Hi Robert >Keith Addison wrote: > ><snip> > >>When asked if he would say the same in Israel today, >>Obama said, "I think that's a basic principle of any country is that >>they've got to protect their citizens." (Obama: Gitmo Likely Won't > >Close in First 100 Days ABC News) > > There we go! So much for change!
Sure, change-as-usual, a full 360 degrees. :-) But then change isn't a spectator sport, it's a DIY project. > >Israel has been sharply criticized for its disproportionate use of > >force in Gaza. But there are some Israeli fanatics who believe that > >Israel should use even greater force--widespread lethal force. > > Yes, I've heard this from the allegedly "Messianic Christians" who >believe that any form of peace will result in the destruction of >Israel. There is no arguing with people who have such a mind set. It's not worth bothering with them, it's a waste of time. Never mind what wonderful folks they might be really, in effect they're somewhere between stupid and unhinged, or both. Do these people and their opinions matter? I think they're not yet to be regarded as a spent force, but they're getting that way. Meanwhile... "Wipe Them All Out" Bomb A Ghetto - Raise A Cheer Must Watch 6 Minute Video Interview With Pro Israel Demonstrators New York January 11, 2009. <http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article21746.htm> Hill of Shame where Gaza bombing is spectator sport - A beauty spot has turned into a vantage point for viewing of Israel's bombardment of the Gaza Strip, The Times, January 13, 2009 <http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article5505390.ece> >In >their view, modern, secular Israel is the fulfillment of OT prophecy, >and therefore, all of the promises made with respect to God protecting >his people are projected onto that nation. The logic of this from a >Christian point of view is baffling. Or from any point of view. >I personally see Jesus Christ as >the fulfillment of the OT prophecy and scratch my head that a regime so >intent on brutalizing its neighbors can be remotely associated with Christ. > > "Can a corrupt throne be allied with you > one that brings on misery with its decrees?" > > I've brought this rhetorical question up before, and the answer >remains the same . . . > > Is there a way out of this that doesn't involve mushroom clouds? I >hope so, but I don't see it! Same answer IMHO as Chomsky's answer to the other question: "It's up to you." > >"No moral prohibition against the indiscriminate killing of civilians"?!? >> > >Isn't this the definition of terrorism? > > But if these folk see the civilians AS terrorists, they justify >brutality as "the only thing those people understand." I've heard this >so many times it makes me ill . . . It's the same old line that gets applied every time, not just by Israelis to Palestinians. > The same argument can be made for firing rockets into Israel. I don't think so. If you steal and occupy people's land, evict them ("Leave or die!"), deny them all rights, brutalise them, cram them into ghettoes, blockade them, starve them, then maybe you shouldn't be so picky about the kind of resistance they still manage to come up with. Also, Hamas kept to the ceasefire, Israel broke it, twice. You can't apply "the same argument" to Hamas's crude and remarkably undeadly backyard rockets as to Israel's multi-billion-dollar US-supplied high-tech military blitzkrieg. >It's >clear that both sides are using violence as a justification for further >violence. I don't agree with that either. Did you read the whole of Mike Whitney's article? Did you read what Meshaal said? That's been fairly consistent. Check it out. >This is a very difficult issue! What makes it all the more difficult is that those with the power refuse to acknowledge the basic truths of the situation, which goes back more than 60 years, to Nakba, and beyond. What It Was Like Being Forced to Leave Palestine 60 Years Ago By Suzanne Manneh, New America Media January 13, 2009 <http://www.alternet.org/story/119369/> Occupation 101 Award-winning documentary film on the root causes of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. <http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article21734.htm> And so on. Did you check the links Bob provided? > >One Israeli settler leader recently argued during a conversation with >>a visiting American peace activist that 'if it was right to commit > >genocide during Biblical time, why can't it be right to commit >>genocide now. Has God changed his mind,' the settler wondered > >sarcastically." > > God permitted the "genocide" of those days because the people lacked >faith to let him handle the situation differently. Their hearts were >hard set to conquer by their own strength, and as a result, the ancient >Hebrews lost their own sons in battle. God had told Moses: "I will send >my angel ahead of you," and also: "I will drive out the Canaanites with >hornets, but slowly, so the land will not become wild." That's in the >plain text of the scriptures, so I don't buy the argument that God is >somehow pleased with the slaughtering of civilians. > >>Israeli peace activist and author Uri Avnery has an expression for >>this type of thinking. He calls it "moral insanity", a sociopathic >>disorder. > >Well said, Uri. > > Indeed! One can justify all manner of madness in an effort to >sanitize the moral failings of human behavior. Or rather of inhuman behaviour, don't you mean? Unless you'd say sociopathic disorder is the human norm, which obviously it's not. All best Keith >robert luis rabello >"The Edge of Justice" >"The Long Journey" >New Adventure for Your Mind >http://www.newadventure.ca > >Ranger Supercharger Project Page >http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/ _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing list [email protected] http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/
