Chris Angelico writes:
> > (Technical note: for the convenience of implementors of 'for',
> > when iter is applied to an iterator, it always returns the
> > iterator itself.)
>
> That's not a mere technical detail - that's actually part of the
> definition of an iterator, namely
On Fri, May 15, 2020 at 7:23 PM Stephen J. Turnbull
wrote:
>
> Chris Angelico writes:
>
> > > (Technical note: for the convenience of implementors of 'for',
> > > when iter is applied to an iterator, it always returns the
> > > iterator itself.)
> >
> > That's not a mere technical
On Fri, May 15, 2020 at 5:37 AM Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Fri, May 15, 2020 at 7:23 PM Stephen J. Turnbull
> wrote:
> >
> > Chris Angelico writes:
> >
> > > I don't like this term "converted".
> >
> > I refuse to die on that hill. :-) Suggest a better term, I'll happily
> > use it until somet
On Thu, May 14, 2020 at 09:47:36AM -0700, Andrew Barnert wrote:
> On May 14, 2020, at 03:01, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> >
> > On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 10:41:06AM -0700, Andrew Barnert via Python-ideas
> > wrote:
> >
> >> I think in general people will expect that a slice view on a sequence
> >>
On 14/05/2020 19:56, Andrew Barnert wrote:
On May 14, 2020, at 10:45, Rhodri James
wrote:
On 14/05/2020 17:47, Andrew Barnert via Python-ideas wrote:
Which is exactly why Christopher said from the start of this
thread, and everyone else has agreed at every step of the way,
that we can’t change
On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 02:37:15PM +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> I think part of the problem is that people rarely see explicit
> iterator objects in the wild. Most of the time we encounter iterator
> objects only implicitly. Nomenclature *is* a problem (I still don't
> know what a "genera
On Wed, May 13, 2020 at 10:51:58AM -0700, Andrew Barnert via Python-ideas wrote:
> Students often want to know why this doesn’t work:
[snip example showing the difference between iterators which become
exhausted after iteration, and sequences that don't]
> The answer is that files are iterators
On Fri, May 15, 2020 at 12:17:56PM +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> Terrible example, since a glass is just a geologically slow liquid. ;-)
That's a myth :-)
The key test for a liquid is not whether is flows, since solids also
flow. (In solids, this usually happens very, very slowly, and is
On Fri, May 15, 2020 at 05:58:16AM -0400, Ricky Teachey wrote:
> Perhaps use the iter function name as the generic? "itered". As opposed to
> "iterated" or "iterated over".
>
> Example:
>
> "the statement below iterates over an iterator, itered from a sequence"
Or just avoid the issue:
"The st
On Thu, May 14, 2020, 11:20 PM Stephen J. Turnbull
> > I can teach a child why a glass will break permanently when you hit
> > it while a lake won’t by using the words “solid” and “liquid”.
>
> Terrible example, since a glass is just a geologically slow liquid. ;-)
>
It isn't though. I used to
On 16/05/20 12:26 am, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
Arguments over the precise definition of states of matter are, to some
degree, futile. I've seen amorphous solids described as "liquids that
don't flow" and non-Newtonian liquids described as "solids that flow".
I think this just shows that nature d
Here's an article about recent research:
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Oops, try again;
Here's an article about recent research. I found it fascinating.
https://www.quantamagazine.org/ideal-glass-would-explain-why-glass-exists-at-all-20200311/
It starts: Glass is anything that’s rigid like a crystal, yet made of
disordered molecules like a liquid. To understand why
TL;DR: no need to come to consensus about the most "Pythonic" API for a
sequence view -- due to potential name clashes, adding a dunder is pretty
much the only option.
Details below:
On Fri, May 15, 2020 at 3:50 AM Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> I think lst.view[10:20] fits that bill.
>
> Have we fo
I think maybe some of the trouble here, particularly in teaching is the
word "is" (in English, not the Python keyword).
As in:
"A file object IS and iterator"
and
"A zip object IS an iterator"
I know in OO parlance, "is a" can be used to designate subclassing (or an
appropriate use for it) and i
A
> > different method/property/class/function that gives you iterators
> > would be fine.
>
> We already have such. It's called itertools.islice().
>
If you had read the proposal, you’d know that was brought up, obviously.
I'm sorry, but you're missing the point here. You and Christopher see
On May 14, 2020, at 20:17, Stephen J. Turnbull
wrote:
>
> Andrew Barnert writes:
>
>> Students often want to know why this doesn’t work:
>> with open("file") as f:
>> for line in file:
>> do_stuff(line)
>> for line in file:
>> do_other_stuff(line)
>
> Sure.
On May 15, 2020, at 03:50, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>
> On Thu, May 14, 2020 at 09:47:36AM -0700, Andrew Barnert wrote:
>>> On May 14, 2020, at 03:01, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>>>
>> Which is exactly why Christopher said from the start of this thread,
>> and everyone else has agreed at every step
On May 15, 2020, at 13:03, Christopher Barker wrote:
>
> Taking all that into account, if we want to add "something" to Sequence
> behavior (in this case a sequence_view object), then adding a dunder is
> really the only option -- you'd need a really compelling reason to add a
> Sequence metho
On May 14, 2020, at 20:01, Stephen J. Turnbull
wrote:
>
> Executive summary:
>
> AFAICT, my guess at what's going on in the C tokenizer was exactly
> right. It greedily consumes as many non-operator, non-whitespace
> characters as possible, then validates.
Well, it like like it’s not quite
On Fri, May 15, 2020 at 5:45 PM Andrew Barnert wrote:
> On May 15, 2020, at 13:03, Christopher Barker wrote:
> >
> > Taking all that into account, if we want to add "something" to Sequence
> behavior (in this case a sequence_view object), then adding a dunder is
> really the only option -- you'd
On May 15, 2020, at 18:21, Christopher Barker wrote:
>
>> On Fri, May 15, 2020 at 5:45 PM Andrew Barnert wrote:
>
>> On May 15, 2020, at 13:03, Christopher Barker wrote:
>> >
>> > Taking all that into account, if we want to add "something" to Sequence
>> > behavior (in this case a sequence_v
On May 15, 2020, at 18:21, Christopher Barker wrote:
>
> Hmm, more thought needed.
Speaking of “more thought needed”, I took a first pass over cleaning up my
quick&dirty slice view class and adding the slicer class, and found some
bikesheddable options. I think in most cases the best answer is
On Fri, May 15, 2020 at 01:00:09PM -0700, Christopher Barker wrote:
> I know you winked there, but frankly, there isn't a clear most Pythonic API
> here. Surely you do'nt think PYhton should have no methods?
That's not what I said. Of course Python should have methods -- it's an
OOP language aft
On Fri, May 15, 2020 at 05:44:59PM -0700, Andrew Barnert wrote:
> Once you go with a separate view-creating function (or type), do we even need
> the dunder?
Possibly not. But the beauty of a protocol is that it can work even if
the object doesn't define a `__view__` dunder.
- If the object de
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