On Mon, Aug 9, 2010 at 10:48 AM, Walter Bender <walter.ben...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Mon, Aug 9, 2010 at 10:37 AM, Christian Marc Schmidt > <christianm...@gmail.com> wrote: >> Comments inline... >> >> On Mon, Aug 9, 2010 at 2:58 AM, Walter Bender <walter.ben...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >>> >>> On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 4:51 PM, Christian Marc Schmidt >>> <christianm...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> > Hi Gary--thanks for the interesting mockup! My feedback: >>> > The spiral is interesting and worth exploring. But I would continue to >>> > focus >>> > the view on a single organizational system, whether ring, spiral, >>> > freeform, >>> > list, etc. This preserves the integrity and extensibility of the UI >>> > views >>> > metaphor, and doesn't overload the screen. Because the iconographic >>> > language >>> > is already very abstract and pared down, we need to make sure that the >>> > interaction paradigm is clear and focused. >>> > Based on your rendering I think that the spiral in itself is definitely >>> > worth exploring further, and I like Walter's idea that it could start as >>> > a >>> > ring and grow into a spiral when more activities are added. That seems >>> > like >>> > an elegant and scalable solution. Favoriting could happen in the >>> > Journal, or >>> > we could opt to always display all activities--either seems like a >>> > potentially workable solution... >>> > We should also come back to the resume/start new proposal and figure out >>> > if >>> > we want to adopt any of the proposals. >>> > >>> > Christian >>> > On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 4:38 PM, Gary Martin <garycmar...@googlemail.com> >>> > wrote: >>> >> >>> >> On 8 Aug 2010, at 14:54, Gary Martin wrote: >>> >> >>> >> > On 8 Aug 2010, at 13:42, Hilaire Fernandes >>> >> > <hilaire.fernan...@gmail.com> >>> >> > wrote: >>> >> > >>> >> >> Le 08/08/2010 13:59, Walter Bender a écrit : >>> >> >>> See >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Spiral_Home_View#Detailed_Description >>> >> >>> for the latest screen shots. I made some changes to the way I >>> >> >>> generate >>> >> >>> the Spiral -- I start from the outside rather than the inside to >>> >> >>> minimize the visual disruption between the Ring and the Spiral. I >>> >> >>> don't ever shrink the icon size in the Ring, but do so in the >>> >> >>> Spiral >>> >> >>> once the minimum radius is reached. Perhaps most controversial, I >>> >> >>> introduce an intermediate icon size between standard and small >>> >> >>> along >>> >> >>> the way. >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> Gary: I'll post a new patch to the ticket momentarily. >>> >> >>> (http://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/2143) >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> Comments/suggestions? >>> >> >> >>> >> >> Don't you need a way to recreate a taxonomy when the numbers of >>> >> >> activities grows? >>> >> > >>> >> > Search (ghost out non matches, as per neighbourhood view design) in >>> >> > the >>> >> > fav. view would seem an ideal next step here when dealing with many >>> >> > activities. Allowing drag and drop that would trigger a switch from a >>> >> > fixed >>> >> > layout pattern to random mode (with the layout initially intact), >>> >> > and/or >>> >> > reordering the sequence by drag'n'drop insertions would allow some >>> >> > flexibility. >>> >> > >>> >> > Ideally icons would be either snapped to the shape (dragging N units >>> >> > close to a snapped icon or the XO) or freeform positioned (by >>> >> > dragging N >>> >> > units away from their/a set position). With different icons in either >>> >> > state >>> >> > for a single view (I.e. a spiral with a few frequent icons dragged >>> >> > out into >>> >> > empty space). The current random view could then go away (as each >>> >> > view could >>> >> > be as random or not as desired). >>> >> >>> >> Just as a follow up to my above comment, attached is a quick home view >>> >> vector mockup. It assumes the list view is gone, with Journal stars >>> >> being >>> >> used to indicate (arbitrary entry) home favourites. It shows a 'snap to >>> >> spiral' pattern, with several random clusters of activities/objects >>> >> previously dragged out of the pattern by the user. Coloured icons would >>> >> resume specific activity id objects, grey icons would be used to launch >>> >> new >>> >> instances (with the usual resume drop down palette of N most recent >>> >> activities of that type). >>> >> >>> >> The spiral would re-flow once an icon is dragged out and dropped (in >>> >> empty >>> >> space), or dragged in and dropped (on an already snapped icon). If all >>> >> icons >>> >> were dragged out you would have what would look like the random layout, >>> >> dragging an icon back onto the central XO would start reflowing a >>> >> snapped >>> >> pattern design again, as would adding new activity favourites. >>> >> >>> >> Again, just a future possible approach. Definitely no need to try and >>> >> land >>> >> something like this all in one go. >>> >> >>> >> --Gary >>> >> >>> >> > But Walters spirals, without any of the above type extras, is still a >>> >> > huge improvement for those that want to fav many activities. I'm >>> >> > already >>> >> > hard-pressed to find new activities to fill up the view for testing, >>> >> > really >>> >> > scrapping the barrel. >>> >> > >>> >> > For those of you involved in deployments — roughly how many >>> >> > activities >>> >> > do you think kids/teachers currently commonly have? >>> >> > >>> >> >> For example grouping related activities in spiral >>> >> >> segments and reinforcing this with common icon color scheme in these >>> >> >> segments. >>> >> > >>> >> > -1 No to a color scheme here. Colour is already used for identity. >>> >> > It's >>> >> > bad enough that the GC activities, and a few others, break the colour >>> >> > metaphor by not bothering with the &fill_color and &stroke_color >>> >> > variables — >>> >> > adding even more colour metaphors would not help! ;) >>> >> > >>> >> > --Gary >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > -- >>> > anyth...@christianmarcschmidt.com >>> > 917/ 575 0013 >>> > >>> > http://www.christianmarcschmidt.com >>> > http://www.linkedin.com/in/christianmarcschmidt >>> > http://twitter.com/cms_ >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Sugar-devel mailing list >>> > Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org >>> > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>> > >>> > >>> >>> I've added back in the MEDIUM_ICON_SIZE to the Ring when there are >>> only a few icons. (See >>> >>> http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Spiral_Home_View#Detailed_Description). >>> Specific uestions for the design team: >>> >>> (1) Can we reach consensus re spiraling in from the MAXIMUM radius >>> once the Ring is full or spiraling out from the MINIMUM radius once >>> the Ring is full? >> >> I would say spiraling in from max radius. That way we can maximize the >> efficiency of the ring, before transitioning to the spiral. >> Walter, looking at your mockups I'd try to come up with an algorithm that >> gives us a looser spiral with more space between each segment of the spiral, >> more along the lines of what Gary mocked up. The screenshots on the wiki >> look very dense. Gary's mockup really proved to me that this can work! > > > Hmm. Since Gary's mockup was based on my patch, I wonder what would > have changed? I did make this spiral tighter than one I originally > made for the modifying Sugar example. I'll generate some variations to > look at. >
See http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Spiral_Home_View#Detailed_Description >>> >>> (2) Is is OK to add an INTERMEDIATE icon size between STANDARD and SMALL? >> >> I'd even go further and suggest that we could have icons scale dynamically >> within the ring/spiral, to achieve maximum balance between the available >> space and icon legibility. >> My only concern here is that we'd need to find the right balance so as not >> to interrupt the general zoom metaphor, going from large to small icons >> (home to neighborhood). This means we probably need to put a cap on the >> bottom end of the scale, not allowing icons to become too small so that they >> could reach the size of icons in the groups view... >> All this will take lots of exploration I think before getting it right. I >> can work on mockups if that would help... > > I'm pretty convinced that smaller than SMALL is not very useful. I > could add a few more intermediaries, but it is already a reasonably > fine-grained transition. The question is, when to make the transition. > Right now I trigger it when the Spiral is full. As per Q3 below, I > could trigger it a bit sooner. See http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Spiral_Home_View#Detailed_Description >> >>> >>> (3) In regard to Q1, I could trigger the spiral before the Ring hits >>> the MAXIMUM radius, perhaps at MAXIMUM-icon_size? (I've not >>> illustrated this yet.) >> >> Yes, I think that probably makes sense. We should play through all the >> possibilities and then make a decision based on what works best... >> > > I'll mock this up too... I tried it and it was problematic in that starting the spiral at MAXIMUM will result in a gap in the spiral. > > thanks. > > -walter >>> >>> -walter >>> >>> -- >>> Walter Bender >>> Sugar Labs >>> http://www.sugarlabs.org >> >> >> >> -- >> anyth...@christianmarcschmidt.com >> 917/ 575 0013 >> >> http://www.christianmarcschmidt.com >> http://www.linkedin.com/in/christianmarcschmidt >> http://twitter.com/cms_ >> > > > > -- > Walter Bender > Sugar Labs > http://www.sugarlabs.org > Gary: I'm posting the new patch (with a looser spiral and more intermediaries) to the Ticket. -walter -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org _______________________________________________ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel