Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3003 - Python Language Moratorium

2009-11-07 Thread Stephen J. Turnbull
~b ea2499da0911051453n3569387aj581ad4acf5b79...@mail.gmail.com 4222a8490911051521r1b9c8165id6e0f12d62da0...@mail.gmail.com ca471dc20911051526u7f3642ecg19e4eb73bcca1...@mail.gmail.com bbaeab100911051535g68cefa18kdadea33f78de9...@mail.gmail.com

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of the Buildbot fleet and related bugs

2009-11-07 Thread Glyph Lefkowitz
On Nov 6, 2009, at 6:34 PM, Georg Brandl wrote: R. David Murray schrieb: So, overall I think the buildbot fleet is in good shape, and if we can nail issue 6748 I think it will be back to being an important resource for sanity checking our checkins. Yay! Thanks to all of you! Indeed! It's

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3003 - Python Language Moratorium

2009-11-07 Thread Glyph Lefkowitz
On Nov 6, 2009, at 4:52 PM, exar...@twistedmatrix.com wrote: On 09:48 pm, rdmur...@bitdance.com wrote: On Fri, 6 Nov 2009 at 15:48, Glyph Lefkowitz wrote: Documentation would be great, but then you have to get people to read the documentation and that's kind of tricky. Better would be

Re: [Python-Dev] Reworking the GIL

2009-11-07 Thread Baptiste Lepilleur
Hi Antoine, I was finally able to compile py3k and run the benchmark (my compilation issue was caused by checking out on Windows and compiling on Unix. Some Makefile templates are missing correct EOL properties in SVN I think). The benchmark results can be obtained from:

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3003 - Python Language Moratorium

2009-11-07 Thread exarkun
On 12:10 pm, s...@pobox.com wrote: Guido ... it's IMO pretty mysterious if you encounter this and don't Guido already happen to know what it means. If you require parens maybe it parses better: import (a or b or c) as mod Given that the or operator shortcuts I think that (a or b or

[Python-Dev] People want CPAN :-)

2009-11-07 Thread sstein...@gmail.com
On Nov 7, 2009, at 3:20 AM, Ben Finney wrote: Guido van Rossum gu...@python.org writes: On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 2:52 PM, David Lyon david.l...@preisshare.net wrote: I think buildbot-style test runs for PyPI packages would raise average package quality on PyPI. Please excuse the

Re: [Python-Dev] Reworking the GIL

2009-11-07 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello, Solaris X86, 16 cores: some python extension are likely missing (see config.log) Windows XP SP3, 4 cores: all python extensions but TCL (I didn't bother checking why it failed as it is not used in the benchmark). It is a release build. The results look promising but I let you share

Re: [Python-Dev] People want CPAN :-)

2009-11-07 Thread Jesse Noller
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 9:30 AM, sstein...@gmail.com sstein...@gmail.com wrote: On Nov 7, 2009, at 3:20 AM, Ben Finney wrote: Guido van Rossum gu...@python.org writes: On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 2:52 PM, David Lyon david.l...@preisshare.net wrote: I think buildbot-style test runs for PyPI

Re: [Python-Dev] People want CPAN :-)

2009-11-07 Thread sstein...@gmail.com
On Nov 7, 2009, at 10:08 AM, Jesse Noller wrote: On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 9:30 AM, sstein...@gmail.com sstein...@gmail.com wrote: On Nov 7, 2009, at 3:20 AM, Ben Finney wrote: Guido van Rossum gu...@python.org writes: On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 2:52 PM, David Lyon david.l...@preisshare.net

Re: [Python-Dev] Reworking the GIL

2009-11-07 Thread Guido van Rossum
Antoine, How close are you to merging this into the Py3k branch? It looks like a solid piece of work, that can only get better in the period between now and the release of 3.2. But I don't want to rush you, and I only have had a brief look at your code. (I whipped up a small Dave Beazley example

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3003 - Python Language Moratorium

2009-11-07 Thread Georg Brandl
exar...@twistedmatrix.com schrieb: On 12:10 pm, s...@pobox.com wrote: Guido ... it's IMO pretty mysterious if you encounter this and don't Guido already happen to know what it means. If you require parens maybe it parses better: import (a or b or c) as mod Given that the or

Re: [Python-Dev] Reworking the GIL

2009-11-07 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello Guido, How close are you to merging this into the Py3k branch? It looks like a solid piece of work, that can only get better in the period between now and the release of 3.2. But I don't want to rush you, and I only have had a brief look at your code. The code is ready. Priority

Re: [Python-Dev] Reworking the GIL

2009-11-07 Thread Guido van Rossum
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 9:01 AM, Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net wrote: Hello Guido, How close are you to merging this into the Py3k branch? It looks like a solid piece of work, that can only get better in the period between now and the release of 3.2. But I don't want to rush you, and I

Re: [Python-Dev] Reworking the GIL

2009-11-07 Thread Baptiste Lepilleur
2009/11/7 Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net [...] So, to sum it up, the way the current GIL manages to have good latencies is by issueing an unreasonable number of system calls on a contended lock, and potentially killing throughput performance (this depends on the OS too, because

Re: [Python-Dev] Reworking the GIL

2009-11-07 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello again, It shows that, on my platform for this specific benchmark: * newgil manage to leverage a significant amount of parallelism (1.7) where python 3.1 does not (3.1 is 80% slower) I think you are mistaken: -j0 (main thread only) newgil: 47.483s, 47.605s, 47.512s -j4

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3003 - Python Language Moratorium

2009-11-07 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Fri, 6 Nov 2009 09:05:17 am Guido van Rossum wrote: On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 9:35 AM, Guido van Rossum gu...@python.org wrote: I've checked draft (!) PEP 3003, Python Language Moratorium, into SVN. As authors I've listed Jesse, Brett and myself. I haven't seen substantial opposition

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3003 - Python Language Moratorium

2009-11-07 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Fri, 6 Nov 2009 08:46:00 pm Willem Broekema wrote: CLPython is in steady development, quite complete and stable on the language level (somewhere between 2.5 and 2.6), but missing most built-in library functionality. (It reuses the pure-Python parts of the stdlib.) As its developer, I

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3003 - Python Language Moratorium

2009-11-07 Thread John Arbash Meinel
... A moratorium isn't cost-free. With the back-end free to change, patches will go stale over 2+ years. People will lose interest or otherwise move on. Those with good ideas but little patience will be discouraged. I fully expect that, human nature being as it is, those proposing a

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3003 - Python Language Moratorium

2009-11-07 Thread Willem Broekema
On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 1:16 AM, Steven D'Aprano st...@pearwood.info wrote: Willem, the rationale for this PEP is to give alternative implementations the chance to catch up with CPython. Given your statement that CLPython is quite complete on the language level, but missing standard library