Why did the Unicode Consortium think that combination of one base
character and few combining is possible, and combination of few base
characters with one combining character is not?
E.g. U+0483 tilda has to cover a number. Whole number! Not one
figure!! What for have we it, if we can't use it
Am Montag, 14. November 2011 um 13:37 schrieb QSJN 4 UKR:
Q4U Why did the Unicode Consortium think that combination of one base
Q4U character and few combining is possible, and combination of few base
Q4U characters with one combining character is not?
This is not the case. You find a recently
That is not what he asked. He wants more than one base character to combine
with a single combining mark.
If you have convincing evidence for combining marks not covered there
(e.g. tilde above spanning over three or more characters), please let
us know.
It is quite typical for old Slavic or Georgian texts to find a
tilde/titlo over more than two characters. E.g. Church Slavonic
contractions 'son'
Am Montag, 14. November 2011 um 14:16 schrieb Shriramana Sharma:
SS ... He wants more than one base character
SS to combine with a single combining mark.
This is what can be accomplished by the characters proposed in
http://std.dkuug.dk/JTC1/SC2/WG2/docs/n4078.pdf , if you take into
Shriramana Sharma, the mark and character have different meanings
here: 2 or 3 diacritics characters can encode a single mark (and this
is exactly the case of the referred document and situation descibed by
QSN 4 UKR, but he speaks about combining tilde/titlo above).
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 5:16
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 5:25 PM, Karl Pentzlin karl-pentz...@acssoft.de wrote:
SS ... He wants more than one base character
SS to combine with a single combining mark.
This is what can be accomplished by the characters proposed in
http://std.dkuug.dk/JTC1/SC2/WG2/docs/n4078.pdf
E.g. if we
Am Montag, 14. November 2011 um 14:15 schrieb satai:
s It is quite typical for old Slavic or Georgian texts to find a
s tilde/titlo over more than two characters. ...
s There should be some general (not Coptic only) encoding for these
s cases. ...
While some of the characters in the Combining
Am Montag, 14. November 2011 um 14:37 schrieb satai:
s E.g. if we take designation of number 123 in Cyrillic, it should be
s РКГ below the single titlo/tilde. How N4078 handles it? (I mean
s particular characters sequence)
If you want РКГ with a tilde applied (as substitute for the
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Karl Pentzlin karl-pentz...@acssoft.de wrote:
If you want РКГ with a tilde applied (as substitute for the
not-yet-encoded multiple titlo), the character sequence is:
Р
U+FE22 COMBINING DOUBLE TILDE LEFT HALF
К
U+FE26 COMBINING CONJOINING MACRON
Г
U+FE23
Unicode was created for a commercial reason, particularly for the benefit
of its directors. The idea of Plain Text is not anything practical but was
used as a means of attracting supporters, who for the most part hadn't had
any experience with computers.
The following line is Unicode text:
මේ
Unicode was created for a commercial reason, particularly for the
benefit of its directors. [...]
I won't comment this tirade.
The following line is Unicode text:
මේ අකුරු ලියා ඇත්තේ යුනිකෝඩ් අකුරෙනි.
This Sinhala text looks just fine on my GNU/Linux box using the Mew
email reader within
On 14 Nov 2011, at 15:30, Naena Guru wrote:
Unicode was created for a commercial reason, particularly for the benefit of
its directors.
This is incorrect.
The idea of Plain Text is not anything practical but was used as a means of
attracting supporters, who for the most part hadn't had
Hi.
From: Naena Guru naenaguru_at_gmail.com
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 09:30:40 -0600
Unicode was created for a commercial reason, particularly for the benefit
of its directors.
I expect that it benefits more than just its directors (I don't expect anyone
to act completely pro-bono; people
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 7:30 PM, Naena Guru naenag...@gmail.com wrote:
The idea of Plain Text is not anything practical but was used
as a means of attracting supporters, who for the most part hadn't had any
experience with computers.
Do you think experienced users enjoy squeezing through tones
I cannot even imagine where you get your weird ideas.
Unicode is a non-profit organization with a diverse membership; I’m proud to be
one of the individual members.
The Unicode standard is aligned and developed in synch with ISO/IEC 10646
(essentially as a joint effort);
10606 is being
Am Montag, 14. November 2011 um 15:57 schrieb satai:
s I do not see it in N4078, did I miss something? As I can see N4078
s defines sequences (U+FE20,U+FE26,U+FE21), (U+FE27,U+FE2B,U+FE28),
s (U+FE29,U+FE2B,U+FE2A). Is (U+FE22,U+FE26,U+FE23) implicitly
s introduced? If yes, it is worth to explain
QSJN 4 UKR asks, Why did the Unicode Consortium think that combination of one
base character and few combining is possible, and combination of few base
characters with one combining character is not?
E.g. U+0483 tilda has to cover a number. Whole number!
For mathematical constructs in general,
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 8:56 PM, Karl Pentzlin karl-pentz...@acssoft.de wrote:
In my eyes, the sequence (U+FE22,U+FE26,U+FE23) in fact is
implicitly introduced, as otherwise the whole mechanism would be not
systematic.
I agree. But in my humble opinion it is not completely clear, because
one
One more comment:
The idea of Plain Text is not anything practical but was used as a means of
attracting supporters, who for the most part hadn't had any experience with
computers.
I received Naenu's message as plain text -- that is, as character codes
without accompanying font or layout
Wouldn't this create redundancy?
On Mon, 14 Nov 2011 18:46:19 +0530, Shriramana Sharma
samj...@gmail.com wrote:
That is not what he asked. He wants more than one base character to
combine
with a single combining mark.
2011/11/14 Karl Pentzlin karl-pentz...@acssoft.de:
If anybody has a convincing example of a tilde spanning over more than
two characters, please tell, maybe then a revision of WG2 N4078 or a
supplemental document for it can be made, containing that sequence.
Change the tilde for the macron (or
And arguably, I have also wanted this since long, instead of the hacks
introduced by the so called double diacritics and half diacritics
that break the character identity of those diacritics and also
introduce encoding ambiguities.
In fact, those things would have been encoded since long if
Shriramana,
The question you raise relates to the problem of font rendering. According
to the Open Type standard, each script, i.e. Latin, Tamil etc. have their
own rules on how letters are constructed and displayed. For instance, when
you write 'ke' in Tamil, the kavanna is preceded by the
If you use the same underlying text code, you could still differentiate
languages by fonts. It is a different way of looking at the problem. This
is true in the case of transliterated Indic. I haven't given thought as to
how that could be implemented with BIDI. When you compare benefits Indic
On 11/14/2011 7:30 AM, Naena Guru wrote:
Unicode was created for a commercial reason, particularly for the
benefit of its directors.
This statement, not backed up by evidence, indicates a rather
rudimentary understanding of the forces that were behind the creation of
the universal character
This thread presumes that display is, by orders of magnitude, the most
important aspect of text processing, and that every other operation that
could be performed on text is secondary. Different writing systems all
represented as font changes, using the same character codes. Backing
text streams
On 11/14/2011 6:09 AM, Karl Pentzlin wrote:
Am Montag, 14. November 2011 um 14:37 schrieb satai:
s E.g. if we take designation of number 123 in Cyrillic, it should be
s РКГ below the single titlo/tilde. How N4078 handles it? (I mean
s particular characters sequence)
If you want РКГ with a
If it came out as Unicode has its only goal as money making, that is not
what I meant to say. Nothing can be such. You sell something for the
buyer's benefit, right? I apologize if you feel hurt over it. However, it
is probably the main objective. Who works for nothing except odd crazies
like me?
On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 3:14 AM, delex r del...@indiatimes.com wrote:
Naena Guru wrote:
I have not read the entire thread of this conversation. It looks as if
the debate has reached a level of acrimony.
It is available since 1st week of September, 2011. Since 8th
September,2011 to be exact.
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 7:30 AM, Naena Guru naenag...@gmail.com wrote:
Unicode was created for a commercial reason, particularly for the benefit of
its directors.
Pretty much. So? The concept that a bunch of computer companies should
come together to make one encoding that makes it cheap and
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 1:52 PM, Naena Guru naenag...@gmail.com wrote:
Having said all that, all is not so bad. I say transliterate to Latin and
make smartfonts. It is a proven success.
Really. Because every case I know of, differing font standards have
made it a complete pain. For over a
Naena Guru naenaguru at gmail dot com wrote:
If it came out as Unicode has its only goal as money making, that is not what
I meant to say. Nothing can be such. You sell something for the buyer's
benefit, right?
Unicode doesn't sell anything, except (I suppose) printed copies of the
standard
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 1:52 PM, Naena Guru naenag...@gmail.com wrote:
As for, every other operation that could be performed on text is secondary
is beautifully met with fonts too.
No. Every operation besides simple storage and display needs to know
how that font maps the 8-bit codes to display
Thank you Asmus,
I made many here very angry. They have put in a lot toward bringing up the
standard, and therefore, it is understandable. Evidence in these things can
never be proven, it only makes people madder. Besides, I worded wrongly to
give the impression that it is the only motive. That
On 11/14/2011 2:39 PM, Naena Guru wrote:
On the other hand, no company would send people to work at Unicode if
they did not have an economic interest.
One might as well rephrase that as:
No company would send people to work at *any standard* if they did not
have an economic interest.
And
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 2:39 PM, Naena Guru naenag...@gmail.com wrote:
I should not have even said anything here as I know that there is an
alternative approach that does not hurt Unicode and hopefully its fans.
I already told you that your approach cost Project Gutenberg time and
effort. In
We don't know exactly the reasons why James has closed his website or
even his support for this font. But if he really was alone he probably
did not havethe money to support the site, or the bandwidth used for
it (may be he's now in financial troubles, like loss of his job in
this hard times). Or
2011/11/15 Ken Whistler k...@sybase.com:
Many hundreds of people have been volunteering time now for 23 years to
help in the development of the Unicode Standard. But the fact that major
information technology companies also see it in their economic interest
to assist in the development of the
For you to be able to read Sinhala Unicode two things must happen. First,
like for all text, the font has to be present. The systems sold outside Sri
Lanka do not have Sinhala Unicode, which is understandable because the
community is very small.
Then there are cases where even if you have the
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 15:55:52 -0800
From: David Starner prosfil...@gmail.com
Cc: Unicode Mailing List unicode@unicode.org
Standards compliant and
elegant solution. See it here:
www.lovatasinhala.com/
Do not use IE. If you use Firefox, sometimes you need to pick another page
to see
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 15:31:37 -0800
From: Ken Whistler k...@sybase.com
CC: Ken Whistler k...@sybase.com
the fact that major information technology companies also see it in
their economic interest to assist in the development of the
standard, and even more importantly, to *implement* the
From: Doug Ewell d...@ewellic.org
Cc: unicode@unicode.org, Dr. Kusum Perera kusum...@gmail.com,
CE Whitehead cewcat...@hotmail.com
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 15:30:00 -0700
I'm sorry, but I don't understand why this argument tends to
concentrate on claims that were never made in the first
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 10:34 PM, Eli Zaretskii e...@gnu.org wrote:
I'm sorry, but I don't understand why this argument tends to
concentrate on claims that were never made in the first place. The
OP's intent was very clear even to a non-native English speaker such
as myself.
It was sort of
On Mon, Nov 14, 2011 at 10:12 PM, Eli Zaretskii e...@gnu.org wrote:
It's not standards compliant. If it doesn't work on IE, and sometimes
doesn't work on Firefox, then it hardly qualifies as a solution in my
book, especially as I'm getting nivahal heøa as the label on its tag
FWIW, the latest
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