I tend not to think too much about the "amenity" key, to me amenity=shelter + shelter_type=rock_shelter is very clear this is a non-man made, natural feature.
A rock overhang is used as a form of shelter and the type of shelter is made clear by shelter_type. The wiki is very clear in this regard how these rock overhangs should be tagged. https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/search?q=shelter_type%3Drock_shelter has almost 500 instances so it's well established now. Given this current usage in OSM, I'm in favour of not inventing a new tag for this, and aligning with what's already documented and established. On Mon, 1 Apr 2019 at 09:09, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote: > I object. > amenity=shelter I see as a man made object, some with better shelter than > others. > I think these should remain in the 'natural key space, possibly > natural=overhang? > > But then what do I know??? > > amenity=shelter has > shelter_type <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:shelter_type>= > rock_shelter - A rock shelter is a shallow cave-like opening at the base > of a bluff or cliff > > and that looks to fit perfectly! > > I'd not tag them as camp sites, let people evaluate them and the surrounds > themselves for camping rather than suggest a place. > > > On 01/04/19 08:39, Andrew Harvey wrote: > > > when (how deep) does a rock overhang / shelter become an actual cave? :-) > Some judgement is needed, but the ones I've seen are pretty clear cut as > being one or the other. > > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:amenity%3Dshelter just says "A > shelter <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shelter_%28building%29> is small > place to protect against bad weather conditions." which is mostly what > these overhangs are used for, so I think it's the appropriate tag. If that > shelter is frequently used as a camp site (now, not just historically) then > can be tagged tourism=camp_site with a few extra tags from > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:tourism=camp_site to help > distinguish this small camp site from the larger ones. > > Is "not meant for sleeping, no cooking or heating equipement inside" > supposed to be a criteria for a shelter? > > I would say no. We should tag the rock overhang for what it is, and use > tourism=camp_site to say if it's commonly used for sleeping too. > > > On Mon, 1 Apr 2019 at 08:07, Graeme Fitzpatrick <graemefi...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> >> >> On Sun, 31 Mar 2019 at 18:14, Andrew Harvey <andrew.harv...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> Rock overhangs (rock shelters) have been quite extensively mistagged in >>> Australia as natural=cave_entrance. >>> >>> Are there any objections to re-tagging these overhangs tagged as >>> natural=cave_entrance to amenity=shelter + shelter_type=rock_shelter? >>> >> >> No real objection, Andrew, but when (how deep) does a rock overhang / >> shelter become an actual cave? :-) >> >> Also noticed in the discussion comments on >> >>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:shelter_type >>> >> >> "Can you look if this could be tagged as a shelter ? >> http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Champlitte,_%C3%A9craigne.jpg >> Tounoki >> <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=User:Tounoki&action=edit&redlink=1> >> (talk >> <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Tounoki&action=edit&redlink=1>) >> 14:16, 21 April 2013 (UTC) >> If it is open to the public, not meant for sleeping, no cooking or >> heating equipement inside, then yes, you could use amenity >> <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:amenity>=shelter >> <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:amenity%3Dshelter> +shelter >> <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:shelter>=weather_shelter >> <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:shelter%3Dweather_shelter&action=edit&redlink=1> >> " >> Is "not meant for sleeping, no cooking or heating equipement inside" >> supposed to be a criteria for a shelter? >> >> Some of the overhangs I've seen are pitch black underneath from many >> thousands of years of cooking fires, & are acknowledged as places that >> Aboriginal peoples camped during bad weather - does that mean they're not >> shelters? (although I don't know what else they would then be?) >> >> Thanks >> >> Graeme >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Talk-au mailing > listTalk-au@openstreetmap.orghttps://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au > > > _______________________________________________ > Talk-au mailing list > Talk-au@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au >
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