I like a lot your letter. But we can use alcohol to produce diesel, if possible, because we have now ready diesel motors ;)
You are right : use of unused material ( grape pits ), the reutlization of waste vegoil and the use of the animoil from animals destroyed. Because of this I have joined to http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bio-oil ( bio-oil = vegoil or oil derivated from animals, animoil ). I will forward your letter there, because it«s interesting for all the researches. All the best. ;) Pedro. ---- Elabore caseramente biodiesel para su actual motor de gasoil petrol’fero La soluci—n a sus problemas energˇticos. http://sitio.de/energia http://journeytoforever.org/energiaweb/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "dhargis1" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <biofuel@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2001 12:46 PM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Vinegar into oil - Oil Sources > I agree that we need to look and keep looking at actual processes to try and > find ways to do things better, to look for lost opportunities. Probably wine > is best used as an already fermented feedstock for ethanol fuel. Don't know > the current price, but relatively decent table wine in Spain used to be > cheaper than bottled water. To my knowledge it is difficult to reverse the > process that causes vinegar. You're probably stuck with it. > > The grape pits are a nice source for oil as it is a byproduct that isn't > used for anything else (that I know of). There should be literally tons of > grape mashings left over from the production of wine. Rather than have them > just go to waste, potentially you have a good source of energy. I don't > think it was very cheap to extract the oil for edible use -- based on the > price that they sold the grape seed oil in the health food store. However, > as someone pointed out, oil extraction could be a lot cheaper if one doesn't > care if the end result is an edible oil. > > There are probably other sources of oil in plants stems and similar that we > just haven't ever thought about. > > I think to that we need to look for things where we benefit twice or more. > The prime example of this is the utilization of waste cooking oil. Here is > something that has been used already and generally has just been discarded. > When we use it a second time in the production of biodiesel, we are gaining > a big benefit. > > In Spain, and Europe in general, (and I fear most of the rest of the world) > the big waste product that should be coming down the line will be the > rendering of all the animals exposed to BSE and FMD. There will be and have > been literally millions upon millions of animals destroyed. This amounts to > a huge source of oil that could be used in the production of biodiesel. > > Regards, > > Derek W. Hargis > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Pedro M." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2001 5:20 AM > Subject: Re: [biofuel] Vinegar into oil > > > > And to be converted into biodiesel ??. > > > > There is a lot of wine production in Spain and the European Union could > help > > to sell this superavit ( excess ). > > > > It could be interesting with the nowadays european union agriculture > > politics. > > > > We need a lot of oil to be used instead of petrol . How much source we > could > > get, cheaper and more accesible it will be : > > > > - Vegoil from any class of grain ( grape, lemon residues - grains - used > in > > another processes ) and vegetable. > > > > - Vegoil from vegetable waste oil. > > > > - Biodiesel from milk ( there is a lot of milk in the European Union - > > superavit know like black milk - ). > > > > There is a problem with the olive oil : the price. And in the future > perhaps > > with the sunflower oil : if there is not enought the price will rise. > > > > So, one can say : convert everything into vegoil or biodiesel. We can > > research or publish the production process and later use it if there is > > political help ( excess of production in the raw material ) to be > > economically interesting ;) > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "dhargis1" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2001 2:34 PM > > Subject: Re: [biofuel] Vinegar into oil > > > > > > > I think the problem with both, ethanol and acetic acid, vinegar, is that > > the > > > carbon chain isn't long enough. There are reactions to combine carbon > > chains > > > and lengthen them, but I don't know if they would be cheap enough to > > compete > > > with what nature does for you in the form of naturally occurring oils. > > > > > > Spain has a lot of other natural oils. They are one of the world's > largest > > > producers of olives, several different nuts, and the last time I > visited, > > > there were huge fields of sunflowers. > > > > > > Derek W. Hargis > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Pedro M." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2001 3:15 PM > > > Subject: Re: [biofuel] Vinegar into oil > > > > > > > > > > What about get oil from vinegar ?? :? ( CH3-COOH ) or similar vinegar > > > bypass > > > > product ???. > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "dhargis1" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2001 1:09 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [biofuel] Alcohol into biodiesel > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a very fine edible oil made from grape pits in Spain. A > very > > > nice > > > > > delicate oil, fabulous for salads, unfortunately, quite expensive. > > > > > > > > > > I am not aware of any economical process to turn ethanol into a > usable > > > > oil. > > > > > > > > > > Derek W. Hargis > > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Pedro M." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2001 2:17 PM > > > > > Subject: Re: [biofuel] Alcohol into biodiesel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But in any way, can one get oil from alcohol or from vineyard ???. > > > > > > > > > > > > This is interesting, because in Spain there is a lot of vineyard > > > > > production > > > > > > ( grapes ) that could be used to produce some class of oil . > > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > Please do NOT send "unsubscribe" messages to the list address. > To unsubscribe, send an email to: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Please do NOT send "unsubscribe" messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
