I’ve been following this thread and so far no one has asked if this would be a 13 or a 13R application.
I don’t know if it applies, but don’t forget Section 4.5 from NFPA 13R: 4.5 System Arrangement. In townhouse-style buildings protected in accordance with this standard, each dwelling unit shall have its own dedicated sprinkler system or the control valve for the sprinkler system in the building shall be located outside the dwelling units or in a common area. Larry Keeping From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Mark.Phelps Sent: November-28-17 8:30 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] RE: Looking for specific sprinkler code on tenant spaces In medical vernacular some surgeons are referred to as having the "God syndrome." If the shoe fits..... Mark at Aero 602 820-7894 Sent from my iPhone On Nov 28, 2017, at 6:02 PM, Steve Leyton <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: I was actually taught that term by several fire officials; had never heard it in the trade. SML From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Travis Mack Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2017 4:05 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: Looking for specific sprinkler code on tenant spaces I’ve always called it the “Badge Clause.” But I like “God Clause” more as some that try to apply it this way feel they are God. Travis Mack, SET MFP Design, LLC "Follow" us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/pages/MFP-Design-LLC/92218417692 Send large files to MFP Design via: https://www.hightail.com/u/MFPDesign Sent from my iPhone On Nov 28, 2017, at 4:54 PM, Steve Leyton <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: I don’t think anybody’s saying it’s a bad idea – I’m certainly in favor of it. The question was, is such a requirement in the code (or standard) and the answer is no. So, if an AHJ pulls one out of you-know-where and is asked to cite the applicable section, too often they will often cite the section that allows local modification by ordinance or regulation, which essentially empowers building and fire officials to restrict (or relax) the adopted building and fire code. Its intent is to facilitate local actions, which are supposed to be undertaken officially and documented. It is most assuredly NOT the intent of the local modification allowance that an individual gets to just make stuff up and force it on us across the counter, but that’s usually how it plays when such undocumented requirements are applied. The response that “I’m the fire official and I get to do as I please” has become known derisively as the God clause here – don’t know if that’s a universal term or not. Signed, Left Coaster From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Bruce Verhei Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2017 3:48 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: Looking for specific sprinkler code on tenant spaces God clause? I think it has more to do with trying to keep products of combustion from impairing ability to exit the building. How do they handle near constant T/I’s in malls without tenant shut offs? Still assuming a mall. Best. Bruce On Nov 28, 2017, at 15:38, Bruce Verhei <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Does it meet code definition for a mall? First, is it >50,000 sf.? A designed active smoke control system may be required. To initiate the smoke removal system either smoke detection, zoned by tenant space, or sprinkler system water flow, again, zoned by space are allowed. Of course with addressable detectors smoke detection is in reality a virtual zone. This is not the cross zoned system sprinkler folks often run up against. Smoke removal system is required to be designed by a PE. I would expect their activation matrix to include a clear specification as to choice of detection method. I’d also expect a method of testing flow switch. Provision: I do not have current IFC in front of me. Opinion. Sprinkler water flow is the way to go. Many fewer unwanted alarms. Evacuate the building once for 30 minutes on day after Thanksgiving and they’ll never make up any few dollars saved at construction. Best. Bruce Verhei On Nov 28, 2017, at 15:21, Timothy Goins <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: I don't know where I read it, but somewhere you must provide at least a common room/closet to access the valve and alarm system.. Just in case of an emergency or for service. This room must be accessible via outside for the fire Department and service personnel. Ore at least that's three plan down here.. And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh Eze 11:19 On Nov 28, 2017, at 5:13 PM, Vince Sabolik <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Help! We have an existing, sprinklered building - everything up to snuff. It's being converted to tenant spaces Is there specific code somewhere that allows an AHJ to require that each tenant space be given it's own shutoff, flow switch and alarm? thanks, Vince <piaboakeoohjhnkp.bmp> Vince Sabolik West Tech Fire Protection, Inc. 11351 Pearl Road / Strongsville, Ohio 44136 Phone 440 238-4800 Fax 440 238-4876 Cell 440 724-7601 _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> http://secure-web.cisco.com/1bMxHtAJ2vQtLnYjZMhG-g7ftgXJNWQyrE_CFzy9zGUU6iRCP9Y7DJYDd7bS7py6LclcDEwtwQWvDMhz8kMoyGA8A5lQS1Ig8WxQaDKd8nwakJxBsVJdPODAZ7aO9zQ7PW--kO05oyTP3532RMx8gsd68a_m1nXcNLhSzS16w57YU88OTh5RTKXSbclqCWMMIykG21kTKIPrfjaTWKAlXIWf75Ozq9sDh6KqIDPt7uPr8uJexIuE98mSLxImYAdCn/http%3A%2F%2Flists.firesprinkler.org%2Flistinfo.cgi%2Fsprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> http://secure-web.cisco.com/1bMxHtAJ2vQtLnYjZMhG-g7ftgXJNWQyrE_CFzy9zGUU6iRCP9Y7DJYDd7bS7py6LclcDEwtwQWvDMhz8kMoyGA8A5lQS1Ig8WxQaDKd8nwakJxBsVJdPODAZ7aO9zQ7PW--kO05oyTP3532RMx8gsd68a_m1nXcNLhSzS16w57YU88OTh5RTKXSbclqCWMMIykG21kTKIPrfjaTWKAlXIWf75Ozq9sDh6KqIDPt7uPr8uJexIuE98mSLxImYAdCn/http%3A%2F%2Flists.firesprinkler.org%2Flistinfo.cgi%2Fsprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> http://secure-web.cisco.com/1bMxHtAJ2vQtLnYjZMhG-g7ftgXJNWQyrE_CFzy9zGUU6iRCP9Y7DJYDd7bS7py6LclcDEwtwQWvDMhz8kMoyGA8A5lQS1Ig8WxQaDKd8nwakJxBsVJdPODAZ7aO9zQ7PW--kO05oyTP3532RMx8gsd68a_m1nXcNLhSzS16w57YU88OTh5RTKXSbclqCWMMIykG21kTKIPrfjaTWKAlXIWf75Ozq9sDh6KqIDPt7uPr8uJexIuE98mSLxImYAdCn/http%3A%2F%2Flists.firesprinkler.org%2Flistinfo.cgi%2Fsprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> http://secure-web.cisco.com/1bMxHtAJ2vQtLnYjZMhG-g7ftgXJNWQyrE_CFzy9zGUU6iRCP9Y7DJYDd7bS7py6LclcDEwtwQWvDMhz8kMoyGA8A5lQS1Ig8WxQaDKd8nwakJxBsVJdPODAZ7aO9zQ7PW--kO05oyTP3532RMx8gsd68a_m1nXcNLhSzS16w57YU88OTh5RTKXSbclqCWMMIykG21kTKIPrfjaTWKAlXIWf75Ozq9sDh6KqIDPt7uPr8uJexIuE98mSLxImYAdCn/http%3A%2F%2Flists.firesprinkler.org%2Flistinfo.cgi%2Fsprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
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