Re: Community (A Modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 10:10 PM, Cameron Simpson wrote: > Python advocacy seems to be by example, not cheerleading. +1 QOTW -- Stephen Hansen ... Also: Ixokai ... Mail: me+list/python (AT) ixokai (DOT) io ... Blog: http://meh.ixokai.io/ signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature --

Re: Community (A Modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
I call bullshit. The Python community is vibrant, accessible, and willing to endure far more then anyone has any right to expect when people come to it for help. The community seems willing to explain fundamental concepts to newbies over, and over, and over again; to go out of their way, time and

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 8:22 PM, Gregory Ewing wrote: > Terry Reedy wrote: > >> Would it be possible to write a program that converts a module that >> uses ctypes to interface to a dll to a corresponding C extension >> program that would compile to a drop in replacement extension module? > > Probably, but I d

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 8:34 PM, Gregory Ewing wrote: > lkcl wrote: > >> * in neither gtk nor qt does there exist an "auto-layout" widget >> that's equivalent to putting some DOM objects into a , >> to "flow" widgets that wrap around. > > You essentially seem to be complaining here that pqyqt and > pygtk ar

Re: Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real world programming ?

2010-06-12 Thread Antti "Andy" Ylikoski
13.6.2010 7:02, Antti "Andy" Ylikoski kirjoitti: 12.6.2010 22:54, Pascal J. Bourguignon kirjoitti: bolega writes: [PAIP] Is there anything in this old norvig book that makes it worth pursuing as a text ? Yes. I agree with his criticism that the book is "old", mine stems from the year 1

Re: safer ctype? (was GUIs - A modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 8:42 PM, Gregory Ewing wrote: > Stephen Hansen wrote: > >> Its one thing for Python to make available foot-shooting tools(this is >> good! I love ctypes, with care) for the developer, its another thing >> entirely for it to shoot at the ground in the normal course of its >> operation an

Re: safer ctype? (was GUIs - A modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 8:26 PM, Gregory Ewing wrote: >> On Jun 12, 6:05 pm, Stephen Hansen wrote: > >>> A programming goof, oversight or unexpected event causes an exception. >>> It doesn't cause a buffer overflow. > > The important thing here isn't so much the exception as > the *traceback*. > > When you'

Re: Community (A Modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Aahz
In article <8d93f1e1-1c49-4abc-832c-5501b6109...@a16g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, rantingrick wrote: > >I will bring some positive attitudes to this group if it's the last >thing i do! "Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mo

Re: Community (A Modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Cameron Simpson
On 12Jun2010 20:09, rantingrick wrote: | I think the Python community is broken. I think we don't really "have" | a community. It's more like a handful of negitive people at the top | and every one else is chopped liver. Hmm. I think this is an overreaction. I must be chopped liver myself, though

Re: math.erfc OverflowError

2010-06-12 Thread geremy condra
On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 11:05 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 15:49:37 -0700, geremy condra wrote: > >> In Python3.2, calling math.erfc with a value in [-27.2, -30) raises an >> OverflowError: math range error. This is inconsistent with the erfc >> function from scipy (scipy.speci

Printing forms and labels in Python

2010-06-12 Thread Monte Milanuk
Hello, I'm still a relative newbie to python, so I apologize if this is covered in detail somewhere and I missed it. I have a program or two that I want to work on once I get more proficient with python and sqlite and tkinter/wxpython. One of the big 'features' of those programs I want to m

Re: Community (A Modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Ben Finney
Jack Diederich writes: > In various threads you haven't met the minimum qualifications to be > taken seriously: you have contributed no code, don't even bother to > use something that looks like a real name, and continually demand that > volunteers (which we all are) write code to fulfill your sp

Re: Community (A Modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread James Mills
On Sun, Jun 13, 2010 at 1:57 PM, Jack Diederich wrote: > On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 11:09 PM, rantingrick wrote: >> >> - >>  Where is the community? >> - > [snip] [snip] > In various threads you haven't met the minimum qualifications to be > taken se

Re: Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real world programming ?

2010-06-12 Thread Antti "Andy" Ylikoski
12.6.2010 22:54, Pascal J. Bourguignon kirjoitti: bolega writes: [PAIP] Is there anything in this old norvig book that makes it worth pursuing as a text ? Yes. I agree with his criticism that the book is "old", mine stems from the year 1992. I bought and studied the Russell-Norvig b

Re: Community (A Modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Jack Diederich
On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 11:09 PM, rantingrick wrote: > > - >  Where is the community? > - [snip] > > You people need to get a life, drop your narcissistic attitudes and be > more helpful, friendly, and welcoming to the wider world. This > community i

Re: safer ctype? (was GUIs - A modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Gregory Ewing
Stephen Hansen wrote: Its one thing for Python to make available foot-shooting tools(this is good! I love ctypes, with care) for the developer, its another thing entirely for it to shoot at the ground in the normal course of its operation and hope it doesn't blow off any big toes. :) I would h

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread Gregory Ewing
lkcl wrote: * in neither gtk nor qt does there exist an "auto-layout" widget that's equivalent to putting some DOM objects into a , to "flow" widgets that wrap around. You essentially seem to be complaining here that pqyqt and pygtk are not HTML. They have their own auto-layout mechanisms th

Re: safer ctype? (was GUIs - A modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Gregory Ewing
On Jun 12, 6:05 pm, Stephen Hansen wrote: A programming goof, oversight or unexpected event causes an exception. It doesn't cause a buffer overflow. The important thing here isn't so much the exception as the *traceback*. When you've been programming in Python for a while, it's easy to forg

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread Gregory Ewing
Terry Reedy wrote: Would it be possible to write a program that converts a module that uses ctypes to interface to a dll to a corresponding C extension program that would compile to a drop in replacement extension module? Probably, but I don't see how that could be done automatically in a way

Community (A Modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread rantingrick
- Where is the community? - I think the Python community is broken. I think we don't really "have" a community. It's more like a handful of negitive people at the top and every one else is chopped liver. Just today i saw another chance to contribu

Re: math.erfc OverflowError

2010-06-12 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 15:49:37 -0700, geremy condra wrote: > In Python3.2, calling math.erfc with a value in [-27.2, -30) raises an > OverflowError: math range error. This is inconsistent with the erfc > function from scipy (scipy.special.erfc) as well as with the C99 > function by the same name, bo

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Pyro 4.0 released

2010-06-12 Thread Irmen de Jong
Pyro 4.0 - I'm extremely pleased to announce the release of Pyro 4.0! This is the first official release of the new incarnation of Pyro. What is Pyro? - PYthon Remote Objects provides a very easy way of remote communication between python objects somewhere in a network. It en

Re: Python ctypes / pywin32 [was: GUIs - A Modest Proposal]

2010-06-12 Thread Martin v. Loewis
Am 12.06.2010 19:59, schrieb Stephen Hansen: On 6/12/10 8:57 AM, lkcl wrote: On Jun 10, 6:26 pm, "Martin v. Loewis" wrote: It must be possible to remove it from a Python installation, as long as that's not an official policy statement that ctypes will, at some point in the future, be remov

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread Martin v. Loewis
Would it be possible to write a program that converts a module that uses ctypes to interface to a dll to a corresponding C extension program that would compile to a drop in replacement extension module? If implemented at all, I think the ctypes implementation itself could do that. I.e. create al

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread Martin v. Loewis
Am 12.06.2010 17:33, schrieb Stephen Hansen: On 6/12/10 12:21 AM, Martin v. Loewis wrote: Otherwise it makes certain windows-workarounds very problematic. You basically /have/ to write a C extension :| That's not problematic at all, for the standard library. Just write that C extension. Come

Re: safer ctype? (was GUIs - A modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Martin v. Loewis
ok... analogy: when using g++ to compile c++ code, would you place use of "asm" statements into the same sort of foot-shooting category? In a slightly different way, yes. There is no way of disabling inline assembly in g++, so the analogy is not fully appropriate. However, IIUC, using inlin

Re: safer ctype? (was GUIs - A modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Martin v. Loewis
Notice that it's not (only) the functions itself, but also the parameters. It's absolutely easy to crash Python by calling a function through ctypes that expects a pointer, and you pass an integer. The machine code will dereference the pointer (trusting that it actually is one), and crash. wha

Re: math.erfc OverflowError

2010-06-12 Thread geremy condra
On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 4:40 PM, Robert Kern wrote: > On 2010-06-12 17:49 , geremy condra wrote: >> >> In Python3.2, calling math.erfc with a value in [-27.2, -30) raises >> an OverflowError: math range error. This is inconsistent with the >> erfc function from scipy (scipy.special.erfc) as well a

Re: simple chat server

2010-06-12 Thread Burakk
Thank you , now i can go on happy learning... :) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: math.erfc OverflowError

2010-06-12 Thread Robert Kern
On 2010-06-12 17:49 , geremy condra wrote: In Python3.2, calling math.erfc with a value in [-27.2, -30) raises an OverflowError: math range error. This is inconsistent with the erfc function from scipy (scipy.special.erfc) as well as with the C99 function by the same name, both of which return 2.

Re: Python ctypes / pywin32 [was: GUIs - A Modest Proposal]

2010-06-12 Thread Terry Reedy
On 6/12/2010 11:57 AM, lkcl wrote: On Jun 10, 6:26 pm, "Martin v. Loewis" wrote: ctypes is inherently unsafe. It must be possible to remove it from a Python installation, Which is to say, anyone who wants to remove it from *their* individual custom installation should be able to do so, wi

math.erfc OverflowError

2010-06-12 Thread geremy condra
In Python3.2, calling math.erfc with a value in [-27.2, -30) raises an OverflowError: math range error. This is inconsistent with the erfc function from scipy (scipy.special.erfc) as well as with the C99 function by the same name, both of which return 2. I suspect that this is the result of the cut

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread geremy condra
On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 10:32 AM, Terry Reedy wrote: > On 6/12/2010 3:21 AM, Martin v. Loewis wrote: >>> >>> Yeah. I get the policy in general, a proliferation of ctypes stuff could >>> be very bad -- but if code is very careful with type-checking and stuff, >>> it should be possible to get an exc

OFF TOPIC

2010-06-12 Thread Antti "Andy" Ylikoski
12.6.2010 21:06, George Neuner kirjoitti: On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 18:57:08 +0300, "Antti \"Andy\" Ylikoski" wrote: OT: (very Off Topic.) I would not trust dolphins to take care of my investments. Why not? Remember the chimpanzee that picked stocks and beat many professional fund m

MySQLdb and bits

2010-06-12 Thread Dafydd Hughes
Hi there This is my first post to the list - please forgive me if this has been addressed elsewhere. I'm running MySQL 32-bit in Snow Leopard, and had MySQLdb working well. I switched to 64-bit, rebuilt MySQLdb, and again it worked fine within Python, but had to switch back to 32 bit - I'm u

Re: Tkinter Toplevel sizing issue (using a grid)

2010-06-12 Thread Alf P. Steinbach
* random joe, on 12.06.2010 01:40: Hello all, Hi this i my first post here. I would like to create a tkinter toplevel window with a custom resize action based on a grid. From the Tk docs it say you can do this but for the life of me i cannot figure out how? In my app i wish for the main window t

Re: simple chat server

2010-06-12 Thread Thomas Jollans
On 06/11/2010 12:26 AM, Burakk wrote: > Hi, > > I am using ubuntu lucid and i have started to learn python(vrs 3.1). I > am trying to make a tutorial code(see below) work but when i run the > code, open a terminal window and connect as client with telnet and > type somethings and hit enter, give m

Re: __getattribute__ and methods proxying

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 12:59 PM, Giampaolo Rodolà wrote: > Clear, thanks. > Isn't there a prettier/common way to do this? > A __methodcall__(self, method_obj) special method or something? Has > something like that ever been proposed for inclusion? Not really, because that doesn't actually fit into the object

Re: safer ctype? (was GUIs - A modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 12:46 PM, lkcl wrote: > On Jun 12, 6:05 pm, Stephen Hansen wrote: >> Its one of the reasons why we *like* Python at my day job. (Though it >> applies to nearly any other high level language): its inherently safer. >> A programming goof, oversight or unexpected event causes an exception.

Re: __getattribute__ and methods proxying

2010-06-12 Thread Thomas Jollans
On 06/12/2010 09:59 PM, Giampaolo Rodolà wrote: > 2010/6/12 David Zaslavsky : >> Hi, >> >> The problem is that when you make this call: >>> proc.cmdline() >> there are really two steps involved. First you are accessing proc.cmdline, >> then you are calling it. You could think of it as this: >> fun

Re: Tkinter menu checkbutton not working

2010-06-12 Thread Dodo
Le 09/06/2010 20:37, rantingrick a écrit : On Jun 9, 12:20 pm, Dodo wrote: Le 09/06/2010 18:54, rantingrick a crit : On Jun 9, 11:26 am, Dodowrote: Hello, I trying to make this piece of code work (this is python3) from tkinter import * from tkinter.ttk import * class Window:

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 12, 7:29 pm, Terry Reedy wrote: > On 6/12/2010 9:26 AM, lkcl wrote: > > > [ye gods, i think this is the largest thread i've ever seen, > > For python-list, it is possibly the longest this year, but definitely > not of all time ;-) oh dearie me... > >   yep.  that's why i ported pyjamas,

Re: Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real world programming ?

2010-06-12 Thread nanothermite911fbibustards
On Jun 12, 1:14 pm, nanothermite911fbibustards wrote: > On Jun 12, 12:57 pm, p...@informatimago.com (Pascal J. Bourguignon) > wrote: > > > > > George Neuner writes: > > > On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 18:57:08 +0300, "Antti \"Andy\" Ylikoski" > > > wrote: > > > >>OT:  (very Off Topic.) > > >>I

Re: Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real world programming ?

2010-06-12 Thread nanothermite911fbibustards
On Jun 12, 12:57 pm, p...@informatimago.com (Pascal J. Bourguignon) wrote: > George Neuner writes: > > On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 18:57:08 +0300, "Antti \"Andy\" Ylikoski" > > wrote: > > >>OT:  (very Off Topic.) > >>I would not trust dolphins to take care of my investments. > > > Why not?  R

Re: Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real world programming ?

2010-06-12 Thread nanothermite911fbibustards
On Jun 12, 12:57 pm, p...@informatimago.com (Pascal J. Bourguignon) wrote: > George Neuner writes: > > On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 18:57:08 +0300, "Antti \"Andy\" Ylikoski" > > wrote: > > >>OT:  (very Off Topic.) > >>I would not trust dolphins to take care of my investments. > > > Why not?  R

Re: Tkinter Toplevel sizing issue (using a grid)

2010-06-12 Thread random joe
Hi again, Is this possible to do? From lack of response i don't know if this is impossible or just nobody has done this before. If anybody know solution thank you. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real world programming ?

2010-06-12 Thread Pascal J. Bourguignon
George Neuner writes: > On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 18:57:08 +0300, "Antti \"Andy\" Ylikoski" > wrote: > >>OT: (very Off Topic.) >>I would not trust dolphins to take care of my investments. > > Why not? Remember the chimpanzee that picked stocks and beat many > professional fund managers?

Re: __getattribute__ and methods proxying

2010-06-12 Thread Giampaolo Rodolà
2010/6/12 David Zaslavsky : > Hi, > > The problem is that when you make this call: >> proc.cmdline() > there are really two steps involved. First you are accessing proc.cmdline, > then you are calling it. You could think of it as this: >  func = proc.cmdline >  func() > __getattribute__ is able to

Re: Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real world programming ?

2010-06-12 Thread Pascal J. Bourguignon
bolega writes: > > > [PAIP] > > Is there anything in this old norvig book that makes it worth > pursuing as a text ? Yes. -- __Pascal Bourguignon__ http://www.informatimago.com/ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real world programming ?

2010-06-12 Thread Pascal Costanza
On 12/06/2010 19:36, bolega wrote: Is there anything in this old norvig book that makes it worth pursuing as a text ? http://norvig.com/paip.html This "old" book by Peter Norvig is still one of the best Common Lisp introductions you can find, and has some excellent material that is not cover

Re: WebBrowserProgramming [was: GUIs - A Modest Proposal]

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 12, 6:14 pm, Stephen Hansen wrote: > On 6/12/10 9:20 AM, lkcl wrote: > > >  there are _lots_ other options that i know of.  here are three of the > > best: > > [list of browser engines cut for brevity] > > Although I didn't state it or even hint at it, I thought it was implied > and obvio

Re: safer ctype? (was GUIs - A modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 12, 6:05 pm, Stephen Hansen wrote: > On 6/12/10 9:55 AM, lkcl wrote: > > > On Jun 12, 8:11 am, "Martin v. Loewis" wrote: > >> Notice that it's not (only) the functions itself, but also the > >> parameters. It's absolutely easy to crash Python by calling a function > >> through ctypes that

Re: __getattribute__ and methods proxying

2010-06-12 Thread exarkun
On 07:01 pm, g.rod...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I have a class which looks like the one below. What I'm trying to accomplish is to "wrap" all my method calls and attribute lookups into a "proxy" method which translates certain exceptions into others. The code below *apparently* works: the original met

Re: __getattribute__ and methods proxying

2010-06-12 Thread David Zaslavsky
Hi, The problem is that when you make this call: > proc.cmdline() there are really two steps involved. First you are accessing proc.cmdline, then you are calling it. You could think of it as this: func = proc.cmdline func() __getattribute__ is able to modify how the first step works, but not th

Re: Python ctypes / pywin32 [was: GUIs - A Modest Proposal]

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 12, 5:56 pm, Robert Kern wrote: > >   just because a library has a means for programmers to shoot > > themselves in the foot doesn't mean that the programming language > > should come with kevlar-reinforced bullet-proof vests. > > That's exactly why it's *in* the standard library, but also

Re: Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real world programming ?

2010-06-12 Thread Pascal Costanza
On 12/06/2010 19:36, bolega wrote: What was your main reason for picking the Allegro (commercial) as opposed to one of the open source ones ? Is there anything in this old norvig book that makes it worth pursuing as a text ? http://norvig.com/paip.html My favorite Common Lisp environment is L

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread Terry Reedy
On 6/12/2010 9:26 AM, lkcl wrote: [ye gods, i think this is the largest thread i've ever seen, For python-list, it is possibly the longest this year, but definitely not of all time ;-) yep. that's why i ported pyjamas, which was a web-only/browser-only UI toolkit, to the desktop. it's a

__getattribute__ and methods proxying

2010-06-12 Thread Giampaolo Rodolà
Hi, I have a class which looks like the one below. What I'm trying to accomplish is to "wrap" all my method calls and attribute lookups into a "proxy" method which translates certain exceptions into others. The code below *apparently* works: the original method is called but for some reason the "ex

Re: Deformed Form

2010-06-12 Thread Victor Subervi
On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 1:58 PM, Stephen Hansen wrote: > The only suggestion I have is: try dumping all the .pyc's. > Interestingly, ls -al reveals *no* *.pyc files. Yeah, that problem caught me once as well. TIA, beno -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: WebBrowserProgramming [was: GUIs - A Modest Proposal]

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 9:20 AM, lkcl wrote: > On Jun 10, 6:56 pm, Stephen Hansen wrote: > >> For example: if you want to embed a CSS-capable web-browser into your >> app? PyQT is actually your best option-- albeit a commercial one if >> you're not open source.. wx/Python haven't yet finished WebKit >> integr

Re: Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real world programming ?

2010-06-12 Thread George Neuner
On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 18:57:08 +0300, "Antti \"Andy\" Ylikoski" wrote: >OT: (very Off Topic.) >I would not trust dolphins to take care of my investments. Why not? Remember the chimpanzee that picked stocks and beat many professional fund managers? http://www.marketwatch.com/story/dar

Re: safer ctype? (was GUIs - A modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 9:55 AM, lkcl wrote: > On Jun 12, 8:11 am, "Martin v. Loewis" wrote: >> Notice that it's not (only) the functions itself, but also the >> parameters. It's absolutely easy to crash Python by calling a function >> through ctypes that expects a pointer, and you pass an integer. The >> mach

Re: Python ctypes / pywin32 [was: GUIs - A Modest Proposal]

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 8:57 AM, lkcl wrote: > On Jun 10, 6:26 pm, "Martin v. Loewis" wrote: >> It must be possible to remove it >> from a Python installation, > > as long as that's not an official policy statement that ctypes will, > at some point in the future, be removed from python, i'm happy. I believe

Re: Deformed Form

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 9:01 AM, Victor Subervi wrote: >> You're doing something that you're not telling us. There's something >> else going on. There's no way that form.getfirst() being in another file >> will in and of itself (notwithstanding possibilities of the second >> invocation actually not working at a

Re: Python ctypes / pywin32 [was: GUIs - A Modest Proposal]

2010-06-12 Thread Robert Kern
On 2010-06-12 10:57 , lkcl wrote: On Jun 10, 6:26 pm, "Martin v. Loewis" wrote: or PyGui would need to be implemented in terms of ctypes (which then would prevent its inclusion, because there is a policy that ctypes must not be used in the standard library). Is there? I wasn't aware of that

Re: Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real world programming ?

2010-06-12 Thread bolega
On Jun 12, 2:02 am, "Antti \"Andy\" Ylikoski" wrote: > 10.6.2010 23:14, bolega kirjoitti: > > > > > Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real > > world programming ? > > >http://wiki.alu.org/Implementation > > > Kindly pick one from commercial and one from open-source .

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread Terry Reedy
On 6/12/2010 3:21 AM, Martin v. Loewis wrote: Yeah. I get the policy in general, a proliferation of ctypes stuff could be very bad -- but if code is very careful with type-checking and stuff, it should be possible to get an exception, I'd hope. Only if you can live with the respective module no

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 12, 3:07 pm, Kevin Walzer wrote: > On 6/12/10 9:44 AM, lkcl wrote: > > >   that's not quite true - you can create a simple core which is easily > > extensible with third party contributions to create more comprehensive > > widgets. > > That's exactly the design philosophy of Tk: a small cor

Re: safer ctype? (was GUIs - A modest Proposal)

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 12, 8:11 am, "Martin v. Loewis" wrote: > > Got me thinking, is it perhaps doable to have a 'safe' ctype that is > > guaranteed to be in the stdlib? Perhaps crippling it in a sense that it > > only allows a known set of functions to be called? > > In some sense, a C module wrapping a select

WebBrowserProgramming [was: GUIs - A Modest Proposal]

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 10, 6:56 pm, Stephen Hansen wrote: > For example: if you want to embed a CSS-capable web-browser into your > app? PyQT is actually your best option-- albeit a commercial one if > you're not open source.. wx/Python haven't yet finished WebKit > integration(*). there are _lots_ other optio

Re: Deformed Form

2010-06-12 Thread Victor Subervi
On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 11:46 AM, Stephen Hansen wrote: > On 6/12/10 6:19 AM, Victor Subervi wrote: > > You will note those very first lines. This also addresses two other > > responders who believed perhaps I had called the variable from the form > in > > question more than once and that it had b

Re: Which is the best implementation of LISP family of languages for real world programming ?

2010-06-12 Thread Antti "Andy" Ylikoski
12.6.2010 13:04, vanekl kirjoitti: Antti "Andy" Ylikoski wrote: snip Maybe it could be a good idea for someone to write an academic study of all these available Lisp implementations. Even Interlisp still lives, as it was recently noted in this newsgroup. (I did not check the Google. Has someo

Python ctypes / pywin32 [was: GUIs - A Modest Proposal]

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 10, 6:26 pm, "Martin v. Loewis" wrote: > >> or PyGui would need to be implemented in terms of ctypes (which then > >> would prevent its inclusion, because there is a policy that ctypes > >> must not be used in the standard library). > > > Is there? I wasn't aware of that. What's the reason

Re: Deformed Form

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 6:19 AM, Victor Subervi wrote: > You will note those very first lines. This also addresses two other > responders who believed perhaps I had called the variable from the form in > question more than once and that it had been "used up/consummed" in the > first call. Here, the first call i

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
> That's the reason why it won't happen. Everybody asking for change is > not willing to lead the effort. Everybody who would be able and might be > willing to lead the change fails to see the need for change. *lol*. i don't know why, but i think that's so hilarious i might make it my .sig. it

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 9, 5:38 pm, rantingrick wrote: > Yes we need a leader. Someone who is not afraid of the naysayers. > Someone with Guido's vision. When the leader emerges, the people will > rally. ... Mahh? Whey'rus ma guuhhn? haww haww :) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 9, 5:16 pm, Ethan Furman wrote: > Gregory Ewing wrote: > > Kevin Walzer wrote: > >> PyGUI ... certainly is *not* a lightweight GUI toolkit that could > >> easily be incorporated into the Python core library--it instead has > >> rather complex dependencies on both other GUI toolkits and Pyth

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/12/10 12:21 AM, Martin v. Loewis wrote: >> Otherwise it makes certain windows-workarounds very problematic. You >> basically /have/ to write a C extension :| > > That's not problematic at all, for the standard library. Just write that > C extension. Come now, of course it is. It may not be p

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 9, 11:16 am, ant wrote: > And who are the beginning programmers going to turn into? If we do our > stuff right, Python programmers. If not, > Java or PHP or Visual Basic programmers. Or website designers. Or > worse (is there a worse?). yes - Java programmers who use COM under Win32 to c

Re: How do subprocess.Popen("ls | grep foo", shell=True) with shell=False?

2010-06-12 Thread Nobody
On Thu, 10 Jun 2010 08:40:03 -0700, Chris Seberino wrote: > On Jun 10, 6:52 am, Nobody wrote: >> Without the p1.stdout.close(), if the reader (grep) terminates before >> consuming all of its input, the writer (ls) won't terminate so long as >> Python retains the descriptor corresponding to p1.std

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 9, 8:45 am, Lie Ryan wrote: > On 06/09/10 08:20, Martin P. Hellwig wrote: > > I do think it is technically possible to have your own window manager in > > python on x11 but I have no idea if you have equal possibilities on mac > > Doesn't Mac uses an X server as well? not by default, no.

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 9, 5:12 am, rantingrick wrote: > But you know i think it boils down to fear really. He is comfortable > in his life and wishes to keep it as cookie cutter as he can. Any > outside influence must be quashed before these meddling forces can > take hold of him. He is so fearful of seeing the l

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread Kevin Walzer
On 6/12/10 9:44 AM, lkcl wrote: that's not quite true - you can create a simple core which is easily extensible with third party contributions to create more comprehensive widgets. That's exactly the design philosophy of Tk: a small core widget set (recently expanded somewhat with the ttk wi

Re: non-uniform distribution

2010-06-12 Thread Javier Montoya
On Jun 12, 3:21 pm, Ian wrote: > On 12/06/10 11:05, Javier Montoya wrote:> Dear all, > > > I need to generate a vector of random float numbers between [0,1] such > > that their sum equals 1 and that are distributed non-uniformly. > > Is there any python function that generates such a vector? > > >

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2010-06-12 Thread brandmarket
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Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 7, 9:25 pm, Arndt Roger Schneider wrote: > Terry Reedy schrieb: > Forget postscript! > Generate SVG from  a tk canvas or --better-- from tkpath. > Jeszra (from me) generates SVG. There is also a SVG export ... orr, you use a modern web browser engine such as XulRunner 1.9 (the engine behi

Re: lambda question

2010-06-12 Thread Vincent Davis
On Fri, Jun 11, 2010 at 10:11 PM, Ian Kelly wrote: > On Fri, Jun 11, 2010 at 9:31 PM, Vincent Davis > wrote: >> Starting with an example. >> In [23]: x = [1,2,3,4,4,4,5,5,3,2,2,] >> In [24]: y = set(x) >> In [25]: y >> Out[25]: set([1, 2, 3, 4, 5]) >> In [26]: y2 = len(set(x)) >> In [27]: y2 >>

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 6, 10:55 pm, ant wrote: > On Jun 6, 2:22 pm, ant wrote:> I get the strong feeling > that nobody is really happy with the state of > > Python GUIs. > > > > What an interesting set of responses I got! > And - even more interesting - how few of them actually seem to think > there is a probl

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
On Jun 6, 10:49 pm, Kevin Walzer wrote: > > - Pythonic > > - The default GUI (so it replaces Tkinter) > > - It has the support of the majority of the Python community > > - Simple and obvious to use for simple things > > - Comprehensive, for complicated things > > - Cross-platform > > - Looks good

Re: First program

2010-06-12 Thread Alister
On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 10:04:02 +, Phil H wrote: > On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 09:03:43 +, Phil H wrote: > >> Hi, >> Trying my hand with Python but have had a small hiccup. Reading 'A >> byte of Python' and created helloworld.py as directed. >> >> Any help appreciated >> Phil > > Thanks Peter & Ch

Re: non-uniform distribution

2010-06-12 Thread Ian
On 12/06/10 11:05, Javier Montoya wrote: Dear all, I need to generate a vector of random float numbers between [0,1] such that their sum equals 1 and that are distributed non-uniformly. Is there any python function that generates such a vector? Best wishes Hi Javier, The answer to your qu

Re: GUIs - A Modest Proposal

2010-06-12 Thread lkcl
[ye gods, i think this is the largest thread i've ever seen, but i still feel compelled to wind back to the beginning and spew forth words.] On Jun 6, 2:22 am, ant wrote: > I get the strong feeling that nobody is really happy with the state of > Python GUIs. yep. that's why i ported pyjamas,

Re: Deformed Form

2010-06-12 Thread Victor Subervi
Stephen Hansen suggests I move the line: new_passengers_curr_customers = int(form.getfirst('new_passengers_curr_customers', 0)) from "Script 3" (as he dubs it) to "Script 2". Naturally (though he wouldn't have known) that's how I had it at first. After sending the post that finally cleared up the

Re: non-uniform distribution

2010-06-12 Thread Javier Montoya
On Jun 12, 2:09 pm, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 03:05:43 -0700, Javier Montoya wrote: > > Dear all, > > > I need to generate a vector of random float numbers between [0,1] such > > that their sum equals 1 and that are distributed non-uniformly. Is there > > any python function tha

Re: non-uniform distribution

2010-06-12 Thread Javier Montoya
On Jun 12, 1:08 pm, Etienne Rousee wrote: > Le 12/06/2010 12:05, Javier Montoya a écrit : > > > I need to generate a vector of random float numbers between [0,1] such > > that their sum equals 1 and that are distributed non-uniformly. > > Is there any python function that generates such a vector?

Re: non-uniform distribution

2010-06-12 Thread Javier Montoya
On Jun 12, 1:08 pm, Etienne Rousee wrote: > Le 12/06/2010 12:05, Javier Montoya a écrit : > > > I need to generate a vector of random float numbers between [0,1] such > > that their sum equals 1 and that are distributed non-uniformly. > > Is there any python function that generates such a vector?

Re: non-uniform distribution

2010-06-12 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 03:05:43 -0700, Javier Montoya wrote: > Dear all, > > I need to generate a vector of random float numbers between [0,1] such > that their sum equals 1 and that are distributed non-uniformly. Is there > any python function that generates such a vector? You haven't explained yo

Re: First program

2010-06-12 Thread Phil Hansen
On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 12:51:18 +0200, Peter Otten wrote: > Phil H wrote: >> The script was written using Gedit on Ubuntu. > > Strange. Did you perhaps start with a file that you got from elsewhere > and modified that? Gedit may have left the CRs untouched then. > >> Cannot find a setting in Gedit

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