The WHY part may be due to an inability to predict how many pumps will operate 
in any given scenario, so they flow all of them?
You've done more legwork researching this than I have, but its one reason I can 
think of to flow ALL- it may because a BLEVE or massive rapid oxidation may 
cause enough pressure drop for all pumps to come on, and need to make sure that 
supply is sufficient to give em what they need? Might be that after a x minute 
minimum run some might shut off (due to their pressure being satisfied) but for 
the duration of the min run timer, they're running.

George L.  Church, Jr., CET  
Rowe Sprinkler Systems, Inc.
PO Box 407, Middleburg, PA 17842
877-324-ROWE       570-837-6335 fax
[email protected]



-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] 
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Art Tiroly
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2011 4:01 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Simultaneous Pump Operation

Your last question can be determined by hydraulic calculation. If you need
4000 gpm flowing then calculate the flow and pressure drop through 12" or 
larger pipe. Check velocity and psi drop.


Arthur Tiroly
ATCO Fire Protection Design
Tiroly and Associates
24400 Highland Rd rm 25, CLE 44143
216-621-8899
216-570-7030 Cell
WWW.ATCOfirepro.com

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Hinson, Ryan
Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2011 3:09 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Simultaneous Pump Operation

NFPA 20 (2010) Section 14.2.5.2.3.1.  "Where simultaneous operation of the 
multiple pumps is possible or required as part of a system design, the 
acceptance test shall include ALL PUMPS operating simultaneously."  What is the 
rationale for "all pumps" versus required pumps to meet design?  Is it purely 
for maintaining the suction header velocity below 15 ft/s as indicated in 
Supplement 4, Technical/Substantive Changes from the 2007 Edition to the 2010 
Edition of NFPA 20?  There is no reference indicating the cumulative flow 
required.  Would system demand flow be used to meet this requirement since the 
pumps are already being flowed at higher necessary flows to conform to Section 
14.2.5.2.4?  Could it be to determine the capabilities of the electrical power 
supply to all pumps is in simultaneous operation?  Additionally, I can find no 
indication of what sizing the test piping or number of connections need to be 
used for such a scenario.

Thoughts?

Ryan L. Hinson, EIT, SET
Senior Fire Protection Engineer, Aviation & Facilities Group Burns & McDonnell 
Minneapolis-St. Paul Office
8201 Norman Center Drive, Suite 300
Bloomington, MN 55437
Direct: 952-656-3662
Fax: 952-229-2923
[email protected]
www.burnsmcd.com<BLOCKED::www.burnsmcd.com>


Proud recipient of PSMJ's Premier Award for Client Satisfaction

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