A even crazier area regarding the abuse of the cliff tag ! https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=15/50.9610/14.0724 <https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=15/50.9610/14.0724>
Vladimir. > Le 11 sept. 2019 à 15:27, Vladimir Vyskocil <vladimir.vysko...@gmail.com> a > écrit : > > Hello Sarah, > > I read carefully your response and looked at the picture. I didn't travelled > exactly at this place but will go there in October ! However I've already > been in Český ráj > <http://www.cesky-raj.info/en/contacts/bohemian-paradise-association/> that > is not too far from there and where the terrain is similar in many aspects. > I still think that the usage of the tag is abused in this area… > You may read the description of this tag here : > > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:natural%3Dcliff > <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:natural=cliff> > > « A cliff <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/en:cliff> is a vertical or almost > vertical natural drop in terrain topography as it occurs for example in form > of coastal cliffs or escarpments. The face of the cliff usually consists of > bare solid rock but can occasionally also consist of clay, compacted sand, > ice or other solid materials.» > > > « > When not to use > natural <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:natural>=cliff <> should not > be used for ridges, i.e. crests where there is a significant drop in terrain > to both sides and neither of them is close to vertical. Use natural > <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:natural>=ridge > <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:natural%3Dridge> or natural > <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:natural>=arete > <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:natural%3Darete> instead. Also do > not use natural <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:natural>=cliff <> > just for mapping an inclined bare rock surface, use natural > <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:natural>=bare_rock > <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:natural%3Dbare_rock> instead. > > " > > This is not what I see when I look at this mapped area, I agree that some > mapped cliffs here are really what should be considered a cliff but they are > lost in lots of wrongly mapped and not relevant ones. > > You might look at this as a example in many many more : > > https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=19/50.89893/14.28319 > <https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=19/50.89893/14.28319> > > We are seeing it at level 19 and the density of cliffs is still crazy ! > > Or here : https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=15/50.8791/14.3647 > <https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=15/50.8791/14.3647> > > Could you tell me that all theses mapped cliffs really exists ? Or aren’t > they just « a significant drop in terrain and neither of them are close to > vertical » mapped as cliffs only looking at terrain model and that are > completely disconnected from the reality of the terrain ? > > Regards, > Vladimir > > > >> Le 11 sept. 2019 à 00:17, Sarah Hoffmann <lon...@denofr.de >> <mailto:lon...@denofr.de>> a écrit : >> >> Hi, >> >> On Fri, Sep 06, 2019 at 02:42:06PM +0200, Vladimir Vyskocil wrote: >>> Around this area : https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/50.9034/14.2763 >>> <https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/50.9034/14.2763> >>> <https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/50.9034/14.2763 >>> <https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/50.9034/14.2763>> there is a >>> flagrant misuse and abuse of the usage of the natural=cliff tag. It is used >>> to map the iso altitude lines and not real cliff as stated in the WIKI : >>> >>> A cliff <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/en:cliff >>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/en:cliff>> is a vertical or almost vertical >>> natural drop in terrain topography as it occurs for example in form of >>> coastal cliffs or escarpments. The face of the cliff usually consists of >>> bare solid rock but can occasionally also consist of clay, compacted sand, >>> ice or other solid materials. >> >> I know that area very well and I can assure you, that natural=cliff is no >> misuse >> under this definition. The area is full of rock towers like those: >> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:20171124195DR_Lohmen_Basteiaussicht_zum_Sieberturm.jpg >> >> <https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:20171124195DR_Lohmen_Basteiaussicht_zum_Sieberturm.jpg> >> >> That's what you see on the map. >> >>> I already removed the natural=cliff ways mapped by MichaOSM after asking >>> him to fix this but without response the changeset comment was : >>> >>> "Felsen, Riffe, Topografie nach GeoSachsen digitale >>> Geländemodellhoehenlinien 2.5m, digitales Geländereliefmodell, DTK10, >>> topografische Karte” >>> >>> For example this changeset : >>> https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/66373825#map=15/50.9016/14.3093 >>> <https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/66373825#map=15/50.9016/14.3093> >>> >>> It say that it used a 2.5m topographic map to map all these false cliffs in >>> this area, he was mapping the topography (MNT) and this is forbidden in OSM. >> >> You missunderstood, he was mapping rock edges. A terrain model is more >> helpful >> for that task than arial imagery. We have permission to use the terrain model >> for OSM as far as I know. >> >> I would kindly request that you reinstate deleted natural=cliffs for >> the moment. If you are still not convinced from the photo above that the >> tagging is correct then we need to have a fundamental discussion first about >> how to tag these kind of rock towers. But that would rather be something for >> the tagging mailing list (or talk-de if you want to get the locals involved). >> >> Sarah >
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