Richard,
Beyond that, what other things might help make the value of choosing Rev
more self-evident?
The value's there. The problem isn't the tool, it's communicating what
the tool has already accomplished.
RR is like a cult - much like ska music - it has a worldwide following,
it's
The inherent value proposition for Rev as a pro development tool is
demonstrably high, and after 14 years there are sufficient examples
to make a compelling case.
If the case is not immediately compelling today, what changes could
be made at the RunRev site and lesser marketing materials to
an organized place for things like
release announcements, Plat-x issues, Heather news, etc...
! This made me laugh. Heather news? Is that like the weather, only about a
creeping heath plant? Today the heather is growing well on the mountains,
och aye indeed, and will be blooming in the gloamin
On 07.08.2004, at 19:19, Dan Shafer wrote:
At the end of the day, RR has to find niches where cross-platform
development is important or even critical. Those niches exist. But
they are not mainstream programmers on either platform (and certainly
not on *nix, whose developers seem to prefer Open
On Aug 7, 2004, at 11:23 PM, Wolfgang M.Bereuter wrote:
Dan, why do they not listen to you at RR?
They do. They don't always agree, but they do listen. Kevin and I have
fairly regular dialog on these subjects.
~~
Dan Shafer, Revolutionary
Author of
Ken Ray wrote:
On 8/7/04 10:57 PM, Chipp Walters [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I take both InfoWorld and EWeek. Both have had multiple articles about
the 'disenfranchisment' (is that a word?) of VB developers with .NET
This is more I think about VB developers not wanting to go to .NET because
it
--- Ken Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On 8/7/04 10:57 PM, Chipp Walters
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I take both InfoWorld and EWeek. Both have had
multiple articles about
the 'disenfranchisment' (is that a word?) of VB
developers with .NET
This is more I think about VB developers not
Dan Shafer wrote:
On Aug 7, 2004, at 2:47 PM, Ken Ray wrote:
*Here* is where Rev (and other tools of its ilk) *can* make inroads. All
that it takes is enough compelling evidence that RunRev isn't going
anywhere, that the underlying engine has been around for a decade, and
that
it is the most
Chipp.
You knew I'd have to chime in here. :-)
Not simply to be contrarian, but I do not believe RR has any serious
chance of making real inroads into other platforms. Period. No matter
what they do. Over the decades -- yes, decades! -- I've been in this
business, I bet I've seen 100 or
On Aug 7, 2004, at 2:15 AM, Chipp Walters wrote:
And remember, both Flash and Director found some success on PC's, and
originally shipped with an Xtalk language.
This is mostly true, though Flash never really had an XTalk language,
it had a unique (and very basic) scripting language which
On Aug 7, 2004, at 1:19 PM, Dan Shafer wrote:
At the end of the day, RR has to find niches where cross-platform
development is important or even critical. Those niches exist. But
they are not mainstream programmers on either platform (and certainly
not on *nix, whose developers seem to prefer
Troy.
On Aug 7, 2004, at 10:55 AM, Troy Rollins wrote:
So far as I can see, the only way to develop X-plat using a single
code-base with XCode would be to do so in Java, and I'm not sure I'm
interested in that route.
Don't get caught in THAT trap. I have several friends who are serious
Java
On Aug 7, 2004, at 2:18 PM, Dan Shafer wrote:
BTW, in my earlier too-long contribution to this dialog, I neglected
to say that if I were writing apps for OS X only, I'd probably be
inclined to learn and use Objective C and XCode.
XCode is *almost* enough to make me want to be a Mac-only
Thanks for this debate, Dan and Chipp,
Best Regards, Pierre
Le 7 août 04, à 19:19, Dan Shafer a écrit :
Chipp.
You knew I'd have to chime in here. :-)
Not simply to be contrarian, but I do not believe RR has any serious
chance of making real inroads into other platforms. Period. No matter
Troy,
coding. If that could be strengthened with more graphics functionality
(both 2D and 3D) I probably wouldn't bother looking around, or needing
to constantly switch tools based on project requirements.
While looking at some graphic functions theory and how to translate,
Actionscript,
[snip] For me, the one big failing in
Revolution is and always will be its lack of object orientation. But I
remain willing to forego that lack in return for the ability to develop
Windows apps without having to use Windows all day to do it.
Dan,
That's just a matter of algorithmic and
On Aug 7, 2004, at 3:12 PM, MisterX wrote:
While looking at some graphic functions theory and how to translate,
Actionscript, java to TS, I noticed that the 3D in Flash is simply
anymations
made in Swivel3D. The rest is just smart line handling.
This is true, Flash is not much of a 3D
Le 7 août 04, à 20:18, Dan Shafer a écrit :
They're using Java almost exclusively for server-side stuff these
days; very few new apps are being written in pure Java for xplat
deployment.
And on the server-side, Java is only usable to code WEB / EAI
applications servers, mainly not as is in
On Saturday, August 7, 2004, at 10:19 AM, Dan Shafer wrote:
Chipp.
You knew I'd have to chime in here. :-)
Not simply to be contrarian, but I do not believe RR has any serious
chance of making real inroads into other platforms. ...
Brilliant!
Mark
On 8/7/04 12:19 PM, Dan Shafer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Chipp.
You knew I'd have to chime in here. :-)
Not simply to be contrarian, but I do not believe RR has any serious
chance of making real inroads into other platforms.
Dan, you make a very compelling argument about the use
Ken
Good observations based (obviously) on experience. You may be right,
though I wonder how easily this kind of market is located and tapped.
Other comments below.
On Aug 7, 2004, at 2:47 PM, Ken Ray wrote:
However, I would disagree with you when it comes to the
small-to-medium-sized
While I think that's fundamentally true, it's also true that they look
at total cost of ownership. And the big question that *I* hear when I
propose to use Revolution to do a project centers on the question of
long-term maintenance. That question, in turn, has two parts: (1) how
long will the
Dan Shafer wrote:
Chipp.
You knew I'd have to chime in here. :-)
Not simply to be contrarian, but I do not believe RR has any serious
chance of making real inroads into other platforms. Period.
Dan,
Chiming back atcha! Dan, you do make a compelling argument, but I
suggest 3 components
On 8/7/04 10:06 PM, Chipp Walters [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Not to mention all of the alienated VB programmers MS created when it
dumped VB in favor of .NET. And now they're getting rid of VB all together!
Really? Could you provide a link where you saw that? Just curious...
Ken Ray
Sons of
Chipp.
You make some good points but they aren't really counters to my
thoughts. Rather they are sort of orthogonal segues.
I did not mean to say or imply that I wish Rev would simply stop
supporting other platforms. That would make their program useless to me
as an OS X developer. What I
Dan Shafer wrote:
(1) how
long will the company (RunRev) be around; and
Good question. Well, let's see, the engine has been around for 10 years.
You know the rest. Besides, how long is VB around for? Currently MS is
still providing minor tech support, and no bug fixes. So, you need to
Hi Ken,
I take both InfoWorld and EWeek. Both have had multiple articles about
the 'disenfranchisment' (is that a word?) of VB developers with .NET
And you know the last version of VB before .NET will no soon no longer
be supported.
The latest I've heard from Chris, who stays on top of this
On 8/7/04 10:57 PM, Chipp Walters [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I take both InfoWorld and EWeek. Both have had multiple articles about
the 'disenfranchisment' (is that a word?) of VB developers with .NET
This is more I think about VB developers not wanting to go to .NET because
it represents a
On Aug 7, 2004, at 4:20 PM, Dan Shafer wrote:
(2) if Dan gets run over by a dinosaur, how easy will it be for me to
find another Rev developer?
I agree that this is a stumbling block. Seems to me that a good way to
deal with this is to have RunRev develop a code escrow replacement
programmer
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