Re: [Talk-us] Updating tagging of public transport
it is not clear if the new way is actually better, at least the current data stats show that mappers still prefer the old method, at least for bus stops, as it is simpler (you need just one tag highway=bus_stop instead of two: public_transport=platform and bus=yes, for the same information content), and the new style cannot be rendered on the main map, because of the lack of the bus-key (the rendering db only knows that there is some kind of stop, but it cannot determine if it is a tram stop, a bus stop or whatelse). I wouldn't re-tag, ie. won't remove tags, but you can add the public_transport=* tags if you want to support also this scheme. Is what I hear Martin saying here is that tagging with an old style because it renders AND tagging with a newer syntax that doesn't is OK? (As in, doing two things at once, even if they achieve different, but good and worthy goals, is right?) If so, part of what it says is that syntax is rather distantly connected to rendering. Read that again, as I think it is important. It is about what might be called OSM's transmission. Not everybody understands the full process of how changes in syntax (e.g. voted upon tagging) turn into what we see mapped. There are human consensus processes there, there are coding processes there (including bug fixes, actual writing of render code..) there is quite much more than just that there. It is a complicated moving set of parts. It is let's map bus routes, OK, let's describe better syntax for bus routes, OK (but we don't render that today). Now what? That's a real hit the brakes and think about how to do it better, so discuss moment. As we recognize distance between what people want to see represented in the map (how they tag) with the syntax of doing so (actual tags that get into OSM's data) can we better discuss this? We can and should, I say. Deep, I know. My point is that a person wanting to understand how to influence this is very much helped by understanding it (as much of it as possible, as much of it as we can describe as what we intend...) in the first place. How might one see such moving parts of OSM and how they a) work today? and b) work better in the future as we intend them? It goes deeper than public transport tagging, but that is a good example through this transmission. Look, I know: some of us work on our transmission, and they must. A lot more of us -- and there are many -- are only quite vaguely aware of how it works, or how we might best induce positive change into its workings. We can do better. Good discussion so far, but it seems we are only scratching this surface. SteveA California ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tagging a seasonally closed roads with uncertain spring opening
On Sun, Nov 2, 2014 at 8:28 PM, Kevin Broderick k...@kevinbroderick.com wrote: Having recently moved to Red Lodge, Montana, I'm trying to update some of the map data around here, as a lot of it is untouched TIGER data that seems to be fairly imaginative. Just south of town, US-212 is closed for the winter. The closing date is mid-October (varies a little year-to-year, but it is calendar-based) and the opening date is based on when the road is clear of snow, ice, and other debris (i.e. significant variation year-to-year is possible). Beartooth Pass! Woo! Highest place I've ever driven. Also, I really like the name and the place. When the road is closed, it is truly closed (per signs and gate); it's not just a unmaintained, travel at your own risk situation. Anyone have suggestions for tagging this segment of road? date_on and date_off were the best options I came up with in a search, but the variation in opening date seems to make that a bad choice. Seems like this might be something that needs to be regularly adjusted, by setting the affected section to access=no. If there's multiple segments, gotta wonder if this would be an acceptable misuse of a relation to make it easier to maintain (just to be able to pull down all the related objects subject to winter closure on that road at once). ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tagging a seasonally closed roads with uncertain spring opening
On Mon, Nov 3, 2014 at 9:12 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: Am 03.11.2014 um 16:03 schrieb Richard Weait rich...@weait.com: seems access=seasonal isn't in wide use but would be correct I think that this is not so nice tagging as it doesn't say anything about which season you'll be allowed to access. I would suggest conditional access, see the wiki for more info, it is something like access:conditional=no @ winter (I'm on mobile and didn't check this syntax) This seems cleaner, as at least then routers can compare the date, which hemisphere they're in and say, Hey, this might be closed, wanna try a different way? ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] zip-city mappings
Also note that Census ZIPs are somewhat fluid, as are postal ZIPs, and postal ZIPs don't cover the entire country, and postal ZIPs are based on carrier routes and not an area. On Sun, Nov 9, 2014 at 6:05 PM, Richard Welty rwe...@averillpark.net wrote: On 11/9/14 3:10 PM, Nathan Mills wrote: Just keep in mind that some ZIPs cover multiple cities. The one I'm standing in now is found in parts of at least 3 different cities that I know of. Others cover both (parts of) cities and unincorporated areas outside of the city whose name they are associated with. this snippet, from my longer reply over in the new I.D. Feature thread, discusses this: as for that many to one mapping that isn't, basically, for each zip code there is a primary city and potentially a number of secondary cities. the primary city is the city name of the post office that serves the routes; the secondary cities are generally traditional place names within the delivery area; for example, for years i lived in the Lansingburgh neighborhood of Troy NY, and the post office would deliver mail for either city name. any effort to crowd source this data would need to take care of that detail. richard -- rwe...@averillpark.net Averill Park Networking - GIS IT Consulting OpenStreetMap - PostgreSQL - Linux Java - Web Applications - Search ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature)
On Sun, Nov 9, 2014 at 3:10 AM, Shawn K. Quinn skqu...@rushpost.com wrote: So, a couple of questions: 1. What, exactly, is fair game to change to a state abbreviation reference? Fair game nationwide, two letter state abbreviations should be used for the primary state highway network. 2. Which states spell out the name in the ref? I know Kansas uses K-123, and Michigan uses M-123. Are there any others to be careful of? Kansas should be KS 123, Michigan should be MI 123. Ultimately, though, both should be part of route relations that describe the route so we can quit adding ref=* to the incorrect entity (it's not the way's ref, it's the route's!). ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] User randomly adding speed limits across the US
We have a similar convention in the US for doing that, though usually requires tagging traffic_sign=maxspeed, maxspeed=?? mph in a few places, since there's often multiple steps from rural speeds to town speeds when entering a town or city (Oklahoma sense; Oregon would call anything incorporated city regardless of size, even when the town name more or less accurately describes the size of the city in question (Wood Village, Government Camp); neither state has the concept any other settlement types we have in OSM). On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 4:09 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: 2014-11-11 11:02 GMT+01:00 Minh Nguyen m...@nguyen.cincinnati.oh.us: where the speed limit suddenly jumps from 25 to 55 at a village limit. not sure if you are aware of this, in Europe we are mapping those village limits (with the tag traffic_sign=city_limit and sometimes additionally with name=placename) in order to better track speed limits. We'd typically put the city_limit sign on the right side of the highway (it is not intended for automatic data consumers but more a help for human mappers), and not on the highway, to preserve implicit direction information. cheers, Martin ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature)
From the Wiki http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/United_States_roads_tagging “The two letter abbreviation for the state per the United States Postal Service's https://www.usps.com/send/official-abbreviations.htm state abbreviation list, another abbreviation used by the state (such as SR for State Road), or no prefix. Different states may have different standards for which to use, and there is no current inter-state standard.” I take the “Different states may have different standards for which to use” to mean that not all states use the two letter abbreviation and in states that don’t we should use that states standard for example Michigan uses M. The highway behind my house is M-15 and singed that way so I would think it should be tagged that way. Am I reading the Wiki wrong? Thanks Dave From: Paul Johnson [mailto:ba...@ursamundi.org] Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2014 10:04 PM To: Shawn K. Quinn Cc: OpenStreetMap talk-us list Subject: Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature) On Sun, Nov 9, 2014 at 3:10 AM, Shawn K. Quinn skqu...@rushpost.com mailto:skqu...@rushpost.com wrote: So, a couple of questions: 1. What, exactly, is fair game to change to a state abbreviation reference? Fair game nationwide, two letter state abbreviations should be used for the primary state highway network. 2. Which states spell out the name in the ref? I know Kansas uses K-123, and Michigan uses M-123. Are there any others to be careful of? Kansas should be KS 123, Michigan should be MI 123. Ultimately, though, both should be part of route relations that describe the route so we can quit adding ref=* to the incorrect entity (it's not the way's ref, it's the route's!). ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature)
I'm going to say that the wiki is presently wrong compared to consensus previously arrived at on the tagging list regarding this issue the last 971151183 times that this has come up, largely as a result of previous efforts by NE2 to game the renderer... On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 9:31 PM, Dave Mansfield mansfie...@chartermi.net wrote: From the Wiki http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/United_States_roads_tagging “The two letter abbreviation for the state per the United States Postal Service's state abbreviation list https://www.usps.com/send/official-abbreviations.htm, another abbreviation used by the state (such as SR for State Road), or no prefix. Different states may have different standards for which to use, and there is no current inter-state standard.” I take the “Different states may have different standards for which to use” to mean that not all states use the two letter abbreviation and in states that don’t we should use that states standard for example Michigan uses M. The highway behind my house is M-15 and singed that way so I would think it should be tagged that way. Am I reading the Wiki wrong? Thanks Dave *From:* Paul Johnson [mailto:ba...@ursamundi.org] *Sent:* Saturday, November 29, 2014 10:04 PM *To:* Shawn K. Quinn *Cc:* OpenStreetMap talk-us list *Subject:* Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature) On Sun, Nov 9, 2014 at 3:10 AM, Shawn K. Quinn skqu...@rushpost.com wrote: So, a couple of questions: 1. What, exactly, is fair game to change to a state abbreviation reference? Fair game nationwide, two letter state abbreviations should be used for the primary state highway network. 2. Which states spell out the name in the ref? I know Kansas uses K-123, and Michigan uses M-123. Are there any others to be careful of? Kansas should be KS 123, Michigan should be MI 123. Ultimately, though, both should be part of route relations that describe the route so we can quit adding ref=* to the incorrect entity (it's not the way's ref, it's the route's!). ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Directional suffixes on roads: yes or no?
Howdy, I have a question about how much effort should be put into adding directional suffixes to road names. Many counties around Atlanta have adopted directional suffixes for roads, both in incorporated areas as well as outside city limits. Usually all areas in the county use the same system, with directions denoted NE, SE, NW and SW from some standard point, although some cities tend to ignore the suffixes. Also, signage is inconsistent--some street signs bear the suffix while others on the same street don't. In most cases, the suffix is immaterial, and most people don't use it anyway. Use of it or not won't affect directions most of the time, although I know of a few specific cases where knowing the suffix can be important in finding the right location (is your house 100 Concord Road Southeast or Southwest?). The majority of the Tiger data doesn't include the suffix. So, how much should I worry about the missing suffixes? Should they be included in the main name= tag? Or one of the other *name tags with the unsuffixed name in the name= tag. Because most people don't use the suffix, on some roads I've put the with-suffix name in the name= tag and the unsuffixed one in the short_name= tag, but I'm wondering if I should continue to bother. -jack -- Typos courtesy of fancy auto-spell technology. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Directional suffixes on roads: yes or no?
On 11/29/2014 10:39 PM, Jack Burke wrote: Howdy, I have a question about how much effort should be put into adding directional suffixes to road names. Many counties around Atlanta have adopted directional suffixes for roads, both in incorporated areas as well as outside city limits. Usually all areas in the county use the same system, with directions denoted NE, SE, NW and SW from some standard point, although some cities tend to ignore the suffixes. Also, signage is inconsistent--some street signs bear the suffix while others on the same street don't. In most cases, the suffix is immaterial, and most people don't use it anyway. Use of it or not won't affect directions most of the time, although I know of a few specific cases where knowing the suffix can be important in finding the right location (is your house 100 Concord Road Southeast or Southwest?). The majority of the Tiger data doesn't include the suffix. So, how much should I worry about the missing suffixes? Should they be included in the main name= tag? Or one of the other *name tags with the unsuffixed name in the name= tag. Because most people don't use the suffix, on some roads I've put the with-suffix name in the name= tag and the unsuffixed one in the short_name= tag, but I'm wondering if I should continue to bother. -jack -- Typos courtesy of fancy auto-spell technology. An additional complication is ring-roads, which are likely to have XXX North transition into XXX East, etc. -- John F. Eldredge -- j...@jfeldredge.com Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature)
Please forgive me I’m not trying to stir things up. I’m new to OSM and trying to learn and I don’t have any idea what the NE2 you refer to is. I understand that a lot of things are tagged different then what I would think do to standards. I understand that and I’m doing everything I can to learn the correct way to tag. I’m always looking at the Wiki and also how others are tagging. I’ve also sent emails asking for help on tagging. I understand that we normally don’t abbreviate but that states are the exception and we use the 2 letter abbreviation. So I’m only trying to learn but in this case a ref tag seems like a name tag for the name of the route to me and I’m having a hard time understanding why we would tag a name something other then what it is. Is there someplace I can go to read why it’s this way? Thanks Dave From: Paul Johnson [mailto:ba...@ursamundi.org] Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2014 10:40 PM To: Dave Mansfield Cc: Shawn K. Quinn; OpenStreetMap talk-us list Subject: Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature) I'm going to say that the wiki is presently wrong compared to consensus previously arrived at on the tagging list regarding this issue the last 971151183 times that this has come up, largely as a result of previous efforts by NE2 to game the renderer... On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 9:31 PM, Dave Mansfield mansfie...@chartermi.net mailto:mansfie...@chartermi.net wrote: From the Wiki http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/United_States_roads_tagging “The two letter abbreviation for the state per the United States Postal Service's https://www.usps.com/send/official-abbreviations.htm state abbreviation list, another abbreviation used by the state (such as SR for State Road), or no prefix. Different states may have different standards for which to use, and there is no current inter-state standard.” I take the “Different states may have different standards for which to use” to mean that not all states use the two letter abbreviation and in states that don’t we should use that states standard for example Michigan uses M. The highway behind my house is M-15 and singed that way so I would think it should be tagged that way. Am I reading the Wiki wrong? Thanks Dave From: Paul Johnson [mailto:ba...@ursamundi.org mailto:ba...@ursamundi.org ] Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2014 10:04 PM To: Shawn K. Quinn Cc: OpenStreetMap talk-us list Subject: Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature) On Sun, Nov 9, 2014 at 3:10 AM, Shawn K. Quinn skqu...@rushpost.com mailto:skqu...@rushpost.com wrote: So, a couple of questions: 1. What, exactly, is fair game to change to a state abbreviation reference? Fair game nationwide, two letter state abbreviations should be used for the primary state highway network. 2. Which states spell out the name in the ref? I know Kansas uses K-123, and Michigan uses M-123. Are there any others to be careful of? Kansas should be KS 123, Michigan should be MI 123. Ultimately, though, both should be part of route relations that describe the route so we can quit adding ref=* to the incorrect entity (it's not the way's ref, it's the route's!). ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature)
On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 10:50 PM, Dave Mansfield mansfie...@chartermi.net wrote: Please forgive me I’m not trying to stir things up. I’m new to OSM and trying to learn and I don’t have any idea what the NE2 you refer to is. Glossing past this since it's extensively in the archives at this point. I understand that a lot of things are tagged different then what I would think do to standards. I understand that and I’m doing everything I can to learn the correct way to tag. I’m always looking at the Wiki and also how others are tagging. I’ve also sent emails asking for help on tagging. I understand that we normally don’t abbreviate but that states are the exception and we use the 2 letter abbreviation. So I’m only trying to learn but in this case a ref tag seems like a name tag for the name of the route to me and I’m having a hard time understanding why we would tag a name something other then what it is. Don't take it too hard. People game the wiki regularly, which makes it confusing for humans. We've arrived at using the state name for the primary (and often only) state highway networks as this provides for a consistent, unambiguous and geographically context-free (ie, you don't need to know what state you're in to get it by context) way for routing engines and renderers to understand that it's a state highway, and from which state. This system breaks down in ways route relations don't mostly because of the way the network tag works for state highways (ie, US:TX, US:TX:NASA, US:OK:Turnpike etc) for states that have multiple highway systems and that the ref tag on a way is still a legacy from when this whole system was an experiment on some guy's home server in London and didn't think it was really going to take off. ;o) Is there someplace I can go to read why it’s this way? #osm-us on OFTC seems to be the best place to get a quickish answer, though in this case, sounds like you got it (even if it didn't sound great...) ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature)
Thanks! It makes sense the way you explain it. I was looking at it as a name of the route and thinking it should me the same as signs etc. But not the fact that routing engines and renderers will know it’s a state highway based on the state abbreviation. Dave From: Paul Johnson [mailto:ba...@ursamundi.org] Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2014 12:11 AM To: Dave Mansfield Cc: Shawn K. Quinn; OpenStreetMap talk-us list Subject: Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature) On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 10:50 PM, Dave Mansfield mansfie...@chartermi.net mailto:mansfie...@chartermi.net wrote: Please forgive me I’m not trying to stir things up. I’m new to OSM and trying to learn and I don’t have any idea what the NE2 you refer to is. Glossing past this since it's extensively in the archives at this point. I understand that a lot of things are tagged different then what I would think do to standards. I understand that and I’m doing everything I can to learn the correct way to tag. I’m always looking at the Wiki and also how others are tagging. I’ve also sent emails asking for help on tagging. I understand that we normally don’t abbreviate but that states are the exception and we use the 2 letter abbreviation. So I’m only trying to learn but in this case a ref tag seems like a name tag for the name of the route to me and I’m having a hard time understanding why we would tag a name something other then what it is. Don't take it too hard. People game the wiki regularly, which makes it confusing for humans. We've arrived at using the state name for the primary (and often only) state highway networks as this provides for a consistent, unambiguous and geographically context-free (ie, you don't need to know what state you're in to get it by context) way for routing engines and renderers to understand that it's a state highway, and from which state. This system breaks down in ways route relations don't mostly because of the way the network tag works for state highways (ie, US:TX, US:TX:NASA, US:OK:Turnpike etc) for states that have multiple highway systems and that the ref tag on a way is still a legacy from when this whole system was an experiment on some guy's home server in London and didn't think it was really going to take off. ;o) Is there someplace I can go to read why it’s this way? #osm-us on OFTC seems to be the best place to get a quickish answer, though in this case, sounds like you got it (even if it didn't sound great...) ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature)
On 2014-11-29 19:31, Dave Mansfield wrote: From the Wiki http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/United_States_roads_tagging “The two letter abbreviation for the state per the United States Postal Service's state abbreviation list https://www.usps.com/send/official-abbreviations.htm, another abbreviation used by the state (such as SR for State Road), or no prefix. Different states may have different standards for which to use, and there is no current inter-state standard.” I take the “Different states may have different standards for which to use” to mean that not all states use the two letter abbreviation and in states that don’t we should use that states standard for example Michigan uses M. The highway behind my house is M-15 and singed that way so I would think it should be tagged that way. Am I reading the Wiki wrong? Back in September, I collected some statistics on states that use something other than the state abbreviation in way refs: https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-us/2014-September/013604.html tl;dr: 97% of Michigan's state routes are currently tagged with M or M-, and a couple other states are also contrarian in this regard. On 2014-11-29 19:40, Paul Johnson wrote: I'm going to say that the wiki is presently wrong compared to consensus previously arrived at on the tagging list regarding this issue the last 971151183 times that this has come up, largely as a result of previous efforts by NE2 to game the renderer... I think NE2's ref efforts have largely been undone in states where mappers disagreed. (I undid several of his edits where he tried to reduce refs to parenthesized numbers.) But in the case of Ohio, we were already using SR and have continued to use it. (Ohio's shields have no lettering on them, but blade signs, variable message boards, etc. do say SR.) Next door in Indiana, I think IN has pretty much taken over. In general, if you'd like to make systematic changes to data that seems intentional, it's a good idea to reach out to the mappers who entered it. And if you decide to go ahead with any ref editing, be sure to add any missing relations and relation roles. -- m...@nguyen.cincinnati.oh.us ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature)
On 2014-11-29 21:27, Dave Mansfield wrote: It makes sense the way you explain it. I was looking at it as a name of the route and thinking it should me the same as signs etc. But not the fact that routing engines and renderers will know it’s a state highway based on the state abbreviation. Do any routing engines currently care about prefixes on way refs? From what I've seen so far, most of the map styles that use the ref tag to distinguish route networks will recognize either the state abbreviation, SR, or SH. Some renderers use the prefix to choose a state-specific shield, assuming any unrecognized prefix is for a county route (white rectangle at higher zoom levels). MapQuest only recognizes state/provincial abbreviations. Not that we should place too much stock in individual renderer decisions. :-) -- m...@nguyen.cincinnati.oh.us ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] State highway refs (was Re: New I.D Feature)
On Sat, 2014-11-29 at 22:21 -0800, Minh Nguyen wrote: Do any routing engines currently care about prefixes on way refs? From what I've seen so far, most of the map styles that use the ref tag to distinguish route networks will recognize either the state abbreviation, SR, or SH. Some renderers use the prefix to choose a state-specific shield, assuming any unrecognized prefix is for a county route (white rectangle at higher zoom levels). MapQuest only recognizes state/provincial abbreviations. Not that we should place too much stock in individual renderer decisions. :-) OSRM doesn't know that, for example, TX 6 and SH 6 are the same highway. Once upon a time, I'd get directions that had things in them like: Turn right on TX 6 Continue on SH 6 Continue on TX 6 Continue on SH 6 Continue on TX 6 ... etc Granted, OSRM still doesn't handle it gracefully when another highway multiplexes for a stretch, but at least one might be able to figure out which highway one's supposed to stay on when it's ref'd the same across the board. When it's not, it becomes much trickier. -- Shawn K. Quinn skqu...@rushpost.com ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Directional suffixes on roads: yes or no?
On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 8:39 PM, Jack Burke burke...@gmail.com wrote: I have a question about how much effort should be put into adding directional suffixes to road names. Many counties around Atlanta have adopted directional suffixes for roads, both in incorporated areas as well as outside city limits. Usually all areas in the county use the same system, with directions denoted NE, SE, NW and SW from some standard point, although some cities tend to ignore the suffixes. Also, signage is inconsistent--some street signs bear the suffix while others on the same street don't. In most cases, the suffix is immaterial, and most people don't use it anyway. Use of it or not won't affect directions most of the time, although I know of a few specific cases where knowing the suffix can be important in finding the right location (is your house 100 Concord Road Southeast or Southwest?). The majority of the Tiger data doesn't include the suffix. Of course once TIGER is updated, then we will have a mismatch. As CENSUS incorporate new county road data into TIGER, the suffixes will start appearing. So, how much should I worry about the missing suffixes? Should they be included in the main name= tag? Or one of the other *name tags with the unsuffixed name in the name= tag. Because most people don't use the suffix, on some roads I've put the with-suffix name in the name= tag and the unsuffixed one in the short_name= tag, but I'm wondering if I should continue to bother. My small town has addresses with direction prefixes but most street signs are years old and just list the name. Businesses and locals use the suffix so I decided to add it to road names. I suspect as road signs are updated, they will get changed. It does remind me to ask the publics works department about that. I found my county GIS department easy to talk to. They are very helpful and want to see OSM have the correct data. I'd email them and ask them when the road signs will be changed. Clifford -- @osm_seattle osm_seattle.snowandsnow.us OpenStreetMap: Maps with a human touch ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Directional suffixes on roads: yes or no?
On Sat, 2014-11-29 at 22:43 -0600, John F. Eldredge wrote: An additional complication is ring-roads, which are likely to have XXX North transition into XXX East, etc. In Houston, it gets even weirder, going clockwise around the I-610 feeder roads: North Loop West, North Loop East, East Loop North, East Loop South, South Loop East, South Loop West, West Loop South, and then West Loop North. A similar situation exists for Beltway 8 and its Sam Houston Parkway addresses. Since Grand Parkway is far enough out that most of it is outside Harris County much less Houston, this may or may not be an issue there depending on how they decide to assign addresses along it. -- Shawn K. Quinn skqu...@rushpost.com ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
