And John with the forward flow requirements being enforced by more and more jurisdictions then this full flow capability becomes essential.
Anthony Carrizosa Project Manager | Fire Protection 7855 S 206th St Kent, WA 98032 Cell: 206-679-5283 | Office Dir: 253-341-4593 [cid:image001.jpg@01D9D5A3.B83755C0] https://archerconstruction.com<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2farcherconstruction.com%2f&c=E,1,Wdb65AWzMgSBzW3HDw91SfcRQCtxDUQKoJf-UowQ-WnB_WMosgG-8W7eLePJ42PwWQvLiQx16Pls052VqwHO7tKm-_u5AnWly0ewkNiMkxn-AjQb1JI,&typo=1> From: John Denhardt <jdenha...@firesprinkler.org> Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2023 9:19 AM To: Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers <sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> Subject: [Sprinklerforum] Re: Roof Drain / Sprinkler Drain My only comment - wherever you take a drain discharge, if a main drain test needs to occur, MAKE SURE THE MAIN DRAIN VALVE CAN BE OPENED FULLY AND ALLOWED TO DISCHARGE AT FULL FLOW FOR SEVERAL MINUTES. A main drain test needs to be completed as required by NFPA 25. NO EXCEPTIONS TO THIS REQUIREMENT The above is my opinion and has not been processed as a formal interpretation in accordance with the NFPA Regulations Governing Committee Projects. This is provided with the understanding that the AFSA assumes no liability for this opinion or actions taken on it and they are not to be considered the official position of the AFSA, and/or NFPA or its technical committees.AFSA cannot provide design or consulting engineering services, and this opinion should therefore not be considered, nor relied upon, as such. Thanks, John [https://www.dropbox.com/s/g4h8r7hdtsr6154/AFSA_L.png?raw=1] John August Denhardt, PE Vice President, Engineering and Technical Services American Fire Sprinkler Association m: p: 301-343-1457 214-349-5965 ext 121 w: firesprinkler.org<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2ffiresprinkler.org%2f&c=E,1,L7UzD2wBUntMeESHnZwoqM429GQD9wf1V2jvpXSjkgYjbdqqkcwZKCYa7k87EKgDmMkuFNf-tk7G5bBN7adPKeXv5Rg7CaaDkIDtR9MKDqvguKTibOE,&typo=1> Experience the Magic of AFSA42! Click here<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.firesprinkler.org%2fregister-for-afsa42&c=E,1,eiOz2BHwjHxbFtXwC0Ocry-rh5avx4xiQ8aYuHjVI0iJZ7lFscGNpFd4Fn7VzBFxHEheSDvaMcewINWdTtpyUG-oV-RyNvv2g6DLwxh5vA,,&typo=1> to view the schedule and register for AFSA42: Convention, Exhibition, and Apprentice Competition at the Signia by Hilton Orlando Bonnet Creek September 6-9, 2023. On Wed, Aug 23, 2023 at 12:14 PM Steve Leyton <st...@protectiondesign.com<mailto:st...@protectiondesign.com>> wrote: Not so fast everyone. The answer to this question depends entirely on your location and the state/local rules that may apply to managing storm water runoff and what is allowed to enter the watershed via the storm drain system. It’s easy poke fun at CA because of our sometimes-suffocating regulatory environment, but it is now illegal to direct sprinkler water into the storm system. In fact, in most incorporated cities and counties, you cannot dump onto hardscape if water could run to the storm system. And CA is NOT the only state in the West with such restrictions – anywhere that water can run into the ocean, a bay or lake or river, we are now seeing these restrictions. Personally, I understand that if sprinkler water can enter a watershed, it will contaminate it and I accept these regulations as a necessary pain-in-the-ass. The challenge is not how to resolve new builds, it’s to deal with T.I./expansion projects and ITM throughout the built environment where old school test/drain discharge is open to the public way. There are bio filters (sand/oil) for the storm system that may be acceptable to enable discharge, but the project civil or owner has to get the private storm system approved if using that approach and water cannot enter the public system. Civil engineers and landscape architects engage bio-swales and detention features, and we sometimes coordinate with various means to get discharge to percolate into softscapes on site. But the best and most basic approach is to coordinate with the plumbing engineer and arrange for a hub drain (4” self-priming trap, 4”-->6” concentric increaser to a rubber-booted hub) to be roughed into the riser room. This enables adequate capacity for main drain and inspector’s tests, vents the drain per code and controls stinky smells. In your basement application, we would assume that there’s a sewer sump with an ejector, so take it to a hub drain in the basement or directly to the sump if you can. If you’re draining through a hose valve, you can obviously drop a hose to the sump. If one’s not being provided, ask for it and point out the challenge of ITM to ownership if the building’s not so equipped. My 4¢, Steve L. From: Brian Harris <bhar...@bvssystemsinc.com<mailto:bhar...@bvssystemsinc.com>> Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2023 6:43 AM To: Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers <sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org<mailto:sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org>> Subject: [Sprinklerforum] Re: Roof Drain / Sprinkler Drain Skyler- Thank you, will do. Brian Harris, CET BVS Systems Inc. bvssytemsinc.com<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fbvssystemsinc.com%2f&c=E,1,8PMFxnDFEYdpPYb1b8qKB8TBEDFlgsy8vMkWiSNHS_flt7LyfUPsROR1m3CKNJjjgk6YonxJEgmOlAL1lzQLV_k-HhcH8k1o-XAvL8FMd7y5j31uoDOZSSZg&typo=1> From: Skyler Bilbo <sbi...@wenteplumbing.com<mailto:sbi...@wenteplumbing.com>> Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2023 9:32 AM To: Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers <sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org<mailto:sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org>> Subject: [Sprinklerforum] Re: Roof Drain / Sprinkler Drain In most cases/places, the sprinkler water is considered gray water, and it would be OK to discharge a sprinkler drain to a storm sewer (this is most likely where it would end up if you have ever piped a sprinkler drain out an exterior wall). This is not OK everywhere, so for your specific project, it would be best to ask the AHJ and the plumber (and possibly the plumbing inspector) on the project if it is OK. -Skyler On Wed, Aug 23, 2023, 8:25 AM Brett Peters <br...@proudline.ca<mailto:br...@proudline.ca>> wrote: I think that would depend on the municipality, most do not want the sprinkler water going directly into the storm drains, drained to exterior or into a waste drain Thanks Brett Peters General Manager Installation & Design Proudline Fire Protection Services Ltd. br...@proudline.ca<mailto:br...@proudline.ca> 780 490 7602 office ext 202 780 490 7605 fax 780 777 0568 cell 780 718 2676 24h Visit us at www.proudline.ca<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fwww.proudline.ca%2f&c=E,1,FYuq3wA-j0OgI2oO61LW9r98f8FqCoJYEuvhgXxmAEISMDlYk5egq_h0ItthZOy_F4NqDQZUTxpdLGAtJ6UsQoPi3I5djLo-9KBrBmenLQ,,&typo=1> Proudline now offers ULc listed monitoring services, please contact a...@proudline.ca<mailto:a...@proudline.ca> for more information [https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fci3.googleusercontent.com%2fmail-sig%2fAIorK4wRo6r0eNDUWx8YR-4XJLvwcnouQn_xEZH_HIb4jDbepWtON2RWC-ekzvZHKtncFOQqPcNQfzM&c=E,1,Y4KnUnniJcNGIylZamAuX0Mv2206YeuJ_6g5CrMFrnnkbtzVP4ldMSjJ7qX9gp21BCJ5CSxI5b5LGOeOtLBTlIk67eYvsrguktBrwYUGUana52PUWFgR1cW57vMY&typo=1] [https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fci3.googleusercontent.com%2fmail-sig%2fAIorK4yJVI287VPLDWiW9maE2Np3U4CdszCY9deeyaLl8DM90wlBd7pnuOZV9U-swv-7gWN_24py6vo&c=E,1,4vOMlzA5VmaOMenNVRTMHHfi-9h7lbOGvuQVUabqaaSxGOHme8eybSD61m6f65pHhJSbIj19G6KW3BuqwcBw3BOCRExN59lNOeX5o4JXyeLJ1VyxMFM,&typo=1] [https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fci3.googleusercontent.com%2fmail-sig%2fAIorK4wlGmqj6Ja06DKOIMLPvEE8B2W8fT_TPPA3w-4JfqygLq9n77ECSni09YLIVICXJYzWo4Z0PjU&c=E,1,xq6YZVErQXwdQsI3U2hd6Hpo8khDYpuYzOL8zlkaLZXXEiVJSB52MW5dUsl-JSljGgAFWjZFX4_FqsZTd0iCDcWCla8V0nSdefhysJZebvz8ZwMyBkSVfFcQew,,&typo=1] [https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fci3.googleusercontent.com%2fmail-sig%2fAIorK4zEgPbs279KVEfWIpIiWNLel8zAlcloW9dNXGLTaE1cMz88CRkmg17fju5BQB_iIzhWK20DUL8&c=E,1,EnpojxxGNut2q9GlEgVs5jLVprTxnwjNGhZrcN_nnh9eII7tS5nSiCDxgDb-qJo_7GilAL4YLNDd9mqsIDeExB6QzYd0Hz9nss1PTarh13FJtgd9P08E4Jn97D9Z&typo=1] [https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fci3.googleusercontent.com%2fmail-sig%2fAIorK4z7J0kfmSGA8jKvDK0pTqW3KQlc5v-tYcWosmy5W7pdok462Gzu_9Ft7UK9oJUWDT1DzhQ4hUU&c=E,1,coD5OCsdRKXsGq0giBchWpumJV8BD7sQ7TR8cmw8j7dFAY2MqgE7uUPoRKslKBXEtkk251lr4bRvsoOqVm1iUBybU7SUOyQH9w9gjUaqJmjiOtkCrGqn&typo=1] [https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fci3.googleusercontent.com%2fmail-sig%2fAIorK4wTVHoTZxkppBoWSCTFnGLgGTq0apivi8sNvWPyBsloO0mmy8ZYu4Ax854jo7ihTMFyeYeOceg&c=E,1,8miSKtq8aXvzO6KWCKN_M40p0DbjlMGGl4lm-yL_k51eAJMdBh8EXSDKiSSE3Rwziaqbv9Fgj3_0lrYNGpliL0pK0Y7hTdRCKU8rkWnB6MBQiA,,&typo=1] [https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fci3.googleusercontent.com%2fmail-sig%2fAIorK4xwBWEOX5v9mpza4Jqf9lOKSwThBNvyIO7Rl-Cxo7NRiV7p70C0f1biwbh44Y-iIA5GcmD1MCo&c=E,1,GhHcclqm9NV41wSMHOIi3fwcm_q0astxv5A_KwQh9WCbk-0-BNGvYLCNyVDZVu8nF9pmuovBwFtcMAmz--_AUVJ-TTMs0tQAQP0h56Av0onGxs6VO41sxEg,&typo=1] [https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fci3.googleusercontent.com%2fmail-sig%2fAIorK4yPfO1HdtbQPYiKlYE38cwc88ABhX7xN1nh0fCK5LjFXjKplJggk3Xn6_XypmtMWyADKR7ZRGk&c=E,1,GLZHkpmbWES8Q8vCFk42yFDM4hzADVSo_lbob2JnW_h5sMrMUmgz_QYVER1VMvQnpRk2dXpOOpYHy0XBVfxeEGhqji1wPaMxWfxD0j9jnul8ZvWOMci3&typo=1] On Wed, Aug 23, 2023 at 6:53 AM Brian Harris <bhar...@bvssystemsinc.com<mailto:bhar...@bvssystemsinc.com>> wrote: We have a project with standpipes and a basement. All floors above the basement drain through the Standpipe drain and empty at grade. We usually then drain the remaining (basement) section of standpipe through the bottom hose valve. The GC is asking if we can instead drain that last section by tying into the roof drain in the same stairwell that runs outside below grade. Is this a no-no? Brian Harris, CET BVS Systems Inc. bvssystemsinc.com<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fbvssystemsinc.com%2f&c=E,1,Qfpa7Z13Zok4rg7c6W9OUwmeAxw8pd3IrRkawAoBaKbiuJyZjjxKjuzBelGHs1iaDizm1uQSKTgPkRVjoQE89xpUaabVIAB_WBOBTnRd_vOGQuZtQMHFrr48owE2&typo=1> Phone: 704.896.9989 Fax: 704.896.1935 _________________________________________________________ SprinklerForum mailing list: https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2flists.firesprinkler.org%2flist%2fsprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org&c=E,1,XIKxPbobx-1CX2NpE6JCypm1JVdTpCmHPX0ZN0dnbpAMjLYREYwOWaPSvJaizuv0UnppB4lSw3Z-iJKP3XjUwllg4ZpVzJJdZLMDxwp2StQ,&typo=1> To unsubscribe send an email to sprinklerforum-le...@lists.firesprinkler.org<mailto:sprinklerforum-le...@lists.firesprinkler.org> _________________________________________________________ SprinklerForum mailing list: https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2flists.firesprinkler.org%2flist%2fsprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org&c=E,1,HDC2jNjtX0jqf-psYrTl9kUug9tuszVdbDdI5c2E4phFLoJoCFnHwg5u4wIGfokkRas2ab1_PjTQYp1PlxDUSWbc_ZwzZ_pbckXMZc-l2io_CeoAngypazg-4Q,,&typo=1> To unsubscribe send an email to sprinklerforum-le...@lists.firesprinkler.org<mailto:sprinklerforum-le...@lists.firesprinkler.org> _________________________________________________________ SprinklerForum mailing list: https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2flists.firesprinkler.org%2flist%2fsprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org&c=E,1,6mS-U9gDyWNV_SNU1VJzxTv5hz-rZt4qc00MFIcRGz4a2-DEHQmlrtIz7fIM8iPjlqXJtG7gGimfvnwftqiIg9huDrymf-R1X_gwEUcvlYkcFdk,&typo=1> To unsubscribe send an email to sprinklerforum-le...@lists.firesprinkler.org<mailto:sprinklerforum-le...@lists.firesprinkler.org>
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