On Sat, 12/27/08, George Franz wrote: As long as a law steers clear of any violation of the Constitution or its amendments there is little to be done.
**************** During the St. Pat's Four trial in Binghamton Federal Court, Clare Grady asked, "Are we here to serve the law or is the law here to serve us?" Gov't regulations are not constructed in an ideological or political vacuum. And regulators don't operate in an ego-neutral zone, where the public good is served above self-interest and power lust. To the contrary, it seems the power of the state is often applied in a punitive rather than protective manner. Attempting to infiltrate, entrap and raid a food cooperative as though it were a drug ring and confiscating a family's personal supply of food at gunpoint is clearly an abuse of power. There had to have been a better way to settle this dispute. But after years of violently storming homes overseas and sending women and children cowering into corners, perhaps we've become immune to these tactics? Unfortunately in recent decades, "the people" have been extremely passive as corporate interests author laws and fill regulatory posts with cronies at the expense of individual freedoms and small-scale enterprises. As cases like the Stowers food coop and Meadowsweet Dairy LLC illustrate, where neighbors look for cooperative and innovative alternatives in this transitional time, we will find ourselves increasingly at odds with the law and crippled by regulations designed for a society that does not serve the public good in the long or short term. The NAIS program is another example of gov't overreach that disproportionately burdens small farmers while providing a steady income for chip manufacturers and their colleagues who occupy Ag dept regulatory seats. Myself, I think there is much to be done to update laws to protect the public interest: change 'em. Supporting those who challenge unfair or nonsensical regulations is a place to start. -- Katie Q-J Thanks for the tips on the two books, Jon and George. George Frantz wrote: > On Sat, 12/27/08, Jon Bosak <[email protected]> wrote: > > The natural rights argument is an interesting one. Many years ago I read a > great book called The Forgotten Ninth Amendment that goes into this in detail. > > **************** > Jon, > > Another book worth that may be reading would be "The Amish and the State." It > lays out a half-century of conflict between the Amish and federal, state and > local governments over the power of the government to regulate, versus First > Amendment fredom of religion rights. Although they have the First Amendment > on their side it has still been an almost continuous struggle for them to > live their lives as their religious beliefs dictate. > > They have not made the headlines or the history books, but a lot of their > experiences are actually similar to those of the Buckeye Institute and other > such groups today, including police raids, confiscation of property and jail > time for Amish resisters. > > I think the core issues here are the concept of "police power" and the > definition of "public health safety and welfare." The Constitution still > grants government very broad authority in exercising its police powers to > create and enforce laws that are intended to protect the public health, > safety and welfare. > > This is the basis of just about every regulation we know, from air pollution > control automobile CAFE mileage requirements to wetland protection to local > zoning and building codes to seatbelt laws. You name the law, and somewhere > you will find a tie to the public health, safety and welfare. > > As long as a law steers clear of any violation of the Constitution or its > amendments there is little to be done. > > The Ninth Amendment may not give us much support in the face of the "police > powers" and the "public health, safety and welfare" arguments. We do have a > lot of natural rights, however growing what you want (e.g. cannabis, etc., > etc., ) and distributing it as you like (e.g. to the general public) have to > date not been recognized by the Supreme Court. > > The concept of government as regulator, particularly in the United States, is > pretty much an invention of the 20th Century. It really took off in the > 1960s and 1970s as a result of the Civil Rights, the awakening of > environmental consciousness and consumer protection movements, to name a few. > Unfortunately regulations invariably turn out to be a double edge sword. > > The challenge is to figure out where to stop the regulation and how. > > George Frantz > > > --- > From: Jon Bosak <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [SustainableTompkins] Raid on Organic Food Coop > To: "Sustainable Tompkins County listserv" > <[email protected]> > Date: Saturday, December 27, 2008, 2:03 PM > > [From the article:] > > | The Buckeye Institute argues the right to buy food directly from > | local farmers, distribute locally grown food to neighbors, and > | pool resources to purchase food in bulk are rights that do not > | require a license. > > I see now that a recent reprint is available > on Amazon, but at 70 bucks for just over 200 pages, I'd recommend > looking around for a library copy. > > The ninth amendment (part of the Bill of Rights) consists of just > one sentence: > > "The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not > be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people." > > There's been a lot of argument over what this means; you can find > out more than you want to know by googling "ninth amendment." But > it's always seemed to me that if there are any natural rights, > then growing what you want and distributing it as you like must be > among them. > > Jon > > > _______________________________________________ > For more information about sustainability in the Tompkins County area, please > visit: http://www.sustainabletompkins.org/ > > RSS, archives, subscription & listserv information for: > [email protected] > http://lists.mutualaid.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainabletompkins > Questions about the list? ask [email protected] > free hosting by http://www.mutualaid.org > > > > > _______________________________________________ > For more information about sustainability in the Tompkins County area, please > visit: http://www.sustainabletompkins.org/ > > RSS, archives, subscription & listserv information for: > [email protected] > http://lists.mutualaid.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainabletompkins > Questions about the list? ask [email protected] > free hosting by http://www.mutualaid.org > > -- _______________________________________________ For more information about sustainability in the Tompkins County area, please visit: http://www.sustainabletompkins.org/ RSS, archives, subscription & listserv information for: [email protected] http://lists.mutualaid.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainabletompkins Questions about the list? ask [email protected] free hosting by http://www.mutualaid.org
