I'll believe this is a serious issue when the Court holds that limiting the
priesthood or rabbinate to men violates Title VII, but not a day before. I
detect some demagoguery in Oklahoma legislature--shocking I'm sure.
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 13, 2015, at 3:53 PM, Brad Pardee
I think the odds are higher that the electorate of Oklahoma overwhelmingly
votes for Elizabeth Warren for President than that both houses of the
Oklahoma legislature would approve, and the Oklahoma governor would sign, a
bill that requires all clergy in Oklahoma to perform religious weddings for
Any thoughts on the Coeur d’Alene, Idaho incident in which the
City Attorney suggested that a wedding chapel run by two ministers would have
to allow same-sex marriages, given a Coeur d’Alene public accommodations
ordinance that banned sexual orientation discrimination? See
I think one will see all sorts of errors — like those going the other way in
Alabama right now. And like those teachers and administrators who wrongly
prohibit kids from private prayer before lunch or from reading the Bible in
free reading time.
And ironically some of the mistakes will be
Following up on Eugene’s point:
Marty and Sandy are basically right, but that doesn’t mean it couldn’t become
an issue.
If I’m not mistaken, the Obama administration opposed recognition of the
ministerial exception (and not just as applied on the facts in Hosanna-Tabor).
Some states have
What does it say that seven out of 95 legislators voted against? That
this is not a serious question.
BTW, the story does not say that supporters of gay rights said they'll
challenge the law in the courts if it is passed, indicating that they
believe pastors can be forced to perform same sex
http://news.yahoo.com/oklahoma-bill-protect-clergy-wont-perform-gay-marriage
s-230731935.html
From what I have learned here in my time on this list, I wouldn't think that
this law would be necessary because existing law would seem to prevent the
government from mandating when churches are
I thought that having nearly ten percent of the legislature oppose it indicates
that that the pastors' concerns weren't just products of their imagination, and
what nearly ten percent now may grow larger in time as activists and lobbyists
play their role in the political process. What I've
One interesting question is whether situations like that in Coeur d'Alene
-- even assuming they are not adequately addressed by constitutional
protections for freedom of association and freedom of religion -- are best
addressed statutorily through (1) the definition of places of public
The Coeur d’Alene chapel did invite the public generally – just
as, to my knowledge, many clergy members are happy to officiate over weddings
even for strangers. It’s just that they only want to officiate at weddings
that they view as consistent with their beliefs, whether those
I've been thinking about a little thought experiment, and I
thought I'd run it past this list to see whether people see it as helpful.
Imagine a state in which prostitution is legalized. A
prostitute offers her services to the general public (perhaps through a web
Given the overlap between Eugene's two most recent messages -- one on the
Oklahoma bill thread and the other offering the new racist prostitute
hypothetical -- I thought it might be helpful to put them both in one
thread.
Eugene's messages raise precisely the question I had been hoping to raise:
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