Actually, that language is tied to DOT regulations and my understanding is that moving and storage companies have been forced (by industry-wide BMP's and insurers) to diligently manage the contents of moving vaults. The Republic franchisees are REQUIRED to pack the vaults with their own employees, who then sign off on the manifest. Household goods are generally Classes III-IV - natural fiber and synthetic clothing, furniture without and without upholstery, mattress sets being higher as a Class III foundation and Group A mattress. There are different crates that are used for large pieces of furniture such as sofas, and sometimes for mattresses too. The amount of straight Group A is a variable, thinking of toys, kitchen goods, etc. but as a percentage of overall volume not the prevailing commodity. There are no sources of ignition within the vaults.
Most families move via van - stuff out of the old house and right into the new. Vaults are used for overseas moves and displaced goods that for various reasons are stored for periods of time ranging from days to years, but generally for short periods of time. These are VERY transient fire loads. And many of the moves that utilize vaults done under contract with branches of the military and there are strict government rules about what can and can't be shipped. In fact Joe, there is a significantly higher level of diligence than I knew existed. One other thing to keep in mind though, there is a fairly new class of container that is made of rigid plastic or polymer, but I can't tell which and the manufacturer was no help at all on this last project. These are used for transoceanic shipping and in this case, the owner agreed to store them outside. Steve Leyton Protection Design & Consulting San Diego, CA -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joe Hankins Sent: Friday, November 21, 2008 2:01 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: FM Testing for Wooden Moving Crates This absolutely is not a class IV commodity. First, it's not a commodity at all. Class I-IV and plastics commodities as used for the development of the protection guidelines were all "unit loads" on pallets. Following the same logic, roll paper would be a class III commodity. Second, a package that can contain anything from expanded plastics to flammable liquids is not a class IV commodity. (The language in the contracts protects the storage company against liability if there is a fire. Does anybody think that they actually check what's in the units?) You can no more protect 23 ft. storage of these storage units with ceiling sprinklers than you can protect a three story furnished house with sprinklers in the attic. Joe Steve Leyton wrote: > This is solid pile, Class IV commodity, known in the industry as a > standard household "vault". They're usually about 7 feet tall and have > a pallet-base for lifting and moving. We just did a Republic Van Lines > franchise with 3-course storage, so we went with 23' of Class IV; > density was .354/2000 or .27/3000. See IBC Table 2306.2 for pile > height, area and maximum L/W dimensional data. Most companies that use > this type of vault have policies and language in their contract about > haz mats and flammable liquids. Some even require that the vaults only > be packed by their own personnel, to help assure AHJ's that dangerous or > prohibited materials aren't packed. > > Steve Leyton > Protection Design & Consulting > San Diego, CA > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ron > Greenman > Sent: Friday, November 21, 2008 10:59 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: FM Testing for Wooden Moving Crates > > Dave, > > This sounds like storage of household goods typically for military > personnel on deployment. The FM in the jurisdiction where I > encountered this required aisles and flue spaces although I forget > what criterion he based the acceptable layout on nor the performance > rating of the system. There was no foam. In this case he had to make a > call, chose a criterion, and said that'll have to do. > > On Fri, Nov 21, 2008 at 10:48 AM, Joe Hankins <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > >> Dave, >> >> FM has not tested this, nor are they likely to. This is not a >> > commodity, due > >> to the size, shielding, and variability of contents. Trying to protect >> against a fire inside one of the boxes with ceiling sprinklers is like >> trying to protect against a fire in a bedroom by putting sprinklers at >> > the > >> roof in the attic. >> >> Joe >> >> Dave Phelan wrote: >> >>> Good Friday Afternoon All, >>> >>> I'm looking for design info and perhaps an FM test report / data >>> > sheet for > >>> the warehouse storage of wooden moving crates. I have an existing >>> warehouse >>> where they store these 8 foot X 7 foot X 5 foot plywood crates of >>> > various > >>> items (all classes). The problem I see it is the crates are nested >>> > into > >>> rows and rows without any breaks, flue spaces, aisles, etc. There >>> > just > >>> doesnt seem to be any means by which water could penetrate the >>> > endless > >>> stacks, let alone reach the burning crate. >>> >>> The warehouse is reporting a .22 over 2000 sq. foot design area and >>> > is a > >>> wet >>> system. Has anyone on the list come across this type of occupancy >>> > and how > >>> did you design for it? >>> >>> Thanks. >>> >>> Dave Phelan, >>> An AHJ in NJ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum >>> For Technical Assistance, send an email to: >>> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> To Unsubscribe, send an email >>> > to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum >> For Technical Assistance, send an email to: >> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >> To Unsubscribe, send an email >> > to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >> (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) >> >> > > > > _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3631 (20081121) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
