Hi,
Let get back in the old and terrible times :)
- Ethan Galstad never took the time to reply (publicly I mean)
Yes and no. No he never take the time to answer in the nagios devel mailing
list, whatever noise I done (I even try ascii art, but still nothing :) ).
We got 6 months after near june (I remember, I was in holidays :) ) a post
from his wife in our web site, quite angry about us, especially about
Gerhard (they don't know me personally), with no reason. with the time, I
think they take the time to look at what we done in this project 6 months
after the mailing list proposal, and they did not like it at all.
After this "hard discovery", we try to get in the nagios seed camp because
in theses times, we still wanted to get in the original project, and it was
a good way to remember it. But we were refused, and we finally understood
that it will not be possible at all, we should manage all this project, and
our ideas will not be taken by Nagios. Then get got a comment on our web
site post like the previous one, and we understand that we announce us in
these times as "a nagios rewrite", that it was in the begining after all
(proof of concept). But such "fork" term is dangerous inthe open source,
because every one think about "code" instead of "ideas" that the code
implement. And we did not have 10 years of testing behind us, so it was not
fair to announce as a fork. that why we take the "new monitoring tool
compatible with nagios configuration and plugins". So every one understand
what we really are.
Then we finally got a mail in this mailing list from Marry then Ethan about
possible license issues of the Shinken project because we put it in the most
protective license we can (Affero GPL) instead of the GPLv2. With no code
taken from the original source and a "big" support, this was closed. Since,
no news. My proposition about collaboration in our project did not get any
answer too, but the nagios authors got a lot of works with their enterprise
solutions, so it's normal after all, and our project is even problematic for
some of them because we offer the (efficient) distributed way for free.
- Andreas Ericsson did take the time to seriously consider taking some,
if not all of the ideas behind shinken into nagios 4, even considering a
full rewrite
Yes, Andreas was the only one to answer, in public or in private to some
subjects. He is really a very good guy. without him, I think the original
Nagios project is dead as an open source project, but it's a personal
opinion. We were not agree to the technical solutions nor the architecture,
but at least we talk each other, and even exchange some ideas (the service
generators are his ideas).
For the Nagios4, the only one that can open it is Ethan, Andreas can't do it
I think. the project vision is reach for Nagios.
- It all ended up in some kind of usual language flame war
Yes, and like Michael said, it often end like it with me. Someone said that
the "Godwin" point always reach in a long discussion, for me it's
programming language trolls. And with my english skills, it always sounds
"rude", but I'm not, it's jsut I've got real problem to let me understood :)
.I'm very upset about code hard to maintain, so it's something very very
important for me. I HATE bugs, so a clean and easy code is important, even
if in the end, all is compiled :p
I try to put the languages aside, and more focus on devel techniques, like
TDD for no regressions for example or users driven feature requests in the
ideas web site (it sounds like an "agile" project, and in fact, it is).
So in the end? Nagios is getting in its way. We always say that the open
source is :
1 : devel
2 : community
3 : business
Nagios it on the N°3 step. Some take the full open source way, some others
take the open core one. It's their business after all, and it's their full
right. It's also our to do not follow paths that we do not totally approve.
We give a new path in the monitoring world. Maybe we are totally wrong,
maybe not. It's not to us to answer that, but to the users :)
For Nagios, it's not "dead", but we should not wait for big new features,
but mainly bug fixes. Now we should wait for addons to get new cool
features. It's an architecture choice for the project, and maybe in 10 years
we will do the same :)
Hopefully, some others projects are not bashing us, so we can still exchange
with others monitoring passionnate people :)
Jean
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 6:38 PM, Michael Friedrich <
michael.friedr...@univie.ac.at> wrote:
> On 18.01.2011 18:08, Marc-Olivier Barre wrote:
> > Nap, did I miss something ? was there some off list talk involved that
> > we don't know of ?
>
> I had some offlist talk with Jean about his ideas and Icinga, but all
> the time we tried, it ended up in python vs. c. so we left it alone and
> everyone started working on his project. meanwhile shinken is becoming
> more popular, right now it's more of a knowledge sharing between two
> "forks" (one real, and one rewrite).
>
> And ofc, the deletion of Shinken on ideas.nagios.org, and the
> nagios-fr.org enforcements were also topics in our talks among several
> other thoughts. next to the recent trademark bitching, but since then
> nagios on-the-lists/on-twitter is rather silent.
> Andreas and Ton are comitting patches, sourced from their enterprise
> grade solutions (op5monitor and opsview), while nagios-devel shows some
> attempts of core parts to be rewritten (in discussion). Patches are
> floating around too, mostly because Andreas and Ton started to open up
> the patch policy a bit.
>
> So nagios is not dead, it's alive but right on the business view gets
> more important (remember nagiosxi). if that's good or bad - let the
> community decide.
>
> it's to soon to definitely tell what will happen. but shinken got
> interesting ideas and approaches, that's why i'm reading over here most
> of the time ;-) and ofc, i'm interested in the database backend solution
> in shinken as it copies several ideas from icinga idoutils :)
>
> kind regards,
> Michael
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Protect Your Site and Customers from Malware Attacks
> Learn about various malware tactics and how to avoid them. Understand
> malware threats, the impact they can have on your business, and how you
> can protect your company and customers by using code signing.
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/oracle-sfdevnl
> _______________________________________________
> Shinken-devel mailing list
> Shinken-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/shinken-devel
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Protect Your Site and Customers from Malware Attacks
Learn about various malware tactics and how to avoid them. Understand
malware threats, the impact they can have on your business, and how you
can protect your company and customers by using code signing.
http://p.sf.net/sfu/oracle-sfdevnl
_______________________________________________
Shinken-devel mailing list
Shinken-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/shinken-devel
