Hey,
Validator was rejected from being included in core
I'm happy it did. The code was quite poor at that time (two years back?).
And it still is not a hallmark of great design, though certainly not below
average MW quality at this point. Regardless of that, I now think it is a
bad idea to have
2013/7/19 Antoine Musso hashar+...@free.fr
And installing yoursite would be something like:
mkdir mysite
cd mysite
composer require mediawiki/core
composer require wikibase/wikibase
# which installs data-values/data-values ask/ask as well
Just curious, why is composer require
Hey,
Just curious, why is composer require mediawiki/core needed?
Because Hashar is talking about having a MediaWiki installation package,
which effectively turns into My MediaWiki installation when you start
using it. This package specifies all the things you want to install (in its
Le 21/07/13 22:58, Ryan Lane a écrit :
When I attempt to
upgrade MediaWiki I currently have to write down all of the extensions, and
ensure all of them are compatible with MediaWiki. With some subsets, I need
to ensure they are compatible with each other (like SMW, SF, SRF). Now I'm
going to
Le 22/07/13 13:29, Denny Vrandečić a écrit :
And installing yoursite would be something like:
mkdir mysite
cd mysite
composer require mediawiki/core
composer require wikibase/wikibase
# which installs data-values/data-values ask/ask as well
Just curious, why is composer
Hey,
wikibase/wikibase does not list mediawiki/core as a dependency :)
Indeed. Right now this just allows you to install Wikibase into an existing
MW install. Before we can go all the way, we first need to be able to do a
MediaWiki (+extensions) install, which is something still under
Ah, OK, understood. Thanks.
2013/7/22 Jeroen De Dauw jeroended...@gmail.com
Hey,
wikibase/wikibase does not list mediawiki/core as a dependency :)
Indeed. Right now this just allows you to install Wikibase into an existing
MW install. Before we can go all the way, we first need to be
On 22.07.2013, 16:11 Jeroen wrote:
Hey,
Just curious, why is composer require mediawiki/core needed?
Because Hashar is talking about having a MediaWiki installation package,
which effectively turns into My MediaWiki installation when you start
using it. This package specifies all the
When I attempt to
upgrade MediaWiki I currently have to write down all of the extensions, and
ensure all of them are compatible with MediaWiki. With some subsets, I need
to ensure they are compatible with each other (like SMW, SF, SRF). Now I'm
going to need to do that and track the
Hi,
please, everyone calm down and honesty try harder to assume faith and
respect the capabilities of each other. Respect includes to avoid
terminology like to bitch, to sneak in, stupid when describing each
other's actions.
One good way is when you are angry about an email, step back, wait a
It seems that a package manager is a reasonable way to manage a growing set
of dependencies.
Composer seems to me (without knowing too much about it) to be a reasonable
package manager.
I've heard the objection expressed that this will require new users of
wikibase/etc to learn composer.
On 07/22/2013 11:43 AM, Chad wrote:
Telling me it's like cpan just brings back awful awful memories...
I apologize. I can't say my experience with cpan was all roses, but it
seems that my experience was better than yours. ;)
--
http://hexmode.com/
Love alone reveals the true shape of the
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 12:00 PM, Mark A. Hershberger m...@everybody.orgwrote:
On 07/22/2013 11:43 AM, Chad wrote:
Telling me it's like cpan just brings back awful awful memories...
I apologize. I can't say my experience with cpan was all roses, but it
seems that my experience was better
You're not convincing me ;-)
-Chad
On Jul 22, 2013 9:06 AM, C. Scott Ananian canan...@wikimedia.org wrote:
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 12:00 PM, Mark A. Hershberger m...@everybody.org
wrote:
On 07/22/2013 11:43 AM, Chad wrote:
Telling me it's like cpan just brings back awful awful
On 07/22/2013 09:20 AM, Derric Atzrott wrote:
If we require composer, we require users to learn to use composer.
Some like myself have never used it, and while it’s a skill I should
probably learn that will save me considerable time, it may be that
not all will find being forced to learn a new
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 8:36 AM, Mark A. Hershberger m...@everybody.orgwrote:
On 07/22/2013 09:20 AM, Derric Atzrott wrote:
If we require composer, we require users to learn to use composer.
Some like myself have never used it, and while it’s a skill I should
probably learn that will save
Just to clear some things up, composer is *not* a package manager. It is
actually pretty terrible at being a package manager, mainly because it's
not supposed to be one. The purpose of composer is solely dependency
management.
Because of that, using it as a package manager requires using some
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 12:15 PM, Tyler Romeo tylerro...@gmail.com wrote:
Just to clear some things up, composer is *not* a package manager. It is
actually pretty terrible at being a package manager, mainly because it's
not supposed to be one. The purpose of composer is solely dependency
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 12:53 PM, C. Scott Ananian
canan...@wikimedia.orgwrote:
Arguably the problem which needs to be solved here is dependency
management.
Regardless, the question is: can composer help? It appears that it can:
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Composer
I'm interested in
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 12:55 PM, Tyler Romeo tylerro...@gmail.com wrote:
Partially. The issue is that extensions are both packages and dependencies.
Scribunto is itself an independent package that a wiki can install, but at
the same time it can be a dependency for other extensions. That's
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 6:25 AM, Denny Vrandečić
denny.vrande...@wikimedia.de wrote:
I assume Ryan didn't mean to single out the Wikidata development team.
Other teams have done this as well -- the Translate extension depends on
ULS, CodeEditor depends on WikiEditor, Semantic Result Formats
Hey,
npm has a newly-added 'peerDependencies' feature. It looks like composer
could use a similar feature. Anyone want to work on a composer patch?
I might be misunderstanding what this peerDependencies does, though if not,
then it is different then what is needed for the scenario described
Hey,
Regardless, the question is: can composer help? It appears that it can:
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Composer
Yeah, and we've already done most of the steps to make this work for
extensions in core. If you got a MW install, you can already install
Wikibase (together with all its
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 11:24 AM, Jeroen De Dauw jeroended...@gmail.comwrote:
The solution proposed by Hashar in some other thread is to have a
MediaWiki installation package, which just contains a composer.json file
with core in it, where people can add dependencies, and then install.
Before
The npm peerDependency option is explicitly for extensions/plugins that
depend on other extensions. Ie, a jQuery plugin that requires another
jQuery plugin to also be loaded (a peer). This is the inter-extension
dependency problem that was being discussed, as I understand it. (I could
be wrong of
Le 22/07/13 15:20, Derric Atzrott a écrit :
To throw another viewpoint into the mix. If we require composer, we
require users to learn to use composer. Some like myself have never
used it, and while it’s a skill I should probably learn that will
save me considerable time, it may be that not
Le 22/07/13 19:31, Ryan Lane a écrit :
Another reason for having separate components like the WikibaseModel or
Diff is that they are not MediaWiki extensions, but pure PHP libraries.
Any PHP script can reuse them. Since the WikibaseModel is not trivial, this
should help with the writing
2013/7/22 Antoine Musso hashar+...@free.fr
Given we migrated our community from
subversion to git, I am confident enough that using composer will be
very easy to the community.
:D
___
Wikitech-l mailing list
Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
2013/7/22 Ryan Lane rlan...@gmail.com
For pure PHP libraries, they could be distributed like pure PHP libraries
usually are. They can be packaged for multiple distros and be available via
apt/yum/composer (or pear). Having them as MediaWiki extensions is somewhat
awkward.
Yes, agree on
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 3:23 PM, Denny Vrandečić
denny.vrande...@wikimedia.de wrote:
Assume you have class Ext which relies on class Core, but class Core should
not rely on class Ext, because they are on different architectural levels.
If Ext and Core are together, your CI will load them both
2013/7/22 Tyler Romeo tylerro...@gmail.com
Architectural integrity of code is a design-level issue. Continuous
integration is a programming and quality assurance-level issue. They have
nothing to do with each other, and you can maintain architectural integrity
just fine without having to
Hey,
The solution proposed by Hashar in some other thread is to have a
MediaWiki installation package, which just contains a composer.json
file
with core in it, where people can add dependencies, and then install.
Before that will work, we'll need to get rid of global scope
assumptions
Le 19/07/13 23:26, Antoine Musso a écrit :
mkdir mysite
cd mysite
composer require mediawiki/core
composer require wikibase/wikibase
# which installs data-values/data-values ask/ask as well
snip
And a vendor directory containing all dependencies. At the root of your
directory you
Hey,
you're adding in a whole new set of incompatibilities.
How so?
Extensions that use any of these extension libaries now depend on the
version of MediaWiki and the version of the extension. That's a new set of
dependencies that can be incompatible now.
It adds a component as
Hey,
It's great that modules
like Diff have good beady eyes on code quality and portability, long may
that continue. That is *definitely* the exception, not the rule, with
extensions.
The point is that MediaWiki is *much* more likely to be able
to police and maintain that proper signature
On Sun, Jul 21, 2013 at 9:41 AM, Jeroen De Dauw jeroended...@gmail.comwrote:
What started this thread was Ryan having problems with installing Wikibase.
And I can see why this would not be all that smooth. The components you
need is probably not the biggest hassle. After all, you just need to
Hey,
you're adding in a whole new set of incompatibilities.
How so?
You're really not thinking of this from the perspective of the person
using the software.
Oh, glad to know you understand what I am thinking, since clearly I do not.
In case of the components
created for Wikidata, we
On Sat, Jul 20, 2013 at 4:34 AM, Jeroen De Dauw jeroended...@gmail.comwrote:
Hey,
you're adding in a whole new set of incompatibilities.
How so?
Extensions that use any of these extension libaries now depend on the
version of MediaWiki and the version of the extension. That's a new set of
On Sat, Jul 20, 2013 at 2:08 PM, Ryan Lane rlan...@gmail.com wrote:
In case of the components
created for Wikidata, we have been supporting Composer for a while
now,
which is a great fit to our needs.
We in this situation is Wikidata and not the developer community. In
fact,
It might also be worth going a wikibase release (on its own schedule or
else scheduled shortly after each MW release), that contains a particular
MW version along with version of the extensions that have been tested to
work with it. This is the usual way in which these sorts of dependency
chains
On Fri, Jul 19, 2013 at 11:20 AM, C. Scott Ananian
canan...@wikimedia.orgwrote:
It might also be worth going a wikibase release (on its own schedule or
else scheduled shortly after each MW release), that contains a particular
MW version along with version of the extensions that have been
I attempted to install Wikibase the other day and made a fun discovery.
Installing it properly requires the following (12) extensions:
WikibaseClient
Wikibase DataModel
WikibaseLib
Wikibase Repository
DataValues
DataTypes
ValueParsers
ValueView
ValueValidators
ValueFormatters
Diff
Scribunto
And
Man, if only PHP had some sort of dependency management system.
*-- *
*Tyler Romeo*
Stevens Institute of Technology, Class of 2016
Major in Computer Science
www.whizkidztech.com | tylerro...@gmail.com
On Fri, Jul 19, 2013 at 2:44 PM, Jeroen De Dauw jeroended...@gmail.comwrote:
Hey,
What
Hey,
What if you want to use wikibase 1.23 and MyAbominationExtension 1.5 that
requires an incompatible version of DataValues and MyAwesomeExtension 1.0
that requires an incompatible version of ValueView?
If you have releases of certain software that have requirements that cannot
satisfied
On 07/19/2013 02:46 PM, Tyler Romeo wrote:
Man, if only PHP had some sort of dependency management system.
The real question is: why doesn't MediaWiki use Composer?
http://getcomposer.org/download/
We've discussed this here before, though, so it really isn't anything
more than a rhetorical
On Fri, Jul 19, 2013 at 2:27 PM, Ryan Lane rlan...@gmail.com wrote:
What if you want to use wikibase 1.23 and MyAbominationExtension 1.5 that
requires an incompatible version of DataValues and MyAwesomeExtension 1.0
that requires an incompatible version of ValueView?
You file a bug report
On Fri, Jul 19, 2013 at 11:44 AM, Jeroen De Dauw jeroended...@gmail.comwrote:
Hey,
What if you want to use wikibase 1.23 and MyAbominationExtension 1.5 that
requires an incompatible version of DataValues and MyAwesomeExtension 1.0
that requires an incompatible version of ValueView?
If
On Fri, Jul 19, 2013 at 3:16 PM, Mark A. Hershberger m...@everybody.orgwrote:
The real question is: why doesn't MediaWiki use Composer?
http://getcomposer.org/download/
We've discussed this here before, though, so it really isn't anything
more than a rhetorical question.
Ryan's post just
Le 19/07/13 22:28, Tyler Romeo a écrit :
From what Antoine found out from the composer people, basically what we'll
have to do to make MW use Composer is that we need to separate the entry
points from the backend classes (in other words, put everything except
index.php, api.php, etc. in one
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