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 1:19 PM, Luca Matteis wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 4:34 PM, Ivan Herman wrote:
> > The real problem is still the missing tooling. Authors, even if
> technic
On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 2:39 PM, Mark Diggory wrote:
> Hello Community,
>
> On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 1:19 PM, Luca Matteis wrote:
>
>> On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 4:34 PM, Ivan Herman wrote:
>> > The real problem is still the missing tooling. Authors, even if
>> technically savy like this community, wa
Hello Community,
On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 1:19 PM, Luca Matteis wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 4:34 PM, Ivan Herman wrote:
> > The real problem is still the missing tooling. Authors, even if
> technically savy like this community, want to do what they set up to do:
> write their papers as quickl
Frankly I don't see the reason for the hate on PDF files.
I do a lot of reading on a tablet these days because I can take it to the
gym or on a walk or in the car. Network reliability is not universal when
I leave the house (even if I had a $10 a GB LTE plan) so downloaded PDFs
are my document fo
On 10/06/2014 04:15 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
One problem with allowing HTML submission is ensuring that reviewers can
correctly view the submission as the authors intended it to be viewed. How
would you feel if your paper was rejected because one of the revie
On 10/06/2014 04:27 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
[On using htlatex for conferences.]
So, as well as providing a LNCS stylesheet, we'd need a htlatex cf.cfg,
and one CSS and it's done. Be good to have another CSS for on-screen
viewing; LNCS's back of a postage stamp is very poor for that.
Phil
I w
On 10/6/14 10:25 AM, Paul Houle wrote:
Frankly I don't see the reason for the hate on PDF files.
I do a lot of reading on a tablet these days because I can take it to
the gym or on a walk or in the car. Network reliability is not
universal when I leave the house (even if I had a $10 a GB LTE
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
> However, my point was not about looking good. It was about being able to see
> the paper in the way that the author intended.
Yes, I understand this. It's not something that I consider at all
important, which perhaps represents our different view points. Rea
On Mon, Oct 6, 2014 at 5:29 PM, Phillip Lord
wrote:
> Who cares what the authors intend? I mean, they are not reading the
> paper, are they?
Authors might have adjusted things that way specifically to deliver
their message. I think being able to have consistent layouts *as the
authors intend it*
This is an incredibly rich and interestingly conversation. I think there
are two separate themes:
1. What is required and/or asked-for by the conference organizers...
a. ...that is needed for the review process
b. ...that is needed to implement value-added services for the conference
c. ...that con
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
> I would be totally astonished if using htlatex as the main way to produce
> conference papers were as simple as this.
>
> I just tried htlatex on my ISWC paper, and the result was, to put it mildly,
> horrible. (One of my AAAI papers was about the same, the ot
On 10/06/2014 08:38 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
I would be totally astonished if using htlatex as the main way to produce
conference papers were as simple as this.
I just tried htlatex on my ISWC paper, and the result was, to put it mildly,
horrible. (One of m
On 10/06/2014 08:29 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
However, my point was not about looking good. It was about being able to see
the paper in the way that the author intended.
Yes, I understand this. It's not something that I consider at all
important, which perh
Dear Peter,
please show me how to query PDFs with SPARQL. Then I'll believe there
are no benefits of XHTML+RDFa over PDF.
Addressing the issue from the reviewer perspective only is too narrow,
don't you think?
Martynas
On Mon, Oct 6, 2014 at 6:08 PM, Peter F. Patel-Schneider
wrote:
>
>
> On 1
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
>> It does MathML I think, which is then rendered client side. Or you could
>> drop math-mode straight through and render client side with mathjax.
>
> Well, somehow png files are being produced for some math, which is a failure.
Yeah, you have to tell it to do
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
>> Who cares what the authors intend? I mean, they are not reading the
>> paper, are they?
>
> For reviewing, what the authors intend is extremely important. Having
> different rendering of the paper interfere with the authors' message is
> something that should
On 10/6/14 11:39 AM, John Erickson wrote:
This is an incredibly rich and interestingly conversation. I think
there are two separate themes:
1. What is required and/or asked-for by the conference organizers...
a. ...that is needed for the review process
b. ...that is needed to implement value-add
It's not hard to query PDFs with SPARQL. All you have to do is extract the
metadata from the document and turn it into RDF, if needed. Lots of programs
extract and display this metadata already.
No, I don't think that viewing this issue from the reviewer perspective is too
narrow. Reviewers
On 10/06/2014 09:28 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
It does MathML I think, which is then rendered client side. Or you could
drop math-mode straight through and render client side with mathjax.
Well, somehow png files are being produced for some math, which is a fai
Following the same logic, we still could have been using paper
submissions? All you have to do is to scan them to turn them into
PDFs.
It's been a while since I was in the university, but wasn't
dissemination an important part of science? What about "dogfooding"
after all?
Martynas
On Mon, Oct
On 10/06/2014 09:32 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
Who cares what the authors intend? I mean, they are not reading the
paper, are they?
For reviewing, what the authors intend is extremely important. Having
different rendering of the paper interfere with the author
I would be much more generic here,
show me how to query a bunch of PDFs with anything... of course, the answer
will go like "you can extract the text and do A and the B and then get a
relatively decent text depending on A B and C". then someone else will
chime in and say "and this is just because
"It's not hard to query PDFs with SPARQL. All you have to do is extract
the metadata from the document and turn it into RDF, if needed. Lots of
programs extract and display this metadata already."
in the age of the web of data why should I restrict my search just to
metadata? I want the full con
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
> On 10/06/2014 09:28 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
>> "Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
It does MathML I think, which is then rendered client side. Or you could
drop math-mode straight through and render client side with mathjax.
>>>
>>> Well, somehow png
I don't think that scanning a printout retains any metadata that was in the
electronic source so, no, this would not follow using the same logic.
I do agree that dissemination of results is one of the most important parts of
the scientific process. The argument here is, I think, what is the be
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
> On 10/06/2014 09:32 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
>> "Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
Who cares what the authors intend? I mean, they are not reading the
paper, are they?
>>>
>>> For reviewing, what the authors intend is extremely important. Having
>>>
Sure. So extract the text from the PDF and query that. It also would be nice
to have access to the LaTeX sources.
What HTML publishing *might* have that is better than the above is to more
easily embed some extra information into papers that can be queried. Is this
just metadata that could
On 10/6/14 12:48 PM, Peter F. Patel-Schneider wrote:
It's not hard to query PDFs with SPARQL. All you have to do is
extract the metadata from the document and turn it into RDF, if
needed. Lots of programs extract and display this metadata already.
Peter,
Having had 200+ (some-non-rdf-doc} t
querying PDFs is NOT simple and requires a lot of work -and usually
produces lots of errors. just querying metadata is not enough. As I said
before, I understand the PDF as something that gives me a uniform layout.
that is ok and necessary, but not enough or sufficient within the context
of the web
On 10/06/2014 10:44 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
On 10/06/2014 09:28 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
It does MathML I think, which is then rendered client side. Or you could
drop math-mode straight through and render client side wit
On 10/06/2014 11:00 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
On 10/06/2014 09:32 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
Who cares what the authors intend? I mean, they are not reading the
paper, are they?
For reviewing, what the authors intend is ex
On 10/06/2014 11:00 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
On 10/06/2014 09:32 AM, Phillip Lord wrote:
"Peter F. Patel-Schneider" writes:
Who cares what the authors intend? I mean, they are not reading the
paper, are they?
For reviewing, what the authors intend is ex
On 10/06/2014 11:03 AM, Kingsley Idehen wrote:
On 10/6/14 12:48 PM, Peter F. Patel-Schneider wrote:
It's not hard to query PDFs with SPARQL. All you have to do is extract the
metadata from the document and turn it into RDF, if needed. Lots of programs
extract and display this metadata already
> Luca Matteis writes:
> On Mon, Oct 6, 2014 at 5:29 PM, Phillip Lord wrote:
>> Who cares what the authors intend? I mean, they are not reading the
>> paper, are they?
> Authors might have adjusted things that way specifically to deliver
> their message. I think being able to have
15th International Conference on Web Engineering (ICWE)
Rotterdam, the Netherlands | June 22-26, 2015
http://icwe2015.webengineering.org/
IMPORTANT DATES
* Abstract submission: February 05, 2015 (23h59 Hawaii Time)
* Full paper submission: February 12, 2015 (23h59 Hawaii Time)
* Paper notificat
On 10/6/14 2:19 PM, Alexander Garcia Castro wrote:
querying PDFs is NOT simple and requires a lot of work -and usually
produces lots of errors.
Yes, I believe I indicated that in my response to Peter i.e., it isn't
simple or productive.
just querying metadata is not enough.
Yes, I said th
Greetings.
On 2014 Oct 6, at 19:19, Alexander Garcia Castro wrote:
> querying PDFs is NOT simple and requires a lot of work -and usually
> produces lots of errors. just querying metadata is not enough. As I said
> before, I understand the PDF as something that gives me a uniform layout.
> that
Sorry to jump into this once again but when it comes to typesetting
nothing really comes close to Latex/PDF:
http://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/120271/alternatives-to-latex -
not even HTML/CSS/JavaScript
On Tue, Oct 7, 2014 at 12:18 AM, Norman Gray wrote:
>
> Greetings.
>
> On 2014 Oct 6, at
Neat. This could be extended to putting a full table of contents into the
metadata, and in lots of other ways. The other nice thing about it is that it
would be possible to push the same data through a LaTeX to HTML toolchain for
those who want HTML output.
peter
On 10/06/2014 03:18 PM, Nor
On 10/6/14 2:49 PM, Peter F. Patel-Schneider wrote:
On 10/06/2014 11:03 AM, Kingsley Idehen wrote:
On 10/6/14 12:48 PM, Peter F. Patel-Schneider wrote:
It's not hard to query PDFs with SPARQL. All you have to do is
extract the
metadata from the document and turn it into RDF, if needed. Lots
Hi Adobe lurkers,
Kingsley has just handed you a valuable means to keep users tied to your
technologies:
On 10/6/2014 8:18 PM, Kingsley Idehen wrote:
On 10/6/14 2:49 PM, Peter F. Patel-Schneider wrote:
On 10/06/2014 11:03 AM, Kingsley Idehen wrote:
On 10/6/14 12:48 PM, Peter F. Patel-Schn
* Luca Matteis [2014-10-07 00:41+0200]
> Sorry to jump into this once again but when it comes to typesetting
> nothing really comes close to Latex/PDF:
> http://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/120271/alternatives-to-latex -
> not even HTML/CSS/JavaScript
Making a floating model look like Latex/PD
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