Steve..

Thanx for the detailed information..
You have helped me learn some new things for sure.


On Mon, Nov 3, 2008 at 8:40 PM, Steve Leyton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote:

> Sam:
>
> Both NFPA 13 and 14 offer prescriptive pressure limits for sprinkler and
> standpipe systems; 175 PSI (12 bar) has been the threshold for years but
> is excepted when components are rated higher.   Obviously, there are
> many HP sprinklers and valves on the market and higher pressure fittings
> and heavier pipe schedules facilitate higher than 12 bar working
> pressures.   NFPA 14 prescribes a 350 PSI (25 bar) pressure limit in any
> part of a standpipe system, so there isn't - to my knowledge - a higher
> pressure alternative to the 25 bar limit in high-rise buildings.
>
> Pressure reducing valves require redundancy in standpipe systems when
> used to create separate zones or when otherwise arranged so that their
> failure would allow higher-than-approved pressure to more than two hose
> connections.   Direct acting valves, such as PR sprinkler control and
> fire hose valves are allowed at any station where pressure reduction to
> the prescribed maximum (12 bar for Class I hose stations, for ex.)
> unless higher pressure is approved by the AHJ, so redundancy isn't
> required as the restrictor only impacts one hose connection.    Your
> question draws two practices into question:
>
> 1)      It's not a good practice to oversize a fire pump and then
> regulate it back down.   NFPA 20 now states that pumps must be sized so
> that the designed demand falls between 90-140% of their rating.
> 2)      If a pump does "over-supply" the downstream system
> (notwithstanding separate zones created by reducing valves), or if the
> measure of protection is to guard against diesel driver over-spin, then
> a RELIEF valve is the appropriate application, not a reducing valve.
>
> In my opinion, reducing valves should be treated like control valves - a
> necessary component that there can be too many of when they're redundant
> or applied for convenience, and a potential fail point at any point in a
> water supply or distribution system that requires regular inspection,
> testing and maintenance.   Especially pilot-type reducing valves.   I'm
> not sure I fully understand your last comment, "... like we consider 2
> pumps with PRV stations each ..." but my experience has been that series
> pumps feeding multiple zones can in fact be arranged so that no in-line
> reducing valves are required.
>
> Please also be aware that both NFPA 14 and 20 are in cycle and that both
> technical committees have adopted proposals that will SIGNIFICANTLY
> change the prescriptive arrangement for high rise pumps if approved at
> the adoption hearings.
>
> The foregoing is my opinion only and does not necessarily represent the
> opinion or intent of the NFPA 14 Technical Committee on Standpipe and
> Hose Systems.
>
> Steve Leyton
> Protection Design & Consulting
> San Diego, CA
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of sam b
> Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 12:36 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: PRV Station :
>
> Hiii..
> Everyone.
>  Tis is sam again..
>
> Have a small doubt,may b a simple one..but please help
>
> when designing fire protection systems for high rise buildings,
> we used to consider PRV stations if pressure required @ pump side is
> more
> than 12 bar.
> Is there any code requirment stating that.??
> Also..
> What  about additional PRV stations.?
> suppose if the pressure required is 25 bar should we take two PRV
> stations.or is it like we consider 2 pumps with PRV stations each (high
> zone
> /lowzone)??
>
> Is there any thumbrule or guidelines in this aspect..??
>
> Please give your views.
>
> Thaanx in advance...
>
> Sam b
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