[Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-21 Thread fernando . negro
I've been mentioning this, discretely, on this forum. But, after having finally expressed my concern more directly, on another thread (https://trisquel.info/en/forum/some-current-free-software-friendly-hardware#comment-42809) I just thought it was something important enough to make a thread o

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-21 Thread krofnica996
"And, even one about which I would like to hear, someday, what RMS has to say..." You use email and ask him any time.

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-21 Thread fernando . negro
For those who may not like the term "Free Hardware"... Remember that, a "Free Software" copy is also, ultimately, always a /physical/ copy. Be it, a DVD that one has burned, or part of the space on a drive that one has. So, the "copy" of a free software piece, is also a "physical copy". A

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-21 Thread fernando . negro
Yes. I know, from someone I met here, that he's a much more accessible person than I thought he was. And, maybe I'll do that, someday, when things get more calm for me and I have more time to do so. (Since, he's a person I respect very much, and which should deserve my full attention.) But,

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-21 Thread mampir
This is a topic that also concerns me. What can with do with the privacy and security issues of hardware? If I decided to manufacture CPU chips, how can I insure you that those chips respect your privacy and security?

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-21 Thread shiretoko
It is a very good question; you could provide documentation for your hardware which shows that there are no malicious circuits built in and allows people to make free software drivers for the device, but after all, no one can figure out if your documentation tells really the truth or not. We

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-21 Thread fernando . negro
Yes. In practical terms, most of the times, it all comes down to a matter of trust in the entity that ultimately provides you the product. Very few people also inspect the source code of the programs they use, and compare it with the compiled form in which such programs are distributed. (Be

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-21 Thread nux
There comes a point where privacy and security are simply not possible. If you use a PC, no matter what software you have installed you are vulnerable. And despite all the hooha about back doors, hidden spyware, etc, all ISP's (certainly in the UK and therefore almost certainly in all "Wester

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-21 Thread fernando . negro
Not wanting to drift from the initial topic... I'll just confirm (for the "privacy-concerned" ones, that read the above posted) that, that is indeed true. And, I've known that for years, from the same source that I linked to, when I quoted above some examples of "spychips". "By April of 200

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-21 Thread stask
Privacy and security concerns became more "real" for more people with the revelations of Snowden. Security is an ongoing and ever-changing thing. Always was. There are new exploits all the time, security is never fully achieved. Always trade offs. Online privacy in the form of being anonymo

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-21 Thread mikko . viinamaki
https://www.blackhat.com/html/bh-us-12/bh-us-12-archives.html#Brossard "backdooring of hardware is practical"

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-22 Thread fernando . negro
The "Internet of Things" concept, that you mentioned, just reminded me of the subsequent phenomenon of computerizing everything - even cars, now - and the risks that that poses to security. If anyone is thinking of buying a new car with a computer in it, here's a most worrying thing you sho

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-22 Thread stask
Well, that's bad but there are other things also. Like when timely payments are not recieved, the car can be remotely disabled. http://www.mattberkus.com/blog/miss-your-car-payment-car-gets-disabled/ But what if I have paid in full and now own the car? The "feature" may still be there. Why

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-22 Thread stask
Amazing link, thanks. Hardware backdoors. "Built on top of free software" (coreboot) in 4 weeks. Really, really, really hard to detect as malicious. 230 motherboards affected. Not dependent on an operating system. So much for free software. Laws would be nice, except plausible deniability

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-22 Thread chris
I've always felt Internet connected devices (like cell phones) and devices which record, track, etc are a really bad idea. That includes those non-technological things like license plates, social security numbers, and drivers licenses. Things people wouldn't normally associate with being da

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-23 Thread fernando . negro
Perhaps. But, as I said above, we should never facilitate this kind of access. And, avoid such as much as possible. As an example, the investigator recently interviewed here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfgZrRoflCI#t=30m09s - had his truck messed with, but was able to avoid being killed

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-23 Thread fernando . negro
"Russian Government Buys Typewriters to Prevent Intel Leaks" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRntCca21ec

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-23 Thread stask
Have to also add how using technology for mass surveillance is being reinforced with corporate propaganda. Coke and surveillance ad: "Let's look at the world a little differently." http://youtu.be/pETma-CDU6M Coke's brand position: http://www.coca-colacompany.com/coca-cola-unbottled/inter

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-23 Thread stask
Apparently they can bug typewriters too! That's what they say at the end of the clip. But at least that feature isn't built-in and easily activated remotely. Always something.

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-23 Thread aliasbody
My idea on this subject is pretty simple. When you get a computer you should have the "source code" the same way you are expecting it when buying (or downloading) software. Only this way we can innovate and unify ourselves as human beings. But this is not possible at this day because we are

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-26 Thread fernando . negro
https://trisquel.info/en/forum/secret-3g-intel-chip-gives-snoops-backdoor-pc-access

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-26 Thread stask
"…highlights the ability for an administrator to shut down PCs remotely “even if the PC is not connected to the network,” as well as the ability to bypass hard drive encryption." “Intel actually embedded the 3G radio chip in order to enable its Anti Theft 3.0 technology. And since that tech

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-26 Thread chris
I'd read that article with a bit of skepticism. While it points out issues that we really should be concerned about 3g being integrated in the CPU is not realistic. It would almost certainly be easy to detect. More than likely the article is written by someone who doesn't understand the techn

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-26 Thread nux
There's a reasonable chance that this stuff is aimed at Corporate espionage, spying on other nation's military/Governments and making sure that journalists with access to juicy stuff don't get ideas into their heads.

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-26 Thread nux
And what network is it going to connect with? Inductive scanning. Much like RFID chips give up thir information when scanned, why not a powered down pc too? Surely it's just a matter of the power applied to the scan? Several years ago it was reported that the ability had been obtained to scan

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-27 Thread fernando . negro
Responses to that here: https://trisquel.info/en/forum/secret-3g-intel-chip-gives-snoops-backdoor-pc-access#comment-43162

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-27 Thread chris
I'm not saying that it couldn't be done technically. It would be an awful way of implementing it though. It would be better to do it as they appear to have done it. VIA a GSM module using SMS or TCP/IP over wifi/ethernet. The TCIP/IP thing wouldn't be instant. You would have to connect to the

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-28 Thread fernando . negro
Ah. Nice... :) RMS ended up (inadvertently) answering my question, in his lecture given at the GNU's 30th anniversary celebrations. (So, there's no need to e-mail him, any more, about this...) He talks about the need to encourage a "Free/Libre Hardware Movement", due to the same concerns

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-28 Thread gramex
"I do think that the various Gnu licences need updating to include strict clauses stopping their use in drones or any devices which can be used to monitor people without their being aware or kill them or in anything that compromises people's right to privacy, security or freedom." Why shoul

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-28 Thread gramex
Another link: http://www.gnu.org/licenses/hessla.html

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-29 Thread Miguel Guasch
Thanks for the links! Do you know where I could find more videos/audios on lectures/speeches by RMS? On 09/29/2013 02:54 AM, fernando.ne...@mail.ru wrote: Ah. Nice... :) RMS ended up (inadvertently) answering my question, in his lecture given at the GNU's 30th anniversary celebrations. (So, t

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-29 Thread mikko . viinamaki
>Thanks for the links! Do you know where I could find more videos/audios on lectures/speeches by RMS? Here's some older material http://audio-video.gnu.org/ And if you don't mind the privacy implications I'm sure you can find something also on youtube (ewww)

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-29 Thread Miguel Guasch
On 09/29/2013 10:15 AM, mikko.viinam...@students.turkuamk.fi wrote: >Thanks for the links! Do you know where I could find more videos/audios on lectures/speeches by RMS? Here's some older material http://audio-video.gnu.org/ And if you don't mind the privacy implications I'm sure you can find

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-29 Thread fernando . negro
Hi there. The link that I posted, to a video from yesterday's lecture, is one of two files that "jxself" (user of this forum) uploaded to his web site, and that are listed here: https://trisquel.info/en/forum/video-stream-gnu-30th-birthday#comment-43278 And, concerning other lectures/spee

Re: [Trisquel-users] "Million dollar" question concerning the hardware we use

2013-09-29 Thread bruceharrisperry
Personally I think that if the spying continues, other countries will start up their own hardware manufacturing facilities but it may not be exportable to to the US. Perhaps those of you young enough can make plans to emigrate [snark]