Re: OT-Comic: Tabs vs Spaces

On Sun, May 3, 2020 at 7:55 AM DL Neil via Python-list wrote: > > On 3/05/20 9:07 AM, Chris Angelico wrote: > > On Sun, May 3, 2020 at 6:33 AM DL Neil via Python-list > > wrote: > >> > >> Is this the way to write Python Enhancement Proposals (PEPs)? > >> eg https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-000

Re: OT-Comic: Tabs vs Spaces

On 3/05/20 9:07 AM, Chris Angelico wrote: On Sun, May 3, 2020 at 6:33 AM DL Neil via Python-list wrote: Is this the way to write Python Enhancement Proposals (PEPs)? eg https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0008/#indentation TabError: inconsistent use of tabs and spaces in indentation https://w

Re: OT-Comic: Tabs vs Spaces

On Sun, May 3, 2020 at 6:33 AM DL Neil via Python-list wrote: > > Is this the way to write Python Enhancement Proposals (PEPs)? > eg https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0008/#indentation > > TabError: inconsistent use of tabs and spaces in indentation > https://www.geeksaresexy.net/2020/05/01/the-

OT-Comic: Tabs vs Spaces

Is this the way to write Python Enhancement Proposals (PEPs)? eg https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0008/#indentation TabError: inconsistent use of tabs and spaces in indentation https://www.geeksaresexy.net/2020/05/01/the-tab-club-comic/ -- Regards, =dn -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listin

tabs vs. spaces

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsoOG6ZeyUI&feature=youtu.be -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Andrew Berg wrote: > >> I'm not saying it's wise > >Why not? It just makes it more difficult to follow the pattern when you add new code. If you have an editor mnaging that for you, then you might as well have the editor go all tabs or all spaces to avoid trouble. Vi and friends with ts=8 and s

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

In article , Duncan Booth wrote: > Tim Chase wrote: > > > On 07/17/2011 08:01 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > >> Roy Smith wrote: > >>> We don't have that problem any more. It truly boggles my > >>> mind that we're still churning out people with 80 column > >>> minds. I'm willing to entertain a

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Tue, Jul 19, 2011 at 5:06 AM, Andrew Berg wrote: > Personally, I think that 80 is pretty arbitrary now, and not the best > limit. I'm more comfortable with 120-130 myself. In any case, Python > won't complain about how many characters are on a line, and that's the > way it should be. > It's a

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 2011.07.18 01:51 PM, Dotan Cohen wrote: > Let me see if I understand: because there exists a possibility that > someone might want (not need) to edit code on a telephone to make a > quick edit to code being interpreted on that machine, _all_

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Mon, Jul 18, 2011 at 02:55, Andrew Berg > I think the reason the idea isn't dead is because of the emergence of > new devices with small displays (tablets/smartphones/etc.) and their > increasing popularity. When writing code that is meant to be run on > desktops or servers, the 80-column limit

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: > I am getting the idea here that you mean the right thing, but that you > explain it wrong. Feel free to write the much longer essay that explains it all unambiguously, I'm not going to. regards, Anders -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On 01/-10/-28163 02:59 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Tim Chase wrote: On 07/17/2011 08:01 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Roy Smith wrote: We don't have that problem any more. It truly boggles my mind that we're still churning out people with 80 column minds. I'm willing to entertain arguments abou

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Anssi Saari wrote: > Thorsten Kampe writes: >> The "perfect programming font" is just the one that looks so good that >> you would also use it for writing email. Dejavu Sans Mono is pretty >> good. Consolas looks also looks good but it is Windows only. > > How is Consolas Windows only? Not that

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Gregory Ewing wrote: > Anders J. Munch wrote: >> > Cameron Simpson wrote: >> >> Personally, I like to use the tab _key_ as an input device, but to >> >> have my editor write real spaces to the file in consequence. >> Just like in the old days:) > > Most editors can be configured to do that. T

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On 18/07/2011 14:52, Duncan Booth wrote: Tim Chase wrote: On 07/17/2011 08:01 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Roy Smith wrote: We don't have that problem any more. It truly boggles my mind that we're still churning out people with 80 column minds. I'm willing to entertain arguments about readab

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

* Anssi Saari (Mon, 18 Jul 2011 19:28:49 +0300) > > Thorsten Kampe writes: > > > The "perfect programming font" is just the one that looks so good that > > you would also use it for writing email. Dejavu Sans Mono is pretty > > good. Consolas looks also looks good but it is Windows only. > >

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Thorsten Kampe writes: > The "perfect programming font" is just the one that looks so good that > you would also use it for writing email. Dejavu Sans Mono is pretty > good. Consolas looks also looks good but it is Windows only. How is Consolas Windows only? Not that I'd put it in my Windows-f

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Monday, July 18, 2011 09:32:19 AM Tim Chase did opine: > On 07/17/2011 08:01 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > > Roy Smith wrote: > >> We don't have that problem any more. It truly boggles my > >> mind that we're still churning out people with 80 column > >> minds. I'm willing to entertain argumen

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Tim Chase wrote: > On 07/17/2011 08:01 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: >> Roy Smith wrote: >>> We don't have that problem any more. It truly boggles my >>> mind that we're still churning out people with 80 column >>> minds. I'm willing to entertain arguments about readability >>> of long lines, but t

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Tim Chase wrote: > On 07/17/2011 08:01 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: >> Roy Smith wrote: >>> We don't have that problem any more. It truly boggles my >>> mind that we're still churning out people with 80 column >>> minds. I'm willing to entertain arguments about readability >>> of long lines, but

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

> Bah, when I started programming > on the Apple ][+, we had no > lower-case and a 40-column limit > on the TV display. Keyboards??? That was a luxery! We had mechanical switches that one had to physically push and pull to enter commands. And a 40 column display??? Unheard of! We were happy with

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On 07/17/2011 08:01 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Roy Smith wrote: We don't have that problem any more. It truly boggles my mind that we're still churning out people with 80 column minds. I'm willing to entertain arguments about readability of long lines, but the idea that there's something magic

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sunday, July 17, 2011 08:24:12 PM Dotan Cohen did opine: > On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 17:29, gene heskett wrote: > >> I'm still looking for the perfect programming font. Suggestions > >> welcomed. > > > > When you find it Dotan, let me know, I've been looking since the later > > '70's. > > Hey

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Steven D'Aprano wrote: Why 78? Because it's one less than 79, as mandated by PEP 8, and two less than 80, the hoary old standard. There's another possible reason for the number 78, although hopefully it doesn't still apply today. There's an application I work with that stores free text in dat

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

* 2011-07-18T10:54:40+10:00 * Steven D'Aprano wrote: > Back in 2007, a n00b calling himself "TheFlyingDutchman" who I am > *reasonably* sure was Rick decided to fork Python: > > http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/2007-September/1127123.html I don't know if they are the same person but q

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Steven D'Aprano writes: > The exception is, you have an indented block of code, perhaps three or four > indents deep (surely you never allow anything to get beyond five or six > indents?), and you want to raise an exception: > > raise SomeExceptionType("and here's a rather long er

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 2011.07.17 07:54 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > Then in 2010, Rick promised that if the Python developers didn't bow > to his demands, he would folk Python, and the silent majority who > agreed with him but were too terrified to say so publicly w

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Steven D'Aprano wrote: > Roy Smith wrote: > >> We don't have that problem any more. It truly boggles my mind that >> we're still churning out people with 80 column minds. I'm willing to >> entertain arguments about readability of long lines, but the idea that >> there's something magic about 80

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Andrew Berg wrote: > I should also mention that this mostly speculation on my part, and that > I would love to hear from someone who develops for these devices. There's a mailing list for Python scripting on Android -- List-Subscribe:

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Roy Smith wrote: > We don't have that problem any more. It truly boggles my mind that > we're still churning out people with 80 column minds. I'm willing to > entertain arguments about readability of long lines, but the idea that > there's something magic about 80 columns is hogwash. I agree! W

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Andrew Berg wrote: > I should also mention that this mostly speculation on my part, and that > I would love to hear from someone who develops for these devices. There's a mailing list for Python scripting on Android -- List-Subscribe:

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Chris Angelico wrote: > On Mon, Jul 18, 2011 at 2:53 AM, rantingrick > wrote: >> [a whole lot of guff] > > Rick, you need to: > > 1) Grab the Python source code > 2) Make your own version of Python that works the way you want it > 3) Call it something different > 4) Start your own mailing list.

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 I should also mention that this mostly speculation on my part, and that I would love to hear from someone who develops for these devices. - -- CPython 3.2.1 | Windows NT 6.1.7601.17592 | Thunderbird 5.0 PGP/GPG Public Key ID: 0xF88E034060A78FCB

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 2011.07.17 07:28 PM, Roy Smith wrote: > Can you give me a more specific example? I assume there's nobody (at > least nobody sane) editing Python source code on iPhones. I haven't done it myself, but there are plenty of Python projects out the

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

In article , Andrew Berg wrote: > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: RIPEMD160 > > On 2011.07.17 06:29 PM, Roy Smith wrote: > > We don't have that problem any more. It truly boggles my mind that > > we're still churning out people with 80 column minds. I'm willing > > to entertain ar

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 2011.07.17 06:29 PM, Roy Smith wrote: > We don't have that problem any more. It truly boggles my mind that > we're still churning out people with 80 column minds. I'm willing > to entertain arguments about readability of long lines, but the

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 2011.07.17 11:46 AM, rantingrick wrote: > Why do you feel the need to layout your code in a "GUI-listview" > manner. Next you'll want column titles and column sorting... Jeez! > This is what you should have done... I was testing my psychic ab

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 2011.07.17 03:12 PM, rantingrick wrote: > I can tell you one thing for sure. In MY version of Python everyone > will have a voice. That does not mean that EVERYONE will make the > final decision but EVERYONE's voice will be equally important.

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 2:12 PM, rantingrick wrote: > On the face of it one might think vertical tabs are a good idea > however newlines work just fine. There is no reason for expanding > vertical whitespace to create readble code. If you can offer a good > reason i'm listening. Also be sure to po

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On 17Jul2011 09:53, rantingrick wrote: | On Jul 17, 4:49 am, "Anders J. Munch" <2...@jmunch.dk> wrote: | > Originally, tabs were a navigation device: When you press the tab key, you skip | > ahead to the next tab column.  The notion that whitespace characters are | > inserted into the text would

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Anders J. Munch wrote: > Cameron Simpson wrote: >> Personally, I like to use the tab _key_ as an input device, but to have >> my editor write real spaces to the file in consequence. Just like in the old days:) Most editors can be configured to do that. Where they fall down, in my experien

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 1:54 PM, rantingrick wrote: > On Jul 17, 1:48 pm, Ian Kelly wrote: > >> Let me get this straight.  You want us to use tabs so that individuals >> can set their tab width to however many spaces they want, but then you >> want everybody to set their tab widths to 4 spaces.  

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 22:53, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >> It simply isn't an issue. > > Apparently it is *has not been* an issue for *you* *yet*.  There are > languages (like Python) that are compiled just-in-time.  Besides, neither an > IDE nor a compiler can (always) recognize that foo[

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Jul 17, 2:34 pm, Thorsten Kampe wrote: > Indentation alignment will (because you're using only spaces). Otherwise > it doesn't align (it can't), simply because of the "variable-width". > > For instance (in a variable-width font): > > if a == b: >     var123    = 22 >     varxyz456 = 333 >

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Jul 17, 1:54 pm, Ian Kelly wrote: > On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 10:29 AM, rantingrick wrote: > > I hate  vertical white-space. I follow Python style guide suggestions, > > and then some! I hate when people insert spaces into code blocks and > > function/method bodies. If you feel a space must be i

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Jul 17, 1:48 pm, Ian Kelly wrote: > Let me get this straight.  You want us to use tabs so that individuals > can set their tab width to however many spaces they want, but then you > want everybody to set their tab widths to 4 spaces.  You're > contradicting yourself here. In my mind people ar

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Dotan Cohen wrote: > On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 15:53, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn >> […] I do not understand how you can consider using a non-fixed-width >> font in programming "a real pleasure" as many them show a lot of >> ambiguities in source code. Take for example the lowercase "l" (el) vs. >>

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Jul 17, 1:22 pm, Tim Chase wrote: > > Solution: STOP USING BROKEN TOOLS!!! > > Unbroken tools that do anything worthwhile are usually > complicated tools. > > Just pointing that out in case you missed the irony... You make a good point, albeit a very well know point. It's the same kind of poi

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Anders J. Munch wrote: > Steven D'Aprano wrote: >> I can't fathom why 8 position tabs were *ever* the default, let alone >> why they are still the default. > > That's because they were not invented as a means for programmers to vary > indentation. > > Originally, tabs were a navigation device: W

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

>> I'm still looking for the perfect programming font. Suggestions >> welcomed. > > When you find it Dotan, let me know, I've been looking since the later > '70's. For me, it's Terminus* (from sourceforge). Br. Waldek [*] As long as you don't need anything but iso8859-1. -- http://mail.python.

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 21:20, Thorsten Kampe wrote: >> The past is bickering over selfish personal freedoms, the future of is >> unity. > > And a tab is *exactly* four spaces. Not three. Not five. Not eight. For > you, for me, and for the rest of the world. Amen! > Four is the number thou shalt

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 20:57, rantingrick wrote: > Such a system of rigorous formatting rules requires much less > interpreter logic. Python will be leaner and meaner. There won't be > any more arguing about how to format code. There will only be one way; > the correct way! Choose to follow it or

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

* Dotan Cohen (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 22:20:15 +0300) > > On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 14:51, Thorsten Kampe > wrote: > > * Dotan Cohen (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 14:11:40 +0300) > >> So long as the indentation lines up (which it does, with tabs or > >> spaces) then I do not see any problem with variable-width. > >

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 17:29, gene heskett wrote: >> I'm still looking for the perfect programming font. Suggestions >> welcomed. > > When you find it Dotan, let me know, I've been looking since the later > '70's. > Hey there Gene! Are you not on every mailing list on the internet old man?!? I

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 15:53, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >> I am also a recent spaces-to-tabs convert. One of the reasons is that >> I've discovered that programing in a non-fixed width font is a real >> pleasure, but the spaces are too narrow. Tabs alleviate that. > > Not using a fixed-wid

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Jul 17, 1:20 pm, Thorsten Kampe wrote: > > The past is bickering over selfish personal freedoms, the future of is > > unity. > > And a tab is *exactly* four spaces. Not three. Not five. Not eight. For > you, for me, and for the rest of the world. Amen! Not *exactly*. A tab is just a control

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 14:51, Thorsten Kampe wrote: > * Dotan Cohen (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 14:11:40 +0300) >> So long as the indentation lines up (which it does, with tabs or >> spaces) then I do not see any problem with variable-width. > >> What are the counter-arguments? > > Alignment doesn't line u

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Thorsten Kampe wrote: > * Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 14:35:15 +0200) >> Thorsten Kampe wrote: >> > * Andrew Berg (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 05:02:22 -0500) >> >> I still don't understand. Whitespace to the left of an assignment >> >> to signify an indent and whitespace around operators to

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 10:29 AM, rantingrick wrote: > I hate  vertical white-space. I follow Python style guide suggestions, > and then some! I hate when people insert spaces into code blocks and > function/method bodies. If you feel a space must be inserted then that > is a good clue you should

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 9:15 AM, rantingrick wrote: >>  I can write my code to 80 >> columns using 4-space tabs, but if somebody later tries to edit the >> file using 8-space tabs, their lines will be too long. > > THEIR LINES is the key words. A tab control is a tab control is a (you > guessed it

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

* rantingrick (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 10:57:10 -0700 (PDT)) > Choose to follow it or die of exceptions; your choice. One of the best things I've read for a long time :-). > The past is bickering over selfish personal freedoms, the future of is > unity. And a tab is *exactly* four spaces. Not three. No

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

4) Tabs remove the need for complicated indention/detention tools. On 07/17/2011 10:15 AM, rantingrick wrote: On Jul 17, 2:32 am, Ian Kelly wrote: This. I used to think that tabs were better, for pretty much the reasons Rick outlined, but I've had enough problems with editors munging my tabs

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Mon, Jul 18, 2011 at 3:57 AM, rantingrick wrote: > It's funny you mention this because i am creating a specification for > a Python 4000 fork that removes all ambiguities and multiplicity from > the language. Very soon i will be posting the spec for review within > this group. Maybe some of you

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Jul 17, 12:11 pm, Chris Angelico wrote: > On Mon, Jul 18, 2011 at 2:53 AM, rantingrick wrote: > > [a whole lot of guff] > > Rick, you need to: > > 1) Grab the Python source code > 2) Make your own version of Python that works the way you want it > 3) Call it something different > 4) Start your

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Mon, Jul 18, 2011 at 2:53 AM, rantingrick wrote: > [a whole lot of guff] Rick, you need to: 1) Grab the Python source code 2) Make your own version of Python that works the way you want it 3) Call it something different 4) Start your own mailing list. Put your money - or, in this case, devel

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Jul 17, 4:49 am, "Anders J. Munch" <2...@jmunch.dk> wrote: > Originally, tabs were a navigation device: When you press the tab key, you > skip > ahead to the next tab column.  The notion that whitespace characters are > inserted into the text would have been very alien to someone using text >

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Mon, Jul 18, 2011 at 2:29 AM, rantingrick wrote: > You guys should feel lucky i am not the BDFL, because i would cast > plagues of exceptions on your lazy butts! > BDFL = Benevolent Dictator For Life. Note that first word. ChrisA -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Jul 17, 5:42 am, Thorsten Kampe wrote: > When I'm (consistently, of course) indenting code, I'm aligning it. When > I'm aligning code, I do this by indenting it, see for instance... > > firstvariable = 11 > variable      = 111 > > firstvariable = 22 > variable =      222 > > The second "=" and

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Jul 17, 2:35 am, Thorsten Kampe wrote: > * rantingrick (Sat, 16 Jul 2011 09:51:02 -0700 (PDT)) > > > 3) Tabs create freedom in the form of user controlled indention. > > > Indention width should be a choice of the reader NOT the author. We > > should never "code in" indention width; but that is

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Excerpts from Thorsten Kampe's message of Sun Jul 17 11:10:57 -0400 2011: > The "perfect programming font" is just the one that looks so good that > you would also use it for writing email. Dejavu Sans Mono is pretty > good. Consolas looks also looks good but it is Windows only. > I use inconso

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Jul 17, 2:32 am, Ian Kelly wrote: > This.  I used to think that tabs were better, for pretty much the > reasons Rick outlined, but I've had enough problems with editors > munging my tabs that I eventually found it simpler in practice to just > go with the flow and use spaces. Solution: STOP U

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

* gene heskett (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 10:29:03 -0400) > On Sunday, July 17, 2011 10:28:16 AM Dotan Cohen did opine: > > I'm still looking for the perfect programming font. Suggestions > > welcomed. > > When you find it Dotan, let me know, I've been looking since the later > '70's. The "perfect program

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

* Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 14:35:15 +0200) > Thorsten Kampe wrote: > > * Andrew Berg (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 05:02:22 -0500) > >> I still don't understand. Whitespace to the left of an assignment > >> to signify an indent and whitespace around operators to align > >> values (in a multi

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sunday, July 17, 2011 10:28:16 AM Dotan Cohen did opine: > On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 19:51, rantingrick wrote: > > -- > > Evidence: Tabs ARE superior! > > -- > > I am also a recent spaces-to-tabs co

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Ian Kelly wrote: > but if somebody later tries to edit the > file using 8-space tabs I came across this and I like to put a note on top of the script to remember to modify it accordingly. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Dotan Cohen wrote: > On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 19:51, rantingrick wrote: >> -- >> Evidence: Tabs ARE superior! >> -- > > I am also a recent spaces-to-tabs convert. One of the reasons is that > I've disc

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Thorsten Kampe wrote: > * Andrew Berg (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 05:02:22 -0500) >> I still don't understand. Whitespace to the left of an assignment to >> signify an indent and whitespace around operators to align values (in >> a multi-line assignment) are not the same. > > When I'm (consistently, of cou

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Steven D'Aprano wrote: > I can't fathom why 8 position tabs were *ever* the default, let alone why > they are still the default. That's because they were not invented as a means for programmers to vary indentation. Originally, tabs were a navigation device: When you press the tab key, you skip

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

* Dotan Cohen (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 14:11:40 +0300) > So long as the indentation lines up (which it does, with tabs or > spaces) then I do not see any problem with variable-width. > What are the counter-arguments? Alignment doesn't line up. Thorsten -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Jul 17, 4:11 pm, Dotan Cohen wrote: > On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 11:35, Andrew Berg wrote: > >> programing in a non-fixed width font is a real pleasure > > If you're masochistic, maybe. Do you find fixed-width fonts ugly? > > I don't find that fixed-width fonts are ugly, but variable-width fonts

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 11:35, Andrew Berg wrote: >> programing in a non-fixed width font is a real pleasure > If you're masochistic, maybe. Do you find fixed-width fonts ugly? I don't find that fixed-width fonts are ugly, but variable-width fonts sure are more of a pleasure. And with code-colour

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

* Andrew Berg (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 05:02:22 -0500) > > And if we work on a project together, we have to agree on formatting > > anyway, the indent size being the least important one. > How is indent size unimportant with regard to formatting? Take some code or yours and format it with three and with

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 2011.07.17 04:33 AM, Thorsten Kampe wrote: > Not everyone who doesn't agree on indent size actually cares enough > about indent size - especially in someone else's code. I'd say it's > probably rather the majority making this whole debate art

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

* Andrew Berg (Sun, 17 Jul 2011 03:36:31 -0500) > Not everyone agrees on how many spaces an indent should be (whether an > indent is a tab or a space-tab), which is a good reason to use tabs. Not everyone who doesn't agree on indent size actually cares enough about indent size - especially in som

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 2011.07.17 02:56 AM, Thorsten Kampe wrote: > What is the difference between indentation and alignment? Well, > indentation works with tabs, alignment not. The use of spaces for indentation is as much of a hack as the use of tabs for alignment

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 2011.07.17 03:15 AM, Dotan Cohen wrote: > programing in a non-fixed width font is a real pleasure If you're masochistic, maybe. Do you find fixed-width fonts ugly? I really would like to know why anyone would use a non-fixed-width font for prog

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 19:51, rantingrick wrote: > -- >  Evidence: Tabs ARE superior! > -- I am also a recent spaces-to-tabs convert. One of the reasons is that I've discovered that programing in a no

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

* Andrew Berg (Sat, 16 Jul 2011 19:29:30 -0500) > Of everything I've read on tabs vs. spaces, this is what makes the > most sense to me: > http://www.iovene.com/61/ Interesting one, especially the - from the coder's point of view - artificial distinction between indentation a

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 2011.07.17 02:32 AM, Ian Kelly wrote: > Of course, there is also another major problem with tabs that I have > not seen pointed out yet, which is that it's not possible to > strictly adhere to 80-column lines with tabs. I can write my code to

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 1:29 AM, Andrew Berg wrote: > You're right. TabError is only raised if the initial indentation is > inconsistent. > Not legal: > def spam(): > print('Wonderful spam!\n') > <4 spaces>print('Bloody Vikings!') > > Legal: > def eggs(): > print( > 'Blech!\n','Whaddya mean, "blec

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

* rantingrick (Sat, 16 Jul 2011 09:51:02 -0700 (PDT)) > 3) Tabs create freedom in the form of user controlled indention. > > Indention width should be a choice of the reader NOT the author. We > should never "code in" indention width; but that is EXACTLY what we > are doing with spaces! No, the re

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 9:09 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: >> Personally, I like to use the tab _key_ as an input device, but to have >> my editor write real spaces to the file in consequence. With pure >> spaces, the text is laid out reliably for us both. And so I have my >> editor set to that behav

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 2011.07.16 06:06 PM, Tim Roberts wrote: > That's not true. Python allows tabs and spaces to be used in the > same source file, and even in the same source line. You're right. TabError is only raised if the initial indentation is inconsistent.

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On 17Jul2011 13:09, Steven D'Aprano wrote: | Cameron Simpson wrote: | > On 16Jul2011 09:51, rantingrick trolled: | > | Evidence: Tabs ARE superior! | > | -- | > | I have begun to believe that tabs are far more superior to spaces | > | > Please Ri

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 08:39, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > > I have reluctantly come to do the same thing. There is a plethora of broken > tools out there that don't handle tabs well, and consequently even though > tabs for indentation are objectively better, I use spaces because it is > less worse t

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 On 2011.07.16 10:07 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > Hilariously, in my newsreader, the first example (allegedly > unaligned) was lined up as straight as an arrow, It has consistent indentation, but the self.whatever references aren't aligned. > The

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Cameron Simpson wrote: > On 16Jul2011 09:51, rantingrick trolled: > | Evidence: Tabs ARE superior! > | -- > | I have begun to believe that tabs are far more superior to spaces > > Please Rick: you need at least three things to use the term "more >

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Andrew Berg wrote: > I try to avoid aligning things unless not doing it really hurts > readability for that reason. For example, in most of my source files, I > use tabs to indent. Since Python won't allow a mix of tabs and spaces > (for whitespace) on one line, I don't try to align things: > > e

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On 16Jul2011 19:29, Andrew Berg wrote: | Of everything I've read on tabs vs. spaces, this is what makes the most | sense to me: | http://www.iovene.com/61/ Makes sense to me. Thanks for the URL. Cheers, -- Cameron Simpson DoD#743 http://www.cskk.ezoshosting.com/cs/ Every particle continu

Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 9:52 AM, Cameron Simpson wrote: > | Programming languages MUST have rules or > | ambiguities will run a muck and bring the entire system crashing down. > > "Amuck" is one word you know... Yes, but maybe he's wanting to run a MUCK. It's quite possible; I run a MUD. Now, I'm

  1   2   >