Mark's company web site is using asp, lol. Thinh
-----Original Message----- From: Galbreath, Mark [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2002 12:26 PM To: 'Struts Users Mailing List' Subject: RE: IDE for EJB2.0 development Boy, it's going to be real hard to think up a thread like this one for tomorrow! Mark -----Original Message----- From: Joseph Barefoot [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2002 1:24 PM To: Struts Users Mailing List Subject: RE: IDE for EJB2.0 development I agree with 95% of what you say, James, but just for the record, many of us have a profound distaste for Microsoft not because of their software, but because of their business practices. They have a solid history of "borrowing" from existing software and technology to build their own products (esp. open source), and then using their leverage to make sure that their product is dominant in the marketplace. How many company's web sites were built with ASP only because the company had some sort of pre-existing "preferred partner" arrangement with Microsoft? More than you or I will ever know, that's for sure. I personally happen to really like some of Microsoft's office software, but I would never work to develop a Microsoft product, for the same reasons that I would never work for PG&E--they simply do not play nice with others. Note that this doesn't mean I won't *use* their products or technology if I find them to be superior, I just won't help *build* something that may be turned into a marketing leviathon. peace, Joe Barefoot > -----Original Message----- > From: James Mitchell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2002 7:13 AM > To: Struts Users Mailing List > Subject: RE: IDE for EJB2.0 development > > > OK, OK. So I said the > > This is so childish, almost comical! > (Wish it was Friday) > > *Disclaimer - The following paragraph is not aimed at any ONE person, I > simply ask this of every developer who thinks they can spread their > ill-founded beliefs on everyone else. > > At what point in Technology did YOU decide that it was time to stop > advancing? > Who the hell made YOU dictator to decide what qualifies as guru-hood? > > I've noticed a trend with such people. > > When they started out learning how to be a programmer, they were eager to > learn things and eager to try out new stuff. Then, when they were > considered to be on the leading edge of technology, they felt REALLY > powerful and strong. That's right, they were the gurus of the moment. > > Then, all of a sudden something new came into town and they had to defend > their guru status. > Instead of embracing the newest technology and helping others to improve > their product (code), they were bitter and complained amongst themselves, > trying to convince each other that they were still the gurus of today. > Meanwhile, as the jobs for that type of work began to dry up. > Some of them > still clung to their beliefs that they were right and everyone else was > stupid. > > > So which one are you? North-going or South-going? > > http://www.eg.bucknell.edu/~cs315/subpages/inline/Zax.html > > > Doesn't matter, you fit the qualifications for both. > > > > > > I admit that I got my start as a developer on the Microsoft side of the > fence. Why? Well, because everything was free. I was in the Army and > didn't make a lot of money so FREE sounded really good to me. I started > learning html and moved right into Visual Basic 3, 4, and 5. However, the > technology that got me into 6 figures was ASP. That's right Active Server > Pages. > Then came along this phenomenon called Java. I was introduced to > the Struts > framework and quickly realized just how superior it was to ASP. > I have been > a believer ever since. > > One thing I noticed on the Non-MS side of the fence that I didn't > see on the > MS side was the bitterness and anger that some people have for the other > side. > > I guess I just don't get it. Some people at my last job actually > treated me > like sh## because I "used to be" an ASP developer. Hmmmm, I don't recall > such hostility about Java developers from anyone at any of my previous MS > shop jobs. > In fact, one guy actually started talking to me and helping me > only after he > heard me tell a friend that I had just installed Linux on my laptop. > > WHAT THE FU$#$%#$%#$!!!!!!!! > > Where is this hatred coming from people? > Why don't you just get over it and get a life! Microsoft ISN'T going > away!!! > > If you don't like their software, then stop using it......but > just shut the > hell up!!! > > JM > > P.S. Oh crap, I used spellchecker before sending this message. Oh well, > guess I'm not an e-mail guru. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Chappell, Simon P [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2002 8:52 AM > > To: Struts Users Mailing List > > Subject: RE: IDE for EJB2.0 development > > > > > > I think that it would be safe to say that the use of any form of > > GUI with your editor would disqualify you from the higher levels > > of Guruhood. If you can't type it, then it isn't real. Who needs > > search and replace dialogues when you can type > > > > :%s/string1/string2/g > > > > Is that not a beautiful thing? :-) > > > > Simon > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > Simon P. Chappell [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Java Programming Specialist www.landsend.com > > Lands' End, Inc. (608) 935-4526 > > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > > >From: Joseph Barefoot [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > >Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2002 6:53 PM > > >To: Struts Users Mailing List > > >Subject: RE: IDE for EJB2.0 development > > > > > > > > >Okay, I have to ask a question of all of you emacs/vi > > >developers out there > > >with S's on your chests: > > > > > >Are graphical versions of these tools allowed in the kindom of > > >Studcodia, or > > >monochromatic versions only? ;) > > > > > >peace, > > > > > >Joe Barefoot > > > > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: Galbreath, Mark [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > >> Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2002 2:38 PM > > >> To: 'Struts Users Mailing List' > > >> Subject: RE: IDE for EJB2.0 development > > >> > > >> > > >> Well, I'm sure your tool is bigger than mine. > > >> > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: James Mitchell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > >> Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2002 4:03 PM > > >> To: Struts Users Mailing List > > >> Subject: RE: IDE for EJB2.0 development > > >> > > >> > > >> Actually, its a 'my tool is better than your lack of one' rant :-) > > >> > > >> JM > > >> > > >> > -----Original Message----- > > >> > From: Schneider, Eric [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > >> > Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2002 3:50 PM > > >> > To: 'Struts Users Mailing List' > > >> > Subject: RE: IDE for EJB2.0 development > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > I'm enjoying the 'my tool is better than your tool' rant. > > >> > > > >> > Your talk of assembly line workers reminds me of analogies > > >I've read in > > >> > engineering books. Many have references to the industrial > > >> revolution and > > >> > how productivity and efficiency skyrocketed with the use of > > >> > assembly lines. > > >> > But I guess that's only true for uninteresting factory crap. > > >> > > > >> > e. > > >> > > > >> > > -----Original Message----- > > >> > > From: Galbreath, Mark [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > >> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2002 3:24 PM > > >> > > To: 'Struts Users Mailing List' > > >> > > Subject: RE: IDE for EJB2.0 development > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > A more appropriate analogy would be hand-made furniture vs. > > >> > > the crap you buy > > >> > > from a factory. And carpenters are much more > > >interesting people than > > >> > > assembly-line workers. (hint-hint) > > >> > > > > >> > > Mark > > >> > > > > >> > > -----Original Message----- > > >> > > From: James Mitchell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > >> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2002 3:15 PM > > >> > > To: Struts Users Mailing List > > >> > > Subject: RE: IDE for EJB2.0 development > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > No no, I have to agree with Mark. Real programmers use text > > >> > > editors just > > >> > > like "Real" construction workers use pitch forks and shovels > > >> > > and not those > > >> > > fancy bull dozers and front-end loaders. > > >> > > > > >> > > What happened to the good-ole days where it took a year and > > >> > > half to build a > > >> > > house!!! > > >> > > > > >> > > JM > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > -----Original Message----- > > >> > > > From: Chappell, Simon P [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > >> > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2002 1:35 PM > > >> > > > To: Struts Users Mailing List > > >> > > > Subject: RE: IDE for EJB2.0 development > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > I have to go there .... even if it isn't Friday! :-) > > >> > > > > > >> > > > REAL programmers use vi. EMACS is an operating system trying to > > >> > > > pass itself off as a text editor (Mmmmm ... LISP as your > > >> > > > scripting language!). > > >> > > > > > >> > > > As an aside, even a relevent aside, I have been tinkering with > > >> > > > jEdit (http://www.jedit.org) and have found it to be a > > >very good > > >> > > > general text editor. It has a growing collection of > > >plugins that > > >> > > > utilise such goodies as syntax highlighting, ant and > > >refactoring > > >> > > > support. Check it out! > > >> > > > > > >> > > > Simon > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >----------------------------------------------------------------- > > >> > > > Simon P. Chappell > > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >> > > > Java Programming Specialist > > >www.landsend.com > > >> > > > Lands' End, Inc. > > >(608) 935-4526 > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > >-----Original Message----- > > >> > > > >From: Galbreath, Mark [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > >> > > > >Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2002 11:53 AM > > >> > > > >To: 'A mailing list for Java(tm) 2 Platform, > > >Enterprise Edition' > > >> > > > >Cc: Struts (E-mail); Bartles, Todd; Bronner, Bryon; > > >Harter, David; > > >> > > > >Kerstetter, Shawn; Mannam, Ram; Pakiru, Vamshidhar; Tony > > >> > > (E-mail); Veni > > >> > > > >(E-mail) > > >> > > > >Subject: RE: IDE for EJB2.0 development > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > >Real programmers use EMACS or VI. Period. > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > >http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/real.programmers.html > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > >Mark > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > >-- > > >> > > > >To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > >> > > > ><mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> > > > >For additional commands, e-mail: > > >> > > > ><mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > -- > > >> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > >> > > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > >> > > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > -- > > >> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > >> > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > >> > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> > > > > >> > > -- > > >> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > >> > > <mailto:struts-user-> [EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> > > For > > >> > > additional commands, > > >> > > e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >********************************************************************** > > >> > This message, including any attachments, contains confidential > > >> > information intended for a specific individual and purpose, and > > >> > is protected by law. If you are not the intended recipient, > > >> > please contact sender immediately by reply e-mail and destroy all > > >> > copies. You are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, or > > >> > distribution of this message, or the taking of any action based > > >> > on it, is strictly prohibited. > > >> > TIAA-CREF > > >> > > > >********************************************************************** > > >> > > > >> > -- > > >> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > >> > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> > For additional commands, e-mail: > > >> > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> -- > > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > >> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> For additional commands, e-mail: > > >> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> > > >> -- > > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > ><mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >For additional commands, e-mail: > > ><mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > > > >-- > > >To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > ><mailto:struts-user->[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >For > > >additional commands, > > >e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > > > > > -- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > > -- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> For additional commands, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> For additional commands, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> For additional commands, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> For additional commands, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
