Hi David
Great post! Reminds me of something I saw last night on Russia Today,
Keiser Report about JPMorgan and co. They always win, no matter what. And
you've just hit the nail on the head.
But that goes as far as RD goes, which is one issue. Your way of doing it
adequately solves those
An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 21:21 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
On the contrary, the Arbitration Committee has the responsibility and the
power. That they do not discharge the full
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Gesendet: 0:07 Freitag, 6.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
The dispute resolution page is a little bit of a mess
On Sep 6, 2013 6:01 PM, Steven Zhang cro0...@gmail.com wrote:
You are entitled to your opinion. I don't agree with it, and I don't feel
you should say that everyone is wrong but yourself. Cheerio.
Steve
Sent from my iPhone
When replying to mailing list posts, you should quote what you're
On 7 Sep 2013, at 8:14 am, Lars Gardenius lars.garden...@yahoo.de wrote:
Sorry, but I didn't say that everone, but me, is wrong.
I said that I believe that you are wrong concerning this question.
Regards,
Lars Gardenius
Fair enough. I have to agree with the comments made by Marc
- Original Message -
From: Josh Lim jamesjoshua...@yahoo.com
To: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2013 6:01 AM
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
I think what we need to consider here is where the loyalties
.
Regards,
Lars Gardenius
Von: Josh Lim jamesjoshua...@yahoo.com
An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 6:01 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
I think what we
On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 10:18 AM, Lars Gardenius lars.garden...@yahoo.de wrote:
No I don't think it is being addressed. Not in a serious way.
You mean it's not _solved_. Indeed.
At least one problem was mentioned in the thread which is that the
(honest, knowledgeable) newbies have
: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 10:18 AM, Lars Gardenius lars.garden...@yahoo.de wrote:
No I don't think it is being addressed. Not in a serious way.
You mean it's not _solved_. Indeed.
At least one problem was mentioned in the thread which
and
with the authority to uphold them.
Regards,
Lars Gardenius
Von: Peter Gervai grin...@gmail.com
An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 10:50 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from
Sorry, but I'm not agree with your note, Anders.
My home WP is not en: (it's uk: in fact) but everything being discussed is
very (100%) applicable for our community.
Lucky you are in se:WP that you have no similar issues/problems but perhaps
you've collected some magical know-how how to avoid
It is no magic
*yearly reelection of administrators/sysops has meant no bullying types
are sysops any more
*we are a small community with just a few hundred active. And we have
decided to treat everyone (who are serious) as valuable individuals,
and go a very long way to make all feeling
List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 23:08 Mittwoch, 4.September 2013
Betreff: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
Greetings to All
Let me start by saying that I don't do much here at the WP, not compared
to
people who make hundreds of edits a week. I
That's Sweden all right, it's like a small town. Thousands of
administrators from scores of countries is another matter. Even requests
for administration is very difficult as, unless you do big time research,
or spend your life monitoring others edits and activity, you just don't
know much. Voting
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Gesendet: 14:22 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
I wouldn't say dispute
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Gesendet: 14:22 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
I wouldn't say dispute resolution has never worked, nor does it not work
now. It could use improvement, but the same
I doubt that scale is only thing which matters.
As to me both enWP and ukWP suffers from lack of community (extremely
important word in Anders' comment) as that despite the fact that fist is
much larger 'town' (even 'city') than svWP, and second is small 'village'.
I mean community solid enough
Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
I wouldn't say dispute resolution has never worked, nor does it not work now.
It could use improvement, but the same could be said about everything (and
like most things, shortages
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fredb...@fairpoint.net fredb...@fairpoint.net
Gesendet: 15:15 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
I've worked extensively with dispute resolution on English Wikipedia (I have
conducted surveys
Von: Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net
An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 14:39 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
That's Sweden all right, it's like a small town
An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 15:09 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
For a serious discussion to happen you will need to disclose some
examples. The next step is to move beyond anecdote to see
cro0...@gmail.com
An: Lars Gardenius lars.garden...@yahoo.de
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fredb...@fairpoint.net fredb...@fairpoint.net
Gesendet: 15:15 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
I've
An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 15:09 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
For a serious discussion to happen you will need to disclose some
examples. The next step is to move beyond anecdote to see
On 09/05/2013 04:18 AM, Lars Gardenius wrote:
That Wikipedia:Dispute resolution mirrors a very naive approach in a
worldwide organization. It has never worked before and it doesn't work now.
Where doesn't work is mostly defined as didn't give the result I
demanded.
I've been part of that
Yes, that is pretty much the situation. The howls of outraged anguish
from those who were not able to dictate (really bad) content or practices
form the core of our organized opposition. That does not mean systemic
deficiencies don't exist; just that we must look and think in a noisy
environment.
On 09/05/2013 11:49 AM, Lars Gardenius wrote:
But if your child is mobbed at a Wiki when he/she tries to contribute, or
your grandmother is being abused when she contributes to a Wiki, you want
somewhere to turn. As said there is no such instance in the Wikis, there is
noone responsible how
] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
On 09/05/2013 11:49 AM, Lars Gardenius wrote:
But if your child is mobbed at a Wiki when he/she tries to contribute, or
your grandmother is being abused when she contributes to a Wiki, you want
somewhere to turn. As said there is no such instance
2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
On 09/05/2013 11:49 AM, Lars Gardenius wrote:
But if your child is mobbed at a Wiki when he/she tries to contribute,
or your grandmother is being abused when she contributes to a Wiki, you
want somewhere to turn
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
Lars,
Please put your cards on the table. What are your suggested changes?
Fred
I am also more interested in processes than discussing special cases. I
think that was also the meaning of Rui Correia's letter starting
.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
That is just a re-invention of the Arbitration Committee. People from an
external source nearly always have a fatal flaw; they don't understand
how Wikipedia works. More informed people could man
or old folks, women or men.
Regards,
Lars Gardenius
Von: Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net
An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 18:03 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from
Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net
An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 18:03 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from
itself
Yes, that is pretty much the situation. The howls of outraged anguish
from those who
Gardenius
Von: Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net
An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
CC: wikie...@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 13:28 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from
Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
Should not this discussion be held on he maillist for English wikipedia?
There is not much, if any, of what is being discussed that I can
recognize from my home wp
Anders
Fred Bauder
On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 4:16 PM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote:
It is addressed but by a rather complicated and demanding process. See
Wikipedia:Dispute resolution. Not really workable for new users who bump
up against well-established users who have bad habits, or have learned
that
No thank you, I do not have a dispute; you do; please follow the dispute
resolution procedure.
Fred
Hi Tom
Thanks for your contribution. However, you seem to have missed the point.
So Lisa violates the 3RR principle and you lecture me. And I lodge a
complaint over the 3RR and that gets
Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net
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Gesendet: 13:28 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
At wikie...@lists.wikimedia.org ? Perhaps, but hard
The dispute resolution page is a little bit of a mess, but we're working on
streamlining things. Informal mediation was closed as it had been made largely
redundant by the dispute resolution noticeboard. The same could perhaps be said
about the mediation committee, but it's a long-standing
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Gesendet: 20:37 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
On 5 September 2013 18:50, Lars Gardenius lars.garden...@yahoo.de wrote:
I am involved in work
Von: Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net
An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 18:03 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
Yes, that is pretty much the situation. The howls of outraged anguish
.September 2013
Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
Who is both independent, knowledgeable, and not involved in a wiki?
All you have to do is read a newspaper or magazine article about
Wikipedia to realize how hopelessly outsiders get everything wrong.
Fred
I've had the same issues in Spanish Wikipedia, the project is missing
neutrality and is in danger because of serious editors and admins which put
their opinions before the Wikipedia values
Sent from my iPhone
On 04/09/2013, at 16:38, Rui Correia correia@gmail.com wrote:
Greetings to All
Gesendet: 23:08 Mittwoch, 4.September 2013
Betreff: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
Greetings to All
Let me start by saying that I don't do much here at the WP, not compared to
people who make hundreds of edits a week. I would love to, have a long list
of to-do
Von: Rui Correia correia@gmail.com
An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 23:08 Mittwoch, 4.September 2013
Betreff: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
Greetings to All
Let me start by saying that I
Von: Rui Correia correia@gmail.com
An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Gesendet: 23:08 Mittwoch, 4.September 2013
Betreff: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself
Greetings to All
Let me start by saying that I
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From: Rui Correia correia@gmail.com
To: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Sent: Thursday, September 5, 2013 5:08 AM
Subject: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from
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