Keith, thank you for the helpful info. Jonathan. --- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Keith Addison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello Jonathan > > >After reading these 2 posts about bashing biodiesel, my mind came > >across some questions that I could not find answers to in the > >archives. George Morrison points out that in every sample of > >biodiesel there is 350-800 ppm of water and anything above 100ppm, > >there is a problem with water dropout in the fuel. Reading some of > >Girl Mark's comments on jtf, she states that there is anywhere from > >1200-1500 ppm of water that biodiesel absorbs from the atmosphere. > > It was Camillo Holecek of Energia who said that. Here's what he said: > > >Comment on "various national biodiesel standards set rather low > >tolerances for water content": > > > >The Austrian Standard ONORM C 1191 said only: "No water should settle > >out" > >(i.e. about 1200ppm water would stay in solution in our FAME.) > > > >All others bother about 500 and even 300 ppm (DIN), which is nonsense > >IMO, as FAME is hygroscopic and will attrack humidity from air until it > >is back to 1200ppm. Means, in your car you will have anything but > >300ppm. > > > >Anyway, our new plant in Zistersdorf, Austria, had 54 ppm in the last > >analysis..... :-) > > > >Camillo Holecek > > > >Energea Umwelttechnologie GmbH, > >Biodiesel Raffinerie GmbH, > >DonauWind GmbH&Co KG > > ... which I quoted a few times in connection with the work being done > with water injection and water-fuel emulsions to reduce emissions, > and I think Mark got it from that. > > What did George Morrison say about a problem with water dropout above > 100ppm? Drop out where? No problem if it's in the combustion chamber, > seems to me. Got a reference for that? > I am embarrassed to say that I don't know how to post links the way you do in the text of the messages. However, I wrote it down. It can be found in message #37363. The link is http://forum.thedieselpage.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php? ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=007240.
> Some previous discussion at the Biofuels-biz list: > > >Re water in biodiesel, water emulsions, and ethanol-biodiesel blends, > >ethanol-biodiesel-water blends, all much discussed here and at the > >Biofuel list, I suggest an archives search. See this, for instance: > >http://archive.nnytech.net/index.php?view=835&list=BIOFUELS-BIZ > > > >http://archive.nnytech.net/index.php?view=835&list=BIOFUELS-BIZ > > > >A lot of people have an instant overreaction when they hear stuff > >like this - water in the fuel! AAARGHH! Free water in petro-diesel is > >of course bad news; a fuel-water emulsion is a different matter, as > >also with water-biodiesel blends. If it's dissolved in the fuel it > >will harm nothing, and there seem to be big advantages. > > > > >"Following is a list of studies that are being considered for > > >inclusion in work being done by EPA to assess the effects of > > >water-fuel emulsions on emissions of oxides of nitrogen (NOx), > > >hydrocarbons (HC), and particulate matter (PM)." > > >http://www.epa.gov/otaq/models/analysis/emulsion/emulbibl.pdf > > I wish we could get to the bottom of all this at last. > > >She also said that she has been experimenting with bubbling the bio > >to see if any more water comes off. > > But then she said it oxidises the fuel, leaving some of us puzzled as > to why bubble-drying would oxidise it but bubble-washing not (it > does). > > More about that here: > > http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/34769/ > > http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/36779/ > > Best wishes > > Keith > > >I haven't been commenting a lot, > >because I have been busy just reading, learning and more reading. I > >tend to listen more than I talk. Anyways, I know that ppm is a small > >figure, but can these amounts be detrimental to engines over time, or > >is the water content just harmlessly burned along with the fuel? I > >have been still working on my processor and have all the components, > >and now between work and family have to find the time to put it > >together. Any and all comments are welcome and as always...thanks. > >Jonathan. > > > >--- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Keith Addison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Hello Ryan > > > > > > Comments below. > > > > > > >I've just had this thread brought to my attention on > > > >thedieselpage.com. There looks to be a lot of people over there > > > >bashing biodiesel as holding too much water and potentially > > > >destroying the high pressure injection systems on the Chevrolet > > > >duramax diesel. > > > > > > > >They are being especially harsh on homebrew and on fuel made from > > <snip> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
