Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-30 Thread Jim Washington
Dieter Maurer wrote: Jim Washington wrote at 2007-3-27 16:28 -0400: ... Yes, I think so, at least in the implementation/algorithm I am using. There may be other implementations that do not need this. Note, however, that the canonical list does not have to be complex objects. The

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-29 Thread Dieter Maurer
Lennart Regebro wrote at 2007-3-28 18:25 +0200: On 3/27/07, Dieter Maurer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: However, this approach is only efficient when the sort index size is small compared to the result size. Sure. But with incremental searching, the result size is always one, right? ;-) No. You

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-27 Thread Lennart Regebro
On 3/26/07, Dieter Maurer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When IncrementalSearch does it, it works roughly as Jim described it under 1 above (although there is no need that it works the the primary key directly). Right. Unless the indexes are able to return sorted (partial results), we need to

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-27 Thread Jim Fulton
On Mar 26, 2007, at 8:45 PM, Martijn Faassen wrote: ... I think we can safely conclude that: * there is no silver bullet in all this (your point) Yes * there is probably room for improvement. Yes ... My hopes: * is that there is some low-hanging fruit in improving things. Possibly,

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-27 Thread Jim Washington
Hi, Martijn I have a suggestion, only because I have played around with the idea a bit. Google for python factoradics, and you will get my blog entry about factoradics. I see the problem statement as How to obtain batching without re-sorting multiple times. If you see a sort order as one

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-27 Thread Martijn Faassen
Hey Jim, On 3/27/07, Jim Fulton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [snip] After that I thought we were actually going somewhere with this discussion, but you now strengthen this impression by apparently giving up in exasparation. That is what is making *me* slightly exasparated. :) Fine. I gave up

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-27 Thread Dieter Maurer
Jim Washington wrote at 2007-3-27 08:24 -0400: ... If you see a sort order as one permutation of a list, the factoradic technique provides a key to that permutation. So, in theory, one would sort the list, and store the factoradic index for that permutation. The next time the particular sort

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-27 Thread Dieter Maurer
Lennart Regebro wrote at 2007-3-27 11:59 +0200: ... OK, at least this avoids the big intermediate results when searching over several indexes. But you still have to get all of the results, and sort them before you can return the X first. I have the impression that Lucene somehow solves this with

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-27 Thread Dieter Maurer
Jim Fulton wrote at 2007-3-26 15:55 -0400: ... On Mar 26, 2007, at 3:28 PM, Dieter Maurer wrote: Jim Fulton wrote at 2007-3-25 09:53 -0400: On Mar 25, 2007, at 3:01 AM, Adam Groszer wrote: MF I think one of the main limitations of the current catalog (and MF hurry.query) is efficient

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-27 Thread Jim Washington
Dieter Maurer wrote: Jim Washington wrote at 2007-3-27 08:24 -0400: ... If you see a sort order as one permutation of a list, the factoradic technique provides a key to that permutation. So, in theory, one would sort the list, and store the factoradic index for that permutation. The

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-26 Thread Jim Fulton
On Mar 26, 2007, at 3:28 PM, Dieter Maurer wrote: Jim Fulton wrote at 2007-3-25 09:53 -0400: On Mar 25, 2007, at 3:01 AM, Adam Groszer wrote: MF I think one of the main limitations of the current catalog (and MF hurry.query) is efficient support for sorting and batching the query MF

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-25 Thread Jim Fulton
On Mar 25, 2007, at 3:01 AM, Adam Groszer wrote: MF I think one of the main limitations of the current catalog (and MF hurry.query) is efficient support for sorting and batching the query MF results. The Zope 3 catalog returns all matching results, which can then MF be sorted and batched.

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-25 Thread Lennart Regebro
On 3/25/07, Jim Fulton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 25, 2007, at 3:01 AM, Adam Groszer wrote: MF I think one of the main limitations of the current catalog (and MF hurry.query) is efficient support for sorting and batching the query MF results. The Zope 3 catalog returns all matching

Re: [ZODB-Dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Community opinion about search+filter

2007-03-25 Thread Jim Fulton
On Mar 25, 2007, at 11:08 AM, Lennart Regebro wrote: ... 2. Use an N-best algorithm. If N is the size of the batch and M is the corpus size, then this is O(M*ln(N)) rather than O(M*ln(M)) which is a significant improvement if N M, but still quite expensive. I don't think relational databases