On Mon, Aug 9, 2010 at 12:32 PM, Walter Bender <walter.ben...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Mon, Aug 9, 2010 at 10:48 AM, Walter Bender <walter.ben...@gmail.com> > wrote: >> On Mon, Aug 9, 2010 at 10:37 AM, Christian Marc Schmidt >> <christianm...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> Comments inline... >>> >>> On Mon, Aug 9, 2010 at 2:58 AM, Walter Bender <walter.ben...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 4:51 PM, Christian Marc Schmidt >>>> <christianm...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> > Hi Gary--thanks for the interesting mockup! My feedback: >>>> > The spiral is interesting and worth exploring. But I would continue to >>>> > focus >>>> > the view on a single organizational system, whether ring, spiral, >>>> > freeform, >>>> > list, etc. This preserves the integrity and extensibility of the UI >>>> > views >>>> > metaphor, and doesn't overload the screen. Because the iconographic >>>> > language >>>> > is already very abstract and pared down, we need to make sure that the >>>> > interaction paradigm is clear and focused. >>>> > Based on your rendering I think that the spiral in itself is definitely >>>> > worth exploring further, and I like Walter's idea that it could start as >>>> > a >>>> > ring and grow into a spiral when more activities are added. That seems >>>> > like >>>> > an elegant and scalable solution. Favoriting could happen in the >>>> > Journal, or >>>> > we could opt to always display all activities--either seems like a >>>> > potentially workable solution... >>>> > We should also come back to the resume/start new proposal and figure out >>>> > if >>>> > we want to adopt any of the proposals. >>>> > >>>> > Christian >>>> > On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 4:38 PM, Gary Martin <garycmar...@googlemail.com> >>>> > wrote: >>>> >> >>>> >> On 8 Aug 2010, at 14:54, Gary Martin wrote: >>>> >> >>>> >> > On 8 Aug 2010, at 13:42, Hilaire Fernandes >>>> >> > <hilaire.fernan...@gmail.com> >>>> >> > wrote: >>>> >> > >>>> >> >> Le 08/08/2010 13:59, Walter Bender a écrit : >>>> >> >>> See >>>> >> >>> >>>> >> >>> http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Spiral_Home_View#Detailed_Description >>>> >> >>> for the latest screen shots. I made some changes to the way I >>>> >> >>> generate >>>> >> >>> the Spiral -- I start from the outside rather than the inside to >>>> >> >>> minimize the visual disruption between the Ring and the Spiral. I >>>> >> >>> don't ever shrink the icon size in the Ring, but do so in the >>>> >> >>> Spiral >>>> >> >>> once the minimum radius is reached. Perhaps most controversial, I >>>> >> >>> introduce an intermediate icon size between standard and small >>>> >> >>> along >>>> >> >>> the way. >>>> >> >>> >>>> >> >>> Gary: I'll post a new patch to the ticket momentarily. >>>> >> >>> (http://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/2143) >>>> >> >>> >>>> >> >>> Comments/suggestions? >>>> >> >> >>>> >> >> Don't you need a way to recreate a taxonomy when the numbers of >>>> >> >> activities grows? >>>> >> > >>>> >> > Search (ghost out non matches, as per neighbourhood view design) in >>>> >> > the >>>> >> > fav. view would seem an ideal next step here when dealing with many >>>> >> > activities. Allowing drag and drop that would trigger a switch from a >>>> >> > fixed >>>> >> > layout pattern to random mode (with the layout initially intact), >>>> >> > and/or >>>> >> > reordering the sequence by drag'n'drop insertions would allow some >>>> >> > flexibility. >>>> >> > >>>> >> > Ideally icons would be either snapped to the shape (dragging N units >>>> >> > close to a snapped icon or the XO) or freeform positioned (by >>>> >> > dragging N >>>> >> > units away from their/a set position). With different icons in either >>>> >> > state >>>> >> > for a single view (I.e. a spiral with a few frequent icons dragged >>>> >> > out into >>>> >> > empty space). The current random view could then go away (as each >>>> >> > view could >>>> >> > be as random or not as desired). >>>> >> >>>> >> Just as a follow up to my above comment, attached is a quick home view >>>> >> vector mockup. It assumes the list view is gone, with Journal stars >>>> >> being >>>> >> used to indicate (arbitrary entry) home favourites. It shows a 'snap to >>>> >> spiral' pattern, with several random clusters of activities/objects >>>> >> previously dragged out of the pattern by the user. Coloured icons would >>>> >> resume specific activity id objects, grey icons would be used to launch >>>> >> new >>>> >> instances (with the usual resume drop down palette of N most recent >>>> >> activities of that type). >>>> >> >>>> >> The spiral would re-flow once an icon is dragged out and dropped (in >>>> >> empty >>>> >> space), or dragged in and dropped (on an already snapped icon). If all >>>> >> icons >>>> >> were dragged out you would have what would look like the random layout, >>>> >> dragging an icon back onto the central XO would start reflowing a >>>> >> snapped >>>> >> pattern design again, as would adding new activity favourites. >>>> >> >>>> >> Again, just a future possible approach. Definitely no need to try and >>>> >> land >>>> >> something like this all in one go. >>>> >> >>>> >> --Gary >>>> >> >>>> >> > But Walters spirals, without any of the above type extras, is still a >>>> >> > huge improvement for those that want to fav many activities. I'm >>>> >> > already >>>> >> > hard-pressed to find new activities to fill up the view for testing, >>>> >> > really >>>> >> > scrapping the barrel. >>>> >> > >>>> >> > For those of you involved in deployments — roughly how many >>>> >> > activities >>>> >> > do you think kids/teachers currently commonly have? >>>> >> > >>>> >> >> For example grouping related activities in spiral >>>> >> >> segments and reinforcing this with common icon color scheme in these >>>> >> >> segments. >>>> >> > >>>> >> > -1 No to a color scheme here. Colour is already used for identity. >>>> >> > It's >>>> >> > bad enough that the GC activities, and a few others, break the colour >>>> >> > metaphor by not bothering with the &fill_color and &stroke_color >>>> >> > variables — >>>> >> > adding even more colour metaphors would not help! ;) >>>> >> > >>>> >> > --Gary >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > -- >>>> > anyth...@christianmarcschmidt.com >>>> > 917/ 575 0013 >>>> > >>>> > http://www.christianmarcschmidt.com >>>> > http://www.linkedin.com/in/christianmarcschmidt >>>> > http://twitter.com/cms_ >>>> > >>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>> > Sugar-devel mailing list >>>> > Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org >>>> > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >>>> I've added back in the MEDIUM_ICON_SIZE to the Ring when there are >>>> only a few icons. (See >>>> >>>> http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Spiral_Home_View#Detailed_Description). >>>> Specific uestions for the design team: >>>> >>>> (1) Can we reach consensus re spiraling in from the MAXIMUM radius >>>> once the Ring is full or spiraling out from the MINIMUM radius once >>>> the Ring is full? >>> >>> I would say spiraling in from max radius. That way we can maximize the >>> efficiency of the ring, before transitioning to the spiral. >>> Walter, looking at your mockups I'd try to come up with an algorithm that >>> gives us a looser spiral with more space between each segment of the spiral, >>> more along the lines of what Gary mocked up. The screenshots on the wiki >>> look very dense. Gary's mockup really proved to me that this can work! >> >> >> Hmm. Since Gary's mockup was based on my patch, I wonder what would >> have changed? I did make this spiral tighter than one I originally >> made for the modifying Sugar example. I'll generate some variations to >> look at. >> > > See > http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Spiral_Home_View#Detailed_Description > >>>> >>>> (2) Is is OK to add an INTERMEDIATE icon size between STANDARD and SMALL? >>> >>> I'd even go further and suggest that we could have icons scale dynamically >>> within the ring/spiral, to achieve maximum balance between the available >>> space and icon legibility. >>> My only concern here is that we'd need to find the right balance so as not >>> to interrupt the general zoom metaphor, going from large to small icons >>> (home to neighborhood). This means we probably need to put a cap on the >>> bottom end of the scale, not allowing icons to become too small so that they >>> could reach the size of icons in the groups view... >>> All this will take lots of exploration I think before getting it right. I >>> can work on mockups if that would help... >> >> I'm pretty convinced that smaller than SMALL is not very useful. I >> could add a few more intermediaries, but it is already a reasonably >> fine-grained transition. The question is, when to make the transition. >> Right now I trigger it when the Spiral is full. As per Q3 below, I >> could trigger it a bit sooner. > > See > http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Spiral_Home_View#Detailed_Description > >>> >>>> >>>> (3) In regard to Q1, I could trigger the spiral before the Ring hits >>>> the MAXIMUM radius, perhaps at MAXIMUM-icon_size? (I've not >>>> illustrated this yet.) >>> >>> Yes, I think that probably makes sense. We should play through all the >>> possibilities and then make a decision based on what works best... >>> >> >> I'll mock this up too... > > I tried it and it was problematic in that starting the spiral at > MAXIMUM will result in a gap in the spiral. > >> >> thanks. >> >> -walter >>>> >>>> -walter >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Walter Bender >>>> Sugar Labs >>>> http://www.sugarlabs.org >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> anyth...@christianmarcschmidt.com >>> 917/ 575 0013 >>> >>> http://www.christianmarcschmidt.com >>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/christianmarcschmidt >>> http://twitter.com/cms_ >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Walter Bender >> Sugar Labs >> http://www.sugarlabs.org >> > > Gary: I'm posting the new patch (with a looser spiral and more > intermediaries) to the Ticket. > > -walter > > -- > Walter Bender > Sugar Labs > http://www.sugarlabs.org >
I put a few screen shots of the inside-out spiral in the wiki as well... Personally, while I like the look of these spirals better, I think the transition from the Ring to the outside-in spiral is smoother. http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Spiral_Home_View#Detailed_Description -walter -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org _______________________________________________ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel