who are ginger and mary anne? > -----Original Message----- > From: Jaye Bass [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: 04 March 2003 01:43 > To: 'Struts Users Mailing List' > Subject: RE: [OT] Text editor usage (was RE: [OT]: What is vim?) > > > First off...I'd take Mary Ann any day. Second I love IntelliJ. Does it > make me a better programmer...I think it probably does: alt-enter, > refactoring, multiple paste buffers, optimizing imports, > finding usages, > ok CVS support and a pretty decent debugger. I know it makes me a > happier programmer. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jeff Kyser [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Monday, March 03, 2003 4:57 PM > To: Struts Users Mailing List > Subject: Re: [OT] Text editor usage (was RE: [OT]: What is vim?) > > Wow, this argument is about as winnable as a 'Ginger or Mary Anne' > discussion > and not nearly as interesting. Although the diatribes about > productivity are > kinda humorous, given the context ;) > > -jeff > > > On Monday, March 3, 2003, at 04:42 PM, Assenza, Chris wrote: > > > If one were to make a value judgement such as "better" then > one would > > require a common basis for comparison. I would be safe in assuming > > that not > > everyone here is analyzing this question based on a common frame of > > reference, in fact I bet we all have slightly different concepts of > > who or > > what makes a better programmer. > > > > Therefore, the first question to ask must instead be: "What does it > > mean to > > be a good programmer?" or even: "What is a good programmer." For > > argument's > > sake, as part of our answer to that question we say that > one trait of > > a good > > programmer is thorough knowledge (or perhaps memorization) of a > > syntax. If > > that is true, then someone who uses a text editor is more > likely to be > > considered a better programmer. > > > > However, it can be argued that syntax memorization is not so > > all-important. > > For example, there are many excellent writers and thinkers > who cannot > > spell > > worth a dime, yet they work with words all day long. As such, the > > programmer who uses an IDE may well be a "better" programmer in the > > sense > > that A) the IDE supplements their knowledge of the syntax and B) > > separates > > the programmer from a requirement to memorize syntax and instead > > allows them > > to focus on what they're supposed to be doing: engineering software > > through > > solid design principles, etc. > > > > Ultimately, I think the answer is completely subjective and depends > > wholly > > on what one means by "better" programmer. Certainly someone > who lives > > in an > > IDE cannot jump into Textpad and be expected to be nearly as > > productive, but > > that does not necessarily diminish their core aptitude as a > programmer! > > > > All that being said, if you don't use Textpad you're a n00b! =) > > > > -Chris > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Chappell, Simon P [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Sent: Monday, March 03, 2003 4:58 PM > > To: Struts Users Mailing List > > Subject: RE: [OT] Text editor usage (was RE: [OT]: What is vim?) > > > > > > No. I very specifically said that the better programmers > CAN use text > > editors and command-line tools. This does not mean that > they have to, > > only > > that they COULD use them if they choose to. I now use the > Eclipse IDE > > for > > alot of my personal programming because it is like a text > editor that > > wants > > to be helpful. I like the wrappers that it gives me for the > compiles > > and > > junit tests, but that it keeps out of the way for the > actual editing > > if I > > don't invoke any of the "helpful" intelli-wotsits. > > > > Simon > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Chen, Gin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >> Sent: Monday, March 03, 2003 3:49 PM > >> To: 'Struts Users Mailing List' > >> Subject: RE: [OT] Text editor usage (was RE: [OT]: What is vim?) > >> > >> > >> I think your confusing personal perference with programming skill. > >> Thats like saying that Ted drink Sprite when most of the > >> better programmers > >> drinks Mountain Dew. > >> -Tim > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Chappell, Simon P [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >> Sent: Monday, March 03, 2003 4:38 PM > >> To: Struts Users Mailing List > >> Subject: [OT] Text editor usage (was RE: [OT]: What is vim?) > >> > >> > >> Actually, my primary point was text editor usage and > >> programmer ability. > >> > >> It is my personal observation that the better programmers use > >> text editors. > >> (vi or emacs or jedit or vim ... I don't care ... that's not > >> the argument > >> here). I'm not quite saying that IDEs are bad, although > I'm certainly > >> tempted to say that some days, but programmers who CAN program > >> with text > >> editors and command-line tools are orders of magnitude better > >> than those who > >> can't. You are more than welcome to tell me that you believe > >> this is not so, > >> but I have observed it enough that, to me, it is a truism. > >> > >> Simon > >> > >>> -----Original Message----- > >>> From: David Graham [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> Sent: Monday, March 03, 2003 2:56 PM > >>> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> Subject: RE: [OT]: What is vim? > >>> > >>> > >>>>> > >>>>> VIM (vi) beats the hell out of EMACS, unless you are a LISP > >>>>> weenie with a > >>>>> masochistic bent. And any non-dot-completion editor refines > >>>>> your sense of > >>>>> the API because it forces you to RTFM. > >>>>> > >>>>> Mark > >>> > >>> I use an ide and am referencing javadoc all the time anyways. > >>> I don't see > >>> any correlation between ide use and api ignorance. > >>> > >>> David > >>> > >>> > >>> _________________________________________________________________ > >>> Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. > >>> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail > >>> > >>> > >>> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> For additional commands, e-mail: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >> For additional commands, e-mail: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >> > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >> For additional commands, e-mail: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >> > >> > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >
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