À 17:31 2004-07-27, Mike Ayers a écrit:
Oddly, that was the pedantic explanation I sought.
[Alain] Am I supposed to find this nice?
Boy, is my face red. I used pedantic instead of pedagogic. My sincere apologies.
[Alain] Accepted. Funny too! (^8
I invite all those interested to join
Alain LaBont alb at sct1 dot gouv dot qc dot ca wrote:
However IBM PCs did something else, and their groups are limited to 3
levels.
and again:
[Alain] There is no penalty, you can have as many groups as you want.
Do not make a confusion with PC implementations which are limited to 3
À 18:24 2004-07-26, Mike Ayers a écrit:
In less pedantic
terms:
SNIP/
Oddly, that was
the pedantic explanation I sought.
[Alain] Am I supposed to find this nice?
Any national
group is group 1 by definition according to ISO/IEC 9995.
Group 2 is a Latin supplementary group to access
those
À 02:38 2004-07-27, Doug Ewell a écrit:
In what way are PC keyboards necessarily limited to 3 levels? I can
easily construct a PC keyboard layout using MSKLC in which characters
are assigned to Shift+AltGr keystrokes. In fact, the standard
US-International keyboard comes like this.
[Alain] I
Title: RE: Much better Latin-1 keyboard for Windows
From: Alain LaBonté [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2004 5:59 AM
À 18:24 2004-07-26, Mike Ayers a écrit:
In less pedantic terms:
SNIP/
Oddly, that was the pedantic explanation I sought.
[Alain] Am
Mike Ayers a crit:
RE: Much better Latin-1 keyboard for Windows
[Alain] As I said in my previous mail, these definitions
are
not the best of definitions. The distinction is but
intuitive, you have to see the diagrams where labeling makes
the difference:
SNIP/
I don't have
At 13:00 2004-07-23, Mike Ayers wrote:
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
On Behalf Of Alain LaBonté
Sent: Friday, July 23, 2004 5:39 AM
[Alain] There is no « plane » at all in ISO/IEC
9995. This is ISO/IEC
10646 terminology, which also has a term called
group, but it is not
To: Mike Ayers
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 07:24
Subject: RE: Much better Latin-1 keyboard
for Windows
At 13:00 2004-07-23, Mike Ayers wrote:
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
On Behalf Of Alain LaBont Sent: Friday, July 23,
2004 5:39 AM
Mark Davis wrote:
In practice, the keyboards I have seen with an additional level
generally need and use a pair of additional levels. The issue is that
if a lowercase character x is on a level, then you want to be able to
get the uppercase version of it X by using that same level plus a
À 11:15 2004-07-26, Mark Davis a écrit:
a European national keyboard
is by itself in general a keyboard group composed of three levels (one
unshifted, one shifted, one obtained with AltGr).
In practice, the keyboards I have seen with an additional
level generally need and use a pair of
At 10:24 -0400 2004-07-26, Alain LaBonté wrote:
In less pedantic terms:
a standard American keyboard layout is by
itself a keyboard group composed of two levels
(one unshifted, one shifted).
a European national keyboard is by itself in
general a keyboard group composed of three
levels (one
À 14:32 2004-07-26, Michael Everson a écrit:
At 10:24 -0400 2004-07-26, Alain LaBonté wrote:
In less pedantic terms:
a standard American keyboard layout is by itself a keyboard group
composed of two levels (one unshifted, one shifted).
a European national keyboard is by itself in general a
À 11:40 2004-07-26, Doug Ewell a écrit:
Mark Davis wrote:
In practice, the keyboards I have seen with an additional level
generally need and use a pair of additional levels. The issue is that
if a lowercase character x is on a level, then you want to be able to
get the uppercase version of it
Title: RE: Much better Latin-1 keyboard for Windows
From: Alain LaBonté [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 7:24 AM
[Alain] Here are the pedantic definitions of ISO/IEC 9995-1 (1994
version, which will be revised this year, most likely). There is no
other notion
On Sat, 24 Jul 2004 18:51:04 +0200, busmanus wrote:
My intuition would suggest, that the language setting should be
independently modifiable if necessary from within the editor you are
working with, rather than having different language versions for
otherwise identical keyboard layouts.
À 17:16 2004-07-22, Michael Everson a écrit:
I've never understood this keyboard philosophy. Its groups and planes
terminology just doesn't make sense to me (as someone who has designed
keyboard layouts for well over a decade). I like good old-fashioned
dead-keys and four keyboard states
Title: RE: Much better Latin-1 keyboard for Windows
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Alain LaBonté
Sent: Friday, July 23, 2004 5:39 AM
[Alain] There is no « plane » at all in ISO/IEC 9995. This is ISO/IEC
10646 terminology, which also has a term called
On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 08:38:36 -0400, Alain LaBont wrote:
The concept of group and group selection [...] was taken into
consideration by ISO with the intent to extend it to multiple
groups. However the multiple group model, if it exists, has not
been standarized yet and deployed fully in its
On Thu, 22 Jul 2004 16:38:29 -0400, Alain LaBont wrote:
keyboard layout standards are based on abstract characters, not on coding
I followed the WG2 suggestion presented in Resolution M45.21 and
completely dropped away the ISO/IEC 6947 compatibility for our
Roamanian keyboard standard.
At
On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 22:59:58 +0300, Cristian Secar wrote:
I followed the WG2 suggestion presented in Resolution M45.21 and
completely dropped away the ISO/IEC 6947 compatibility [...]
Ahm ... I meant ISO/IEC 6937, sorry.
Cristi
Michael Everson scripsit:
Interesting. There seems to be no explanation of the seven keyboard
states shown in the graphic at ga-keys-x.gif. Can you explicate them?
Hm? The shift, alt, and caps lock keys are shown depressed in the drawings.
Ah, that strange glyph is Alt, or rather AltGr,
À 02:32 2004-07-18, John Cowan a écrit:
http://www.livejournal.com/users/gwalla/39856.html is a page about
(and a link to) a truly excellent Windows keyboard driver that
provides full access to the Latin-1 range but is completely compatible
with the US-ASCII keyboard except for AltGr (the right
At 16:38 -0400 2004-07-22, Alain LaBonté wrote:
It would have been nice if this keyboard would
have been based (for its second layout) on
ISO/IEC 9995-3 International Standard. The
latter is based on the following philosophy:
-Group 1 is the national (or prefered layout)
[in the USA that
Michael Everson scripsit:
Please see the specification of the Irish
Extended keyboard for Unicode, at
http://www.evertype.com/celtscript/ga-keys-x.html
Interesting. There seems to be no explanation of the seven keyboard
states shown in the graphic at ga-keys-x.gif. Can you explicate them?
At 18:44 -0400 2004-07-22, John Cowan wrote:
Michael Everson scripsit:
Please see the specification of the Irish
Extended keyboard for Unicode, at
http://www.evertype.com/celtscript/ga-keys-x.html
Interesting. There seems to be no explanation of the seven keyboard
states shown in the graphic
Jowh Cowan writes
http://www.livejournal.com/users/gwalla/39856.html is a page about
(and a link to) a truly excellent Windows keyboard driver that
provides full access to the Latin-1 range
Latin-1 is not everything! If you need to transcribe
Arabic/Hebrew/Sanskrit/Farsi, you will need the
Raymond Mercier scripsit:
Jowh Cowan writes
Jowh?
Latin-1 is not everything! If you need to transcribe
Arabic/Hebrew/Sanskrit/Farsi, you will need the macrons on vowels (Latin
Extended-A) and various dot-under letters (Latin Extended Additional). I
made my own layout using the DDK.
No, it
Thanks for this info. I've been used to thinking in terms of deadkeys or
Alt(Gr)- combos as alternative approaches, each with different advantages. For
me using an Alt(Gr)- combo as a deadkey seems to defeat the advantage of having
an AltGr key: In non-English European language keyboard layouts of
From: John Cowan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.livejournal.com/users/gwalla/39856.html is a page about
(and a link to) a truly excellent Windows keyboard driver that
provides full access to the Latin-1 range but is completely compatible
with the US-ASCII keyboard except for AltGr (the right
Donald Z. Osborn [EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb am 18.07.04 17:17:49:
Thanks for this info. I've been used to thinking in terms of deadkeys or
Alt(Gr)- combos as alternative approaches, each with different advantages. For
me using an Alt(Gr)- combo as a deadkey seems to defeat the advantage of
On 2004.07.18, 15:44, Donald Z. Osborn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
AltGr key: In non-English European language keyboard layouts of
course it permits access to accented characters without use of
deadkeys.
The one non-English European language keyboard layout I'm using right
now (pt-PT), AltGr
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