I agree, I depend on WE every day and I can't afford JAWS. It's been
9 months since the acquisition of AISquared and not one word from VFO
about WE.They are not being honest with all the WE users by being
silent. I will continue to use WE as long as Windows doesn't change
where it will no longer work.
----- Original Message -----
From: Rod Hutton via Talk
To: Vaughan Dodd ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Sent: Saturday, April 1, 2017 7:58 AM
Subject: RE: orbit20 display and future of window eyes
Hi Vaughan,
I believe it is a matter of semantics.
The phrase "not a going concern," to me, implies it is not relevant
in my life on a daily basis.
For me, this is not true, since I use it every day.
Personally, I find this type of language discouraging since I, and
many others on this this, depend on this screen reader for our
livelihood and are continuing to use it.
In addition, and, again, personally, I find this discussion tiresome
and annoying.
This is just my feeling.
Respectfully,
Rod
-----Original Message-----
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail....@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Vaughan Dodd via Talk
Sent: Saturday, April 1, 2017 4:02 AM
To: Dennis Long <dennisl1...@gmail.com>; Window-Eyes Discussion List
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Subject: Re: orbit20 display and future of window eyes
I think it will still be an option - but some of you are missing the
point: it is no longer a practical option for many people.
The evidence does not support on-going development.
Evidence includes: bugs not fixed
Loss of personnel who interacted with the users via this list and
through other channels.
The Fort Wayne office is not part of the VFO addresses for its offices.
No news on the VFO site.
The disestablishemngt of Zoomtext Fusion, in favour of a JFW interface.
This list is not monitored by VFO. It VFO was paying attentiont it,
some of the claims made by people like me would be challenged.
So: no one is saying stop using your copy of Window-Eyes. All we are
saying is that it is no longer a going concern.
Vaughan.
On 4/1/2017 8:52 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
> I agree I am of the same thought process until an announcement
from someone
> at VFO says there will be no more window eyes I will continue to
think it's
> a option.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail....@lists.window-eyes.com]
> On Behalf Of Jim via Talk
> Sent: Friday, March 31, 2017 8:38 PM
> To: Don H; Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Subject: Re: orbit20 display and future of window eyes
>
> Hi there!
>
> Question, what is the source of your information about W.E. going
away?
> I have seen nothing official from anyone regarding this issue and
until I
> do, I will continue to believe that W.E. is ALIVE and KICKING! I
am getting
> rather tire of seeing this same old topic being brought up over
and over. I
> do not wish to start any sort of heated debate on this subject I
just want
> to see where all this so called information is actually coming
from..? Have
> A Great Day! de
>
> <JF8LT><Jim>.
>
>
> On 31-Mar-17 11:12, Don H via Talk wrote:
>> If you think Window Eyes isn't going away I also have a nice
bridge to
>> sell you. It is called the Golden Gate and I will sell it real
cheap.
>>
>> On 3/31/2017 12:59 AM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
>>> We don't know WE is going away.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Talk
>>> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail....@lists.window-eyes.com]
>>> On Behalf Of Brenda via Talk
>>> Sent: Thursday, March 30, 2017 1:26 PM
>>> To: Sky Mundell; Window-Eyes Discussion List
>>> Subject: Re: orbit20 display and future of window eyes
>>>
>>> Hi Sky and List
>>>
>>>
>>> I think it is beyond the point of saving Window-Eyes.
>>>
>>>
>>> I think what folks on this list need to do now is to contact VFO
and
>>> push for a reasonable price to transition from Window-Eyes to jaws.
>>> The number of SMAs should be considered so perhaps those with SMAs
>>> would be given jaws SMAs or the money paid toward their SMAs
would be
>>> put toward the cost of jaws. Everyone should be given the
convention
>>> price for jaws.
>>>
>>>
>>> Just a thought,
>>>
>>> Brenda
>>>
>>>
>>> On 3/30/2017 12:38 PM, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote:
>>>> Hello Kevin and Vaughn. Here are my thoughts on this. Had the
blind
>>>> organisations had given Window-Eyes a chance, Window-Eyes would
not
>>>> have gotten extinct and this would not have happened. Below, I'm
>>>> going to forward you guys some emails from a friend of mine who is
>>>> on this list, and I support him 100 percent!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Email 1:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Sky,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sadly that has been the way it has been since the start. As you
>>>> said, had the rnib, cnib, american league for th blind and so on
>>>> favoured window-eyes or even given it a chance. It would not be
>>>> almost extinct at this moment in time. It does make me angry.
These
>>>> people are somehow escaping accountability for their acdtions. The
>>>> entire system has been geared towards Jaws continually. Every
other
>>>> screen reader has become second rate because of the power wielded
>>>> withing the blind community. It's alright us saying this but
>>>> actually proving it is another matter. If it could be proved and
>>>> despite all the negativity, it could. Then what could happen?
>>>> Telling the world about how a ruthless power hungry
organisation set
>>>> out to control the world of the blind with a screen reader? If
>>>> people would back us up and not just say that is what happened
>>>> without saying I can prove it. To be able to prove it would be the
>>>> icing on the cake. It would show the rotten, evil people at
jaws who
>>>> abused their power and in a way forced vendors to favour jaws
above
>>>> other screen readers. If enough people were prepared to come
out and
>>>> back us up we would have enough to at least make
>>> those responcible for the blind to wake up and accept
responcibility.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I doubt that will ever happen as proving what we know to be true
>>>> would be difficult. Not impossible. We do have what is called a
>>>> Mergers and nonopoly commission but it too is being seen as a
dog with
> no teeth.
>>>> Although it blocked a merger a few days ago between the two major
>>>> money markets, one in London and the other in @Germany from
combining.
>>>> They have some power but it is only token gesture.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> There is a proposed merger between Rupert Murdoch and Sky tv. He
>>>> will be allowed to buy it despite criticism from other media
>>>> cdompanies. He owns the majority of the world's media and his
>>>> control is beyond anything that the world has seen before. There
>>>> isn't much he doesn't own and his political power is immeanse.
That
>>>> is the exact same as jaws, the rnib, cnib and other
organisations for
> the blind.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> If it could be possible for witnesses to come forward and confirm
>>>> what we are saying. That would be at least a start. We could
get up
>>>> a petition expressing our opinion of the bullying from these so
>>>> called institutions for the blind. bringing them to account. It
may
>>>> not do very much but at least it would rock the boat for a short
>>>> time and always be part of the history of blind peoples lives in a
>>>> corrupt and
>>> overbearing system.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Email 2:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> From: bj colt [mailto:bjc...@blueyonder.co.uk]
>>>> Sent: Friday, March 24, 2017 6:34 AM
>>>> To: Sky Mundell
>>>> Subject: Re: window eyes proposal
>>>>
>>>> Hi Sky,
>>>>
>>>> I listened to the podcast from scun. I am not only disgusted but
>>>> really pissed off at VFO and with the presenters at the tech
podcast.
>>>> ~Why aren't they kicking up hell? Probably because they are jaws
>>>> users. I got that impression just by their attitude. Zoom text and
>>>> fusion was an AI squared and window-eyes conception. Not a VFO
idea.
>>>> I did say that's why they bought out ai squared and it seems I was
>>>> right. They are going to unceremoniously dump window-eyes. No new
>>>> updadtes, no upgrades, nothing, no development. The list really
has
>>>> to do something at this stage. We really have to get together and
>>>> make sure VFO are aware of our feelings. Everyone who has paid for
>>>> sma's are now entitled to a full refund, no questions asked. No
>>>> development means no upgrades, no upgrades equals no need for
sma's.
>>>> No sma's means
>>> they are stealing our money under false pretences.
>>>> This time things have gone too far. Something has to be done,
>>>> whether it is a petition, legal action to force VFO to state their
> position.
>>> Something.
>>>> All the conjecture on the list has to stop and positive action
taken
>>>> by those who wish to keep window-eyes alive. What was stated in
that
>>>> podcast, whether it is the opinions or not of the people who are
>>>> making the statements. It was made so clear, "No development of
>>>> window-eyes will continue". Only those areas where profit is to be
>>>> made
>>> will be supported.
>>>> That was made abundantly clear. That wasn't just an opinion, it
was
>>>> a matter of fact.
>>>>
>>>> Live long and prosper, John
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi Sky,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, they said that the free copy of window-eyes with Office was a
>>>> demo, that it wasn't a full version, it only lasted 6 months, it
>>>> only lasted a month. Those were regular lies told by vendors. The
>>>> vendors favoured Jaws because it brought them more profit. In that
>>>> the Big blind organisations reckomended jaws above other screen
>>>> readers. When those in Education, employment and other fields
>>>> contacted the rnib etc with questions about screen readers.
What did
>>>> they get? They got jaws and nothing else. No reckomendations for
>>>> window-eyes, nothing, only jaws was offered. It happened iwth
me. I lost
> a job because of it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Think about it? Jaws screen reader was always reckomended,
followed
>>>> by extensive training in jaws at a higher cost, scripts that were
>>>> designed by jaws script writers at a consierable cost. Sky that
was
>>>> the entire package that was reckomended. The cost of
everything, the
>>>> dam high cost of everything.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> From: bj colt [mailto:bjc...@blueyonder.co.uk]
>>>> Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2016 10:51 AM
>>>> To: Sky Mundell
>>>> Subject: Re: Window-Eyes Proposal
>>>>
>>>> Hi Sky,
>>>>
>>>> Members of the list have stated that and more. No one was
willing to
>>>> fight gw's corner. Jaws had too much a grip in institutions,
that's
>>>> one
>>> reason.
>>>> The actual proof was so well hidden it could not be proved
>>>> conclusivly. Yet it was widely known. As in the post about FS
seuing
>>>> institutions if they didn't approve of jaws over any other screen
>>>> reader. In hindsight, had we known that window-eyes would be
put in
>>>> jeapordy we would have done something. None of us knew this may
>>>> happen and that's another reason we didn't do anything about the
> situation.
>>>> Sadly it looks as if it is all over for window-eyes. I noticed the
>>>> post saying the person contacted aisquared and confirmed that s m
>>>> a's were and would be available in the future.
>>>> Yet he wasn't willing to actualy prove that was the case. He
didn't
>>>> post an email or confirmation from asquared that this was the
case.
>>>> I would have liked to have been given proof of this. My proof
is in
>>>> the email posted to the group by asquared, where no mention of s m
>>>> a's are
>>> made.
>>>> There isn't much time left for VFO to make an official statement
>>>> about the future of window-eyes. Then we will know for certain.
>>>>
>>>> Robert would be livid. He would be doing anything to keep
>>>> window-eyes
>>> alive.
>>>> The same as we will be doing. He will be proud of us when the time
>>>> comes.
>>>>
>>>> Live long and prosper, John
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> These are my thoughts as well. These emails should get us
springing
>>>> into action to keep Window-Eyes going. Lets all keep it alive and
>>>> get this truth exposed and get Window-Eyes to the top in
>>>> organisations for the
>>> blind.
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com]
>>>> On Behalf Of Kevin Huber via Talk
>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 30, 2017 6:50 AM
>>>> To: Vaughan Dodd; Window-Eyes Discussion List
>>>> Subject: Re: orbit20 display and future of window eyes
>>>>
>>>> Hi Vaughan:
>>>>
>>>> Mostly, I see your point and I would aggree, accept that, if VFO
>>>> works out a contract with Microsoft which will allow them to
create
>>>> a JAWS For Office, presumably Window-eyes, and therefore
Window-eyes
>>>> for office, will be dead so there will only be two free screen
readerws.
>>>> Also, if WGW Micro created Window-eyes for Office to prevent
people
>>>> from switching to NVDA, wouldn't that reasoning apply to
creating a
>>>> JAWS For Office? Not to say that they will because I highly doubt
>>>> that that will happen, but maybe it remains a possibility.
>>>> Kevin Huber and
>>>>
>>>> On 3/29/17, Vaughan Dodd via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
wrote:
>>>>> I think you'll find that VFO will not do this.
>>>>>
>>>>> Microsoft funded this, under a contractual basis.
>>>>> The contract supporting the Window-Eyes with Office scheme
will
>>>>> most certainly come to an end.
>>>>> The financial backers of VFO are funding the continued
development
>>>>> of JFW, and they will expect a return on their investment.
>>>>>
>>>>> The Window-Eyes for Office deal was a response to the increasing
>>>>> user support for NVDA. The dramatic reduction in the addition of
>>>>> new features and bug fixes for Window-Eyes is due in part to the
>>>>> deal, and people choosing not to purchase Window-Eyes because
they
>>>>> had access to two free screen readers.
>>>>>
>>>>> There is no way that there can be three free screenreaders.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Think about it: once a JFW for Office deal is struck with
>>>>> Microsoft, there will be clauses - such as - "cannot continue to
>>>>> develop interfaces for products from software competitors" and so
> forth.
>>>>> Regarding the Orbit thing: emulation of an 18 cell display means
>>>>> you lose 10% of the available realestate. Because the
objective of
>>>>> the Orbit
>>>> project
>>>>> is sound - electronic braille to more people - there will be a
JFW
>>>>> driver soon. That driver will probably need to be developed
by the
>>>>> Orbit consortium, rather than VFO. VFO won't throw in a free non
>>>>> VFO braille display when you buy JFW. It will develop deals for
>>>>> discounting its own displays. This is partly why Optelec are
part
>>>>> of the
>>> group.
>>>>>
>>>>> Vaughan.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Vaughan.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Talk
>>>>>
[mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt.nz@lists.window-eyes.
>>>>> co m] On Behalf Of Joshua Kennedy via Talk
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, 30 March 2017 11:07 a.m.
>>>>> To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
>>>>> Subject: orbit20 display and future of window eyes
>>>>>
>>>>> and so this is why the vfo group has to just fold window eyes
into
>>>>> jaws or just give us a free jaws for office option. because for
>>>>> some people NVDA does not cut it, and we need something more
>>>>> powerful, yet that is low cost or free. a jaws for office would
>>>>> work fine especially if you need to do stuff in microsoft office.
>>>>> not to mention jaws works good with the orbit
>>>>> reader20 prototype set to refreshabraille18 emulation.
>>>>> window eyes does not work with orbit20 at all. come on vfo group
>>>>> let us
>>>> use
>>>>> jaws for free if microsoft office is installed on our machines!
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of
>>>>> the
>>>> author
>>>>> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vaughan.
>>>> dodd00
>>>> 1%40msd.govt.nz.
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>>>>> This email and any attachments may contain information that is
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>>>>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of
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>>>>> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
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>>>> _______________________________________________
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