<x-charset ISO-8859-1>Robert, > > Right. Only an idiot would walk in January in Des Moines to start > > with.
Reckon' that would make idiots of us all who have walked all winter long, years on end, at latitudes further norte than that, eh? Some of my fondest memories are the 10 mile hikes home at day's end, scrambling over mountains of ice strewn over a 50 yard wide frozen river, or walking the forests on crusted snow six feet above ground for 20 or 30 miles on an Arctic night littered with blazing stars. Knew a few "hookers, dope dealers, panhandlers, and plain old freaks that liked to do the same - actually a lot of plain old freaks. Can't say as I've ever had the honor of meeting a "pump" though. ( Just kidding.) Sorry. I discounted the rest of the argument. Seems as if you have it well in hand. Todd Swearingen ----- Original Message ----- From: "robert luis rabello" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <biofuel@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2004 4:20 PM Subject: Re: [biofuel] America has gone super-sized > > > Dave Williams wrote: > > > Right. Only an idiot would walk in January in Des Moines to start > > with. And where would they go, that was within walking distance? Only > > poor people live in town; everyone who can, lives in the suburbs. And > > if you were walking anyway, you'd be fending off the endless supply of > > pumps, hookers, dope dealers, panhandlers, and plain old freaks, and > > you'd look like the Pied Piper with his entourage before you made it > > very far. > > Your statement would be funny if it weren't so frequently used as an > excuse to justify sprawl and the ensuring need to drive long distances to > work, shop and entertain ourselves. Have you actually ever talked to "pimps, > hookers, dope dealers, panhandlers" and "plain old freaks"? What about > "poor people"? What are you afraid of? > > There's an underlying "classism" in your statement that eventually > extends to people in other parts of the world, and it gets ugly in a hurry! > People who ascribe to this attitude believe that somehow they ARE better than > the "pimps, hookers, dope dealers, panhandlers, poor people" and "plain old > freaks" they can easily avoid by moving away or driving two ton steel boxes > through the neighborhoods where such human detritus lives. How convenient! > In international terms, it's just as convenient to drop a few bombs and > overthrow a government or two in order to deal with the "inconvenience" at a > distance. > > > That's right. While those foreigners are trudging through the > > freezeing rain, Americans are riding in their climate-controlled > > environments with their satellite radios, flip-down DVD players, CD > > players, and so forth. Because we built a country and an infrastructure > > that lets even ordinary schmucks live pretty darned good by comparison > > with a lot of other places. > > See what I mean? All of a sudden, we're "better than everybody else". > All of a sudden, we have a "right" to the rest of the world's resources. > We're smarter than they are. Even "ordinary schmucks" live really well, > compared to the rest of the world. (But you failed to include the pimps, > hookers, drug dealers, etc.) There's some truth to that statement, but the > causes of our apparent success are far more complex than I imagine you care > to investigate. > > > > > American agriculture is the most efficient in the world. > > People in this forum will laugh at you for writing such nonsense. Why > don't you show evidence that American agriculture produces more energy in > food than exists in the fossil fuel required to prepare the land, fertilize, > irrigate and harvest the crops? (I won't even go into all the fuel burned to > move the resultant food to your neighborhood grocery store. . .) Compare the > difference to older, more traditional methods and you will be surprised, if > you actually bother doing the math. > > Educate yourself here: > > http://www.journeytoforever.org/farm_library.html > > > > > Period. > > You correctly placed one of those at the end of your last statement. > > > > > It's so efficient, farmers have oversupplied their markets until prices > > have dropped so much many of them are on the verge of going broke, but > > that's another story. > > Take away all of the subsidies necessary to sustain the current practices > and the U.S. farm economy will fall flat on its face. You're wrong about > this--it's all the SAME story. Food is certainly cheap. Food is cheap > because it's subsidized by cheap fuel and tax dollars. Further, for all our > vaunted productivity (most of which goes to feed swine, cattle and poultry) > we are IMPORTING food. Here's what the USDA has to say about it: > > "May 6, 2002 > > The U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA) estimates that imports > represented about 9 percent of > the total quantity of foods consumed in the late 1990s, up from 7.4 > percent in 1995. Despite the fact > that the share of food from imports is relatively low in the United > States (compared with 60 percent > in Japan), the fastest growing U.S. imports include red meats, seafood, > beer and wine. > > The United States imported 2.2 billion pounds of fresh and frozen fish > and seafood in 2000 as well > as 2 billion pounds of beef and veal. In contrast, chicken and turkey > imports were virtually nil. > > U.S. imports of sugar have declined substantially, while > fruit-and-vegetable imports have risen substantially. Fresh-fruit and > -vegetable imports have gained in their share of consumption. Substantial > gains have occurred for processed fruit- and -vegetable products as well." > > If we're so efficient as farmers, why are we importing food? > > Here's an interesting PDF from "The Hartford Insurance": (They are not > exactly a weeping, left wing organization.) > > > http://sb.thehartford.com/reduce_risk/loss_library/Food_Safety/Food%20Proc essing--Ensuring_the_Safety_of_Imported_Food.pdf > > > Food is so cheap, most American families don't > > even bother to budget for it; it's just an incidental expentiture. > > Yeah, lots of Americans are fat. Because we're so rich, we can afford > > to feed out pets better than some countries can feed their own citizenry. > > Do you listen to yourself? Are you normally so arrogant, or is this just > something you put on when you're feeling a little defensive? America is a > great country. Because of that, we can afford to examine ourselves and > address our problems, and obesity is a serious problem. Boasting about how > fat we are solves nothing. We will pay for our overindulgence down the road > in spiraling health care costs and lost productivity. > > > Plain old marketing. You have to remember that the cost of the > > macaroni is probably much less than the cost of the box, shipping, > > labor, and marketing overhead required to get the package on the shelf. > > Finally, you've put your finger on a real issue! We ARE being marketed > to death, literally! > > > > > Our government isn't quite as rapacious as theirs. They should vote > > the bastards out, go conquer someone, and reap the benefits of cheap gas. > > Easily said, as long as the "conquered" don't include people you love. > Didn't I say that this attitude of yours will get ugly? > > > It's a terrible thing to be poor, isn't it? > > > > What would YOU know about it? > > > Public transit? That's where I can take a subway that gets me to work > > half an hour late every day, standing clinging to a pole while a hundred > > people cough germs into my face? Or is that the bus, where I try to > > find a seat nobody has urinated in? And either are so far from where I > > live, that I have to fire up the car and drive to the station? > > There you go again! Have you actually sat in a seat that someone has > urinated on? (Ok, aside from the toilet!) What are you afraid of? > > > > robert luis rabello > "The Edge of Justice" > Adventure for Your Mind > http://www.1stbooks.com/bookview/9782 > > > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > Biofuels list archives: > http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ > > Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. > To unsubscribe, send an email to: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! 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