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Hanno Schlichting wrote:
> Tres Seaver wrote:
>> Hanno Schlichting wrote:
>>> As a side note, we just started the community discussion about moving at
>>> least to Zope 2.11 / 3.4 for Plone in a release by the end of this
ensure that the second policy doesn't
break Plone, the you can equally well update the Zope / Python versions.
Tres.
- --
===
Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 tsea...@palladion.com
Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
-B
sks than 2.12 ever would. Constraining the ZTK to fit
this weird pattern you guys have of trying to cherry pick bits of it is
an anti-goal.
Tres.
- --
===
Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 tsea...@palladion.com
Palladion Sof
ssed
> when there are enough valuable features and changes that satisfy a new
> release.
That is fine. I think deferring the change proposed in this thread
until after 2.12 is still the prudent thing to do.
Tres.
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Tres
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Andreas Jung wrote:
> On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 16:51, Tres Seaver wrote:
>
>>
>>>> [1] http://download.zope.org/Zope2/index/2.12.0a4/zope.component/
>>>>
>>>> [2] http://svn.zope.org/Zope/trunk/versio
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Andreas Jung wrote:
> On 28.04.2009 15:25 Uhr, Tres Seaver wrote:
>> ml
>>
>> These tests are breaking because a much newer version of zope.component
>> (3.7.0) is being installed than the on called out in the Zope 2 index[1
- zope.testing
That isn't an argument to keep those packages in the "must support
Python 2.4" camp, as long as newer versions bump their major version
numbers: BFG installs from its own index, which would just exclude
those newer versions untill BFG drops 2.4 support.
y that any Plone 3.x version will work with it.
At the moment, the Zope 2 package set it defined here:
http://svn.zope.org/Zope/trunk/versions.cfg?view=markup
I don't see any reason to hold up a 2.12 release while the ZTK
stabilizes: in fact, I think the existince of a stable 2.12 release
wi
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Martin Aspeli wrote:
> Tres Seaver wrote:
>> Thinking further on this: there is actually not much "shiny" about the
>> ZTK: it is going to be equivalent to a cut-down, dependency-stripped,
>> bbb-cruft-sanded version o
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Tres Seaver wrote:
> Martin Aspeli wrote:
>
>> The Plone 3.x series will stay on Python 2.4 for a long time yet, so
>> this would be very disappointing. I can understand it if the maintenance
>> burden becomes large, or
by
backwared compatiblity with pre-2.12 Zope versions: those versions are
stuck with using the Zope 3.3 / 3.4 trees on which they were originally
based, just as they are stuck with Python 2.4.
Tres.
- --
=======
Tres Seaver
t
make the kind of invasive changes needed for full compatibility in
bugfix releases of stable software).
Tres.
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Palladion Software "Excellence by De
ard_error_message': it is far more likely that the breakage is an
unintended consequence of some other change. Putting your effort into
diagnosing the cause will do more to fix the problem than arguing about it.
Tres.
- --
======
lists, please forward this e-mail to them
Thank you for your cooperation, and for your continued support of Zope!
Tres.
- --
===
Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 tsea...@palladion.com
Palladion Software "Excellence
r layers:
Tear down zope.testing.testrunner.layer.UnitTests in 0.000 seconds.
- -- %< ---
Tres.
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Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 tsea...@palladion.com
Palladion S
, please! I know folks don't
like it, but this index should contain only Zope-related "known good"
packages.
Tres.
- --
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Palladion Software
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Baiju M wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 12:27 PM, Tres Seaver wrote:
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Andreas Jung wrote:
>>> Am 19.04.2009 um 10:52 schrieb Andreas Jung:
>>>
&
n/activate
> bin/easy_install -i http://some.url/index/2.12.0a3 Zope2
- - The 'source bin/activate' part should be unnecessary (I never use it,
and I use *lots* of virtualenvs).
- - I propose the following for the index URL:
http://download.zope.org/Zope2/index/2.12.0a3
Tres.
-
r a week later and no answer.
>
> Is it really the case that no-one knows what's going on here?
Maybe nobody else cares enough to do the debugging you're too lazy to do? ;)
Tres.
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Tres Seaver
Zope 2 releases.
Tres.
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Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
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ndex
at someplace like 'http://download.zope.org/indexes/Zope-2.12a2'?
Tres.
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Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
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ivial.
Continuing to "push" that brand is confusing to outsiders, who don't
understand why anyone would still be using "Zope 2" four years after the
first release of "Zope 3". The folks who are using "Zope 3" can
certainly cope with a split / rename.
: the few exceptions were supposed to have been
verified as being compatible with (and equally or more permissive than)
the ZPL.
I think I recall that Jim ripped out an integration package for the Ext
Javascript framework precisely because the licensing for Ext was
initially questionable, and la
perhaps after some kind of svn export process.: those
who maintain the package should host it elsewhere. The tarballs should
be removed from download.zope.org, as well.
Tres.
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Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 ts
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Chris Withers wrote:
> Tres Seaver wrote:
>> It means that you have *part* of the WebDAV machinery wired up (hence
>> the NullResource objects) but not all of it (hence, you are trying to
>> render a ZPT which uses /path/to
now ZTK, and that the other bits have a life of
their own, but *without the un-brand*.
To this end, I think we sholud remove all traces of the un-brand from
prominent places on our websites, try to stay "on message" as a
community, while re-focusing on the technical aspects of the transit
7;macros', ['main'])
> LocationError: (,
> 'macros')
>
> I don't know what this means, does anyone here?
It means that you have *part* of the WebDAV machinery wired up (hence
the NullResource objects) but not all of it (hence, you are trying to
render a ZPT which uses /path/to/template/macros/main). Like
x27;t been real since about 2003); continuing to use it
in the present tense will undercut the other, more viable brands (Grok,
Zope2). We can continue to refer to "Zope 3" in the past tense, to
explain how ZTK and the other brands relate to the bigger codebase, but
we should quit promoting it.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Martin Aspeli wrote:
> Tres Seaver wrote:
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Martin Aspeli wrote:
>>> Log message for revision 99146:
>>> Let the directive auto-register permissio
plication which used them (e.g.,
wrapping the root object in a space-suit at the beginning of publishing
traversal); none of us need or want that.
Tres.
- --
===
Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 tsea...@palladion.com
Pa
uot; any longer as a brand (with its
implications of replacing Zope2).
In some ways, this discussion is like the Plone developers" "platform
vs. application" debate (which isn't yet resolved AFAIK).
Tres.
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',
> roles=['Anonymous'])
> +
> + >>> configure_zcml = '''
> + ... http://namespaces.zope.org/zope";>
> + ...
> + ...+ ... id="Products.Five.tests.OtherDummy"
> + ... title="Five: Other
the
implementation: your #1 and #2 alaready did that, I think.
Tres.
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Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
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kit support building a web application out of the box
> without relying on Grok, Zope 2 or any other framework ?
> (I am Ok to use a Buildout for building application from
> Zope Toolkit packages)
>
> If the answer to this question is "No", then I am interested to mainta
o ship an app (as opposed to developing it)
with the generated python code on disk, and configure it not to
regenerate at all: at that point, lxml would be a "build-time" dependency.
Tres.
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Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 tsea...@palladion.com
Palladi
rboGears, BFG) don't configure
their applications "inside" a container supplied by the appserver: they
wire them in via an external configuration mechanism (e.g., a Paste INI
file, or a script called at startup).
Tres.
- --
=
the multiple steps (including
> installing setuptools) into a little helper script.
>
> As you might notice all that is required is a known URL and Apache
> serving a bunch of files directly.
Without supplying the '-i' ('--index-url') flag, you are still subject
to t
aintain the
meta-egg which corresponds to your needs in SVN someplace.
Tres.
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Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
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s.
You need to do the 'alltests' dance to run them (I just learned the
chant this morning):
$ bin/buildout -c alltests.cfg
$ bin/alltests
Tres.
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===
Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 tsea...@palladion.
nterface and zope.pagetemplate plus their dependencies. I'm
> planning to release another sample project maybe during easter
> holidays. It's much more fun since you zope people cleaned up a lot of
> dependencies and unveiled zc.buildout. Thanks!
Cool! You should be abl
t; I'm using zope.app.generations to upgrade the DB schema in my web
> project, and in future I want to use ZODB3 in my desktop-only
> projects.
Tres.
- --
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't know how the 'alltests' script is being built, or I would have
run the tests myself and found the failure.
Tres.
- --
=======
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Palladion Software "
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Jim Fulton wrote:
> On Apr 8, 2009, at 11:34 PM, Tres Seaver wrote:
> Plone could run on something like the "Zope Framework" without running
> on Zope 2.
That would be feasible, except that a ton of Plone's features
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Jim Fulton wrote:
> On Apr 8, 2009, at 11:29 PM, Tres Seaver wrote:
>
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Martin Aspeli wrote:
>>> Wichert Akkerman wrote:
>>>
>>>> To
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Lennart Regebro wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 9, 2009 at 05:34, Tres Seaver wrote:
>> Hanno Schlichting wrote:
>>
>>> The current line of thinking for Plone is about this: Plone 4 will still
>>> run on Zope2. Plone 5 will ru
ramework" 4.0!
Heh, don't call the "*the* Zope framework" at all! There are a bunch of
frameworks lurking in the codebase, and none of them is a "web
framework" in the sense the rest of the Python web development community
users: Grok and BFG do match what they mean,
ard and pointless by comparison.
? Plone is just switching to repoze.zope2
> and bits of zope.pipeline by itself. The kind of radical and backwards
> incompatible changes an application like Plone can do, give us much more
> flexibility here, compared to the more conservative approach a f
nced Zope3^H^H^H^HDecoy DOA. Nobody is every going to care about
Zope3-the-appserver, as opposed to "the-libraries-harvested-from-Zope3"
(at least, the folks who might care are a tiny minority for branding
purposes).
Tres.
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Shane Hathaway wrote:
>
>
> Tres Seaver wrote:
>> WRT the "Framework" name: "framework" is a misleading name for the
>> collection of packages salvaged from the "new Coke" effort: it is
>>
s.
The notional "Zope Framwork" is alos *not* what other Python web
developers mean when they say "web framework": Grok and BFG fit that
meaning. Zope2 is really an "app server" / "pluggable application",
rather than a "web framework".
Tres.
-
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Chris Withers wrote:
> Wichert Akkerman wrote:
>> Previously Chris Withers wrote:
>>> Tres Seaver wrote:
>>>>>>> KGS the
>>>>>>> concept is very easy to implement; you just make available o
irst release of a
> Python 3 compatible
> zope.interface.
Maybe something like 'soleImplementor'?
Tres.
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=======
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Palladion Software "Excelle
therefore focus on the ZEO server.
[1] http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-3143/
Tres.
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Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
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/ expected
outputs. If nobody has a better idea, I will check that in tomorrow
(see attached patch).
Tres.
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===
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Palladion Software "Excellence by Design&qu
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Wichert Akkerman wrote:
> Previously Tres Seaver wrote:
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Wichert Akkerman wrote:
>>> Previously Chris Withers wrote:
>>>> Tres Seaver wrote:
&g
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Hanno Schlichting wrote:
> Tres Seaver wrote:
>> Roger Ineichen wrote:
>>> Log message for revision 97754:
>>> Use applySkin from new location zope.publisher.skinnable
>>> instead of zope.publisher.browser.
>
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Hash: SHA1
Wichert Akkerman wrote:
> Previously Chris Withers wrote:
>> Tres Seaver wrote:
>>>>>> KGS the
>>>>>> concept is very easy to implement; you just make available on some URL a
>>>>>> bui
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Hash: SHA1
Chris Withers wrote:
> Tres Seaver wrote:
>> Lennart Regebro wrote:
>>> On Sun, Apr 5, 2009 at 08:32, Dieter Maurer wrote:
>>>> Because members put there content (product implementations) still usable?
>>>
sable, IPathAdapter
This change breaks older packages who might expect a 3.5.x version to
have compatible dependencies: it impliictly requires
zope.component>=3.6.0, which is wildly incompatible. I think the 3.5.3
release tag should be copied as 3.6.0, and a 3.5.4 should be released
which revert
class as a container for them seems over-fancy for my taste.
Tres.
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Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
-BEGIN
gt; to PyPI though.
PyPI won't work for non-eggified products.
Tres.
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Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
xed configuration.
Others overrode that choice, preferring to have an "upgradeable"
version, which then requires a KGS. It might be sensible to distribute
both variants, actually.
Tres.
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Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0
thin
> on the ground :-/
Maybe, but the one group is doing "policy" (who should be a committer?),
while the other is doing "mechanism" (get approved committers set up).
The groups don't have to overlap, as long as the workflow is clear.
Tres.
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Chris Withers wrote:
> Tres Seaver wrote:
>>>> Personally, I evaluate such eggs in a sandbox, and then add them to the
>>>> project-specific index once I'm sure that they work with the other
>>>> software
repository will need to be formally made by the
foundation (via its board), but that would only happen if the consensus
of the members and the wider community were clearly in favor of a move.
Tres.
- --
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Tres Seaver
1 to switching away from svn, at least until the Python developers have
some experience with the transition (I would wait at least 6 months).
Tres.
- --
===
Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 tsea...@palladion.com
Palladion Sof
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Chris Withers wrote:
> Tres Seaver wrote:
>> Chris Withers wrote:
>>> Tres Seaver wrote:
>>>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>>>> I mean an index which supplies the 'simple' PyPI interface,
t; .subversion/ in my home dir.
>
>
> Possibly because I am using SVN 1.6.
Then "never" means since 2009-03-20. Or else you have never done a
checkout from a password-protected SVN-over-HTTP(S) server.
Tres,
- --
=
for="* zope.publisher.interfaces.IRequest"
> +provides="zope.traversing.interfaces.ITraversable"
> factory="zope.traversing.namespace.etc"
> />
> ...
Excellent fix.
Tres.
- --
===
Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999
t; I can probably help implement this. Any thoughts?
You should probably add a "class decorator" 'interfaceProvider', as
well, because the "in-suite" versions are problematic for 2to3
conversion (IIRC what Lennart said yesterday).
Tres.
- --
our.org/
Enjoy!
Tres.
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=======
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Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
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er (below).
Tres.
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Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
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Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla
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Chris Withers wrote:
> Tres Seaver wrote:
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> I mean an index which supplies the 'simple' PyPI interface, such that we
>> could tell people to 'easy_install' from it, e.
> The biggest problem is that after making it False on win32 still
> breaks seemingly all doctests using system().
> The output seemingly matches exactly the expected output, but the
> tests burps on it.
Sorry, no clue.
Tres.
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======
mpty value for id or name
> doen't start with [A-Za-z] and is invalid because is must start
> with [A-Za-z]. or not?
- -1 on making ZPT / chameleon responsible for enforcing that requirement:
that would be the application's job.
Tres.
- --
=
zope.component extras, first.
Once done, those pacakges are all essentially "libraries," and could be
managed as a "chunk."
> In addition this would need documentation as well.
Fleshing out the in-package narrative docs for those packages (or
perhaps for the set?) would b
ogy
Tres.
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Hanno Schlichting wrote:
> Tres Seaver wrote:
>> Andreas Jung wrote:
>>> Please look at the getPackages() method taking the version*cfg files
>>> into account. So all versions should be pinned. However there is
>>>
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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Andreas Jung wrote:
> On 16.03.2009 17:21 Uhr, Tres Seaver wrote:
>
>
>> Maybe generating indexes from the varios "known good" metadata we are
>> already maintaining would be the right path.
>
>
> By
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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Martijn Faassen wrote:
> Hey,
>
> Tres Seaver wrote:
> [snip]
>>> Doesn't that in some cases make tests harder to understand, as
>>> lower-level APIs are in use that are not as recognizable as the
>>> e
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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Andreas Jung wrote:
> On 16.03.2009 4:52 Uhr, Tres Seaver wrote:
>> Andreas Jung wrote:
>>> On 15.03.2009 18:42 Uhr, Tres Seaver wrote:
>>>> Original Message
>>>> Subject: [Bug 343079] [NEW]
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Andreas Jung wrote:
> On 15.03.2009 18:42 Uhr, Tres Seaver wrote:
>
>> Original Message
>> Subject: [Bug 343079] [NEW] Broken distribution (2009-03-15)
>> Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 07:42:00 -
>> F
, but greatly
> separate it from another package components and provide
> zope.app.appsetup as an "extra" dependency (sigh...).
+1 for moving all that stuff into the application.
Tres.
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===
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Pallad
tools' "incremental requirements discovery" design.
Tres.
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> Personally, I quite like the idea of naming it
> "zope.app.localpermission", merging it with its views (possibly as an
> optional dependency) and forgetting about it. But it's just because I
> didn't ever need and probably won't ever need local permissi
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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Dieter Maurer wrote:
> Tres Seaver wrote at 2009-3-12 14:25 -0400:
>> ...
>> Sorry, I meant "mandatory tests which load ZCML." I'm actually against
>> ever loading ZCML in tests at all.
>
> If you ship ZCML
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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Martijn Faassen wrote:
> Tres Seaver wrote:
> [snip]
>> - -1 on having "configuration dependecies," including having mandatory
>> tests that ZCML will load:
>
> You mean mandatory ZCML loaded by tests? You seem t
at least for "library" pacakges (as opposed to "applications").
Any ZCML file which needs something like zope.component or zope.security
to be present should signalt that by either including the meta.zcml
(e.g., to define directives) or nesting the dependent directives ins
gument and weeding argument for more packages,
> I'll also note that if the amount of packages in the framework goes up
> but the total amount of *code* in the framework goes down significantly
> and each package is easier to understand, I'm happy to see the amount of
> pa
only reason we declare it everywhere is to
appease zc.buildout.
I would leave the boilerplate alone, on the chance that it makes the
package usable via straight distutils.
Tres.
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Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999
`vocabulary` in IChoice.
>
> It's just my bash tried to execute `vocabulary` :-)
You've hit on why I hate rstx's "backquotes everywhere" pattern. ;(
Tres.
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Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999
fault later. Maybe we could allow
some kind of configuration to enable the newer behavior sooner.
Tres.
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Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
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tion.TransactionTests) ... ok
Doctest: savepoint.txt ... ok
Doctest:
transaction.tests.test_savepoint.testRollbackRollsbackDataManagersThatJoinedLater
... ok
- --
Ran 42 tests in 0.152s
OK
- ----- 8&
compattest" suite against
>> the new version.
>
> I'm not up to date with zope.container.
> What is a show stopper for another release?
You asked for a release of zope.component, including C extensions.
Tres.
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Tres Seaver wrote:
> Roger Ineichen wrote:
>
>> The zope.container package was broken.
>> I added a missing ComponentLookupError import.
>
> Yup, and there is no test for that 'browserDefault' raising the error,
uot; suite against the new version.
Tres.
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Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG wit
uot; suite against the new version.
Tres.
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Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 tsea...@palladion.com
Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com
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ldout (or a recipe?) to use the
information generated by 'eggtestinfo' when building testrunner scripts.
My zc.buildout-fu is pretty weak at this point :(.
Tres.
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Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 tsea..
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Dan Korostelev wrote:
> 2009/3/6 Tres Seaver :
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>> Martijn Faassen wrote:
>>> Hey,
>>>
>>> Laurence Rowe wrote:
>>> [snip]
>>>
gt; inheritance relationship. If nothing directly refers to IView it might
> mean everything will still work...
I just undeprecated IView and the other 'bbb' interfaces for exactly
this reason: if core packages still use them five years later, then the
deprecation loses.
Tres
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