Since both groups in ARISE did receive vasopressors, although usual care 
received marginally fewer applications, I don't think you can conclude they 
make no difference.  You would have to assert that the small number who 
received fewer applications somehow had statistical significance and I'm sure 
that number is far too small.  Plus that's a secondary analysis of a test not 
intended by the trial -- long and short, don't draw this false conclusion.

That said nobody really knows if vasopressors save lives in sepsis.

Truth is really very simple -- most docs cannot stand to look at a BP of 70/40 
and sit on it after a good fluid bolus fails.  If you've got docs that feel 
comfortable doing that, I'd say they are daredevils unlike the average ED doc 
or intensivist!



On Apr 23, 2015, at 7:17 AM, Jeanie Bollinger 
<[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:

Hello group,

I have a question on the CMS bundle and the revised SCCM guidelines concerning 
volume resuscitation and application of vasopressors.   The 3 hours bundle 
states fluid 30ml/kg for hypotension or lactate >4.  The 6 hour bundle states 
to apply vasopressors for hypotension that does not respond to initial fluid 
resuscitation.   Is the recommendation to add vasopressor after 30ml/kg or can 
the provider give more fluid and then within the 3-6 hour window then apply 
vasopressors for sustained hypotension?  There is discussion among our team 
referring to the ARISE trial and that the variable of  vasopressor therapy did 
not change outcomes.  Any insight on the perspective of others is appreciated.  
Jeanie Bollinger


Jeanie Bollinger MSN,RN,ACCNS-AG, CCRN
Sepsis Clinical Nurse Specialist
Nursing Department of Excellence
Mission Health
Asheville, NC

Phone: 828-213-7171
Beeper: 828-207-2363


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