texascavers Digest 16 Mar 2011 07:23:42 -0000 Issue 1266
Topics (messages 17355 through 17377):
Xterra for Sale
17355 by: Aimee Beveridge
OT - map of nuclear plant location
17356 by: David
17359 by: Brian Riordan
off topic --- UT surplus auction in Austin
17357 by: Jim Kennedy
Blair Pittman Update Tue AM
17358 by: dirtdoc.comcast.net
Colorado Caves may be reopened for NSS convention
17360 by: Lee H. Skinner
Re: Blair Pittman
17361 by: David
Re: WNS and Cave Access
17362 by: mminton.caver.net
17363 by: Andy Gluesenkamp
17364 by: Stefan Creaser
17365 by: Stephen Fleming
17367 by: Andy Gluesenkamp
spread of WNS
17366 by: Mixon Bill
17368 by: Andy Gluesenkamp
Off Topic - analysis of the Japanese nuclear problem
17369 by: dirtdoc.comcast.net
Off Topic - Where's the REAL OT List?
17370 by: R D Milhollin
17371 by: dirtdoc.comcast.net
17372 by: Don Arburn
17377 by: Rod Goke
Re: on topic --- UT surplus auction in Austin
17373 by: David Ochel
TSA Spring Convention: Gear adjustment and safety workshop
17374 by: David Ochel
NSS Directors Election
17375 by: R D Milhollin
The Boiling Springs of Colorado Bend
17376 by: S S
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
--- Begin Message ---
Kim Davis is selling her Brinco-worthy 4x4 in Austin....
http://austin.craigslist.org/cto/2262085171.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This post is only to help those following the news headlines in Japan.
If you click on the link at the bottom of this post, you should see an
aerial map of the nuclear plant in Japan that has had 4 hydrogen explosions.
There is a scale in the bottom left of the map. You can zoom out, by
moving the slider bar at the top left. The authorities
allegedly have 50 personnel at the plant trying to stop a meltdown. They
have asked people within 30 km of this location to
stay indoors, if they haven't yet evacuated. Since it is on the coast,
that means everybody to the west, north and south of the plant.
The largest city in that zone is Minamisoma, which was devastated by the
tsunami. All the other towns in that zone are
small.
If you look closely up and down the coast in this region, there were no
developments along the beach berm except for a few nuclear
plants, or complexes that resemble large plants. There are lots of
villages behind the beach berms, and lots of agriculture, and lots
of small towns to the west of the beaches. Many of these towns have not
made the news yet, but my bet is they were
leveled by the tsunami.
On a related note,
Supposedly, nuclear fallout is not good for fruit production.
and,
Hollywood has postponed the release of 2 movies dealing with disasters
similar to this.
Fukushima Prefecture Futaba District
Okuma夫沢<http://maps.google.com/maps?q=37.42239,141.030979&num=1&t=h&sll=37.421467,141.032577&sspn=0.017724,0.032015&gl=us&ie=UTF8&ll=37.421467,141.032577&spn=0.045671,0.104628&z=14&iwloc=A>
Japan
Show on Google
Maps<http://maps.google.com/maps?q=37.42239,141.030979&num=1&t=h&sll=37.421467,141.032577&sspn=0.017724,0.032015&gl=us&ie=UTF8&ll=37.421467,141.032577&spn=0.045671,0.104628&z=14&iwloc=A>
[image: Google Maps]
Below is another map site that seems to have more details:
http://diddlefinger.com/?ll=37.664255,140.932617&z=11&t=h
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
David,
First of all have you learned nothing from the movies? Nuclear fall-out, if
anything, should make the fruits abnormally large, and likely glow in the
dark.
Second, and slightly more serious, is anyone else frustrated by the sudden
expert stance of reporters on the nuclear power plants? Quotes like "some
reports say the reactor rods are now almost half exposed" or "this was the
third hydrogen explosion reported today" or, "radiation leaks have been
reported at up to 40 times the usual level".
All of these comments need some serious qualification, and explanation.
1. What does an exposed rod mean? I'm not a nuclear engineer or physicist,
what does this mean to the people of the area?
2. "Third hydrogen explosion today"- makes it sound pretty serious... Except
I made hydrogen explosions at my lab table in High School with only the
threat of a detention... Quantify that comment- what does it mean to the
people there?
3. Radation levels 40 times the usual amount registering where? In the
local village? Compared to what? The reactor core? What does this mean to
the people there? I think the image conjured by most people is that glowing
ooze that made the ninja turtles.
Anyway, this reporting (as most it seems) is geared to raise hysteria and
feed drama, not educate or inform.
-B
On Tue, Mar 15, 2011 at 2:43 AM, David <dlocklea...@gmail.com> wrote:
> This post is only to help those following the news headlines in Japan.
>
>
> If you click on the link at the bottom of this post, you should see an
> aerial map of the nuclear plant in Japan that has had 4 hydrogen explosions.
>
>
>
> There is a scale in the bottom left of the map. You can zoom out, by
> moving the slider bar at the top left. The authorities
> allegedly have 50 personnel at the plant trying to stop a meltdown. They
> have asked people within 30 km of this location to
> stay indoors, if they haven't yet evacuated. Since it is on the coast,
> that means everybody to the west, north and south of the plant.
>
> The largest city in that zone is Minamisoma, which was devastated by the
> tsunami. All the other towns in that zone are
> small.
>
> If you look closely up and down the coast in this region, there were no
> developments along the beach berm except for a few nuclear
> plants, or complexes that resemble large plants. There are lots of
> villages behind the beach berms, and lots of agriculture, and lots
> of small towns to the west of the beaches. Many of these towns have not
> made the news yet, but my bet is they were
> leveled by the tsunami.
>
> On a related note,
>
> Supposedly, nuclear fallout is not good for fruit production.
>
> and,
>
> Hollywood has postponed the release of 2 movies dealing with disasters
> similar to this.
>
>
>
> Fukushima Prefecture Futaba District
> Okuma夫沢<http://maps.google.com/maps?q=37.42239,141.030979&num=1&t=h&sll=37.421467,141.032577&sspn=0.017724,0.032015&gl=us&ie=UTF8&ll=37.421467,141.032577&spn=0.045671,0.104628&z=14&iwloc=A>
> Japan
>
> Show on Google
> Maps<http://maps.google.com/maps?q=37.42239,141.030979&num=1&t=h&sll=37.421467,141.032577&sspn=0.017724,0.032015&gl=us&ie=UTF8&ll=37.421467,141.032577&spn=0.045671,0.104628&z=14&iwloc=A>
> [image: Google Maps]
>
>
> Below is another map site that seems to have more details:
>
> http://diddlefinger.com/?ll=37.664255,140.932617&z=11&t=h
>
--
Brian Riordan
979-218-8009 (Mobile)
riordan.br...@gmail.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Another auction is being held the 23rd of March. There is a 1981 John
Deere backhoe with a high bid (so far) of only $550. Many other items.
Go to http://www.swicoauctions.com/viewAuction.php?auctionid=276 to get
the details and see the rest of the list.
Several other auctions are listed under the "Onsite Auctions" tab,
including one at the Texas Forest Service in Lufkin on 16 April. Lotsa
vehicles at that one.
-- Crash
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I had the following e-mail from Jean this morning:
Dwight
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
I am in Alpine trying to get essential bills paid and to stock up on portable
work, computer, and fresh clothes. Will be headed back (to the Odessa hospital)
this afternoon.
They removed Blair's mouth tubes last night but his larynx is bruised and he
couldn't breathe well enough, so they put it back.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
/*Caves closed last summer to protect bat populations may be re-opened
for NSS caving convention this summer:
http://summitcountyvoice.com/2011/03/15/forest-service-wants-comment-on-temporary-cave-plan/
Lee Skinner
*/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
For you that don't know Blair,
here in east Texas, he is most famous for the book below:
http://www.fsbooks.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_book_info&products_id=217
You can sometimes find it in the Texana section of used book stores,
or in the nature
section.
Of course, he is better known to you all for cave related things.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This reply is a little late. The best evidence I know of that
cavers are _not_ spreading WNS is that it first appeared in the
Northeast in 2006, although no one knew what it was or understood the
implications until a year or more later. In the mean time the 2007
NSS Convention was held in Indiana and many cavers attended from the
Northeast. No one specially cleaned or decontaminated gear at that
time, and yet WNS did not appear in Indiana until very recently. If
cavers were a good vector, surely it would have been seen there way
before now.
Mark Minton (currently river caving in Puerto Rico)
Quoting R D Milhollin <rdmilhol...@yahoo.com>:
I may not be up-to-date on the reported studies being done on the
subject, but are there conclusive, convincing, or even supporting
data available that show WNS transmission by cavers has actually
taken place? I understand the possibility exists, but I am unaware
that humans have been actually implicated in the transmission of the
fungus from cave to cave.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'll play this game:
"If cavers were a good vector, surely it would have been seen there way before
now."
Mark Minton (currently river caving in Puerto Rico)
To which I respond:
I was on a cross-country flight and everyone around me was sniffling and
sneezing but I didn't get sick. Surely, I am immune to the common cold virus.
There is evidence that viable Gd spores can be transmitted on cave packs.
That's not to say that they necessarily result in sucessful transmission in all
cases. I think it is better to be cautious while we learn more about WNS than
to be forever slapping ourselfs on the forehead and earning our place on the
wall of shame alongside that dodo who clubbed the last dodo.
Andy
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
"...alongside that dodo who clubbed the last dodo"
Are you saying that the extinction of the Dodo was an inside job?!!!
S.
From: Andy Gluesenkamp [mailto:andrew_gluesenk...@yahoo.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2011 1:52 PM
To: mmin...@caver.net; texascavers@texascavers.com
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Re: WNS and Cave Access
I'll play this game:
"If cavers were a good vector, surely it would have been seen there way before
now."
Mark Minton (currently river caving in Puerto Rico)
To which I respond:
I was on a cross-country flight and everyone around me was sniffling and
sneezing but I didn't get sick. Surely, I am immune to the common cold virus.
There is evidence that viable Gd spores can be transmitted on cave packs.
That's not to say that they necessarily result in sucessful transmission in all
cases. I think it is better to be cautious while we learn more about WNS than
to be forever slapping ourselfs on the forehead and earning our place on the
wall of shame alongside that dodo who clubbed the last dodo.
Andy
-- IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are
confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient,
please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any
other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any
medium. Thank you.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 03/15/2011 12:52, Andy Gluesenkamp wrote:
I'll play this game:
"If cavers were a good vector, surely it would have been seen there
way before now."
I agree with Mark.
To which I respond:
I was on a cross-country flight and everyone around me was sniffling
and sneezing but I didn't get sick. Surely, I am immune to the common
cold virus.
No, you weren't immune to anything, just surrounded by a bunch of people
with seasonal allergies. Just because it looks like a cold symptom does
not mean it is a cold virus. Is that a stretch to believe no one on your
flight was sick? So is a human vector for WNS.
There is evidence that viable Gd spores can be transmitted on cave
packs. That's not to say that they necessarily result in sucessful
transmission in all cases. I think it is better to be cautious while
we learn more about WNS than to be forever slapping ourselfs on the
forehead and earning our place on the wall of shame alongside that
dodo who clubbed the last dodo.
Evidence of transmission? Where? Everything about WNS is hysteria-based.
All is couched in 'might' and 'maybe' (and perhaps a secret hope by a
few that cavers actually are a vector). After 4 years of study and
hand-wringing, and the feel-good placebo of decon, there is not a single
shred of _evidence_ that a human vector is involved. It all is
conjecture risen to pseudo-fact and panic through endless repetition of
an unproven assumption.
To believe that WNS was introduced from Europe by a caver who somehow
picked up spores (and enough of them to be a viable threat), who packed
his dirty gear for a caving trip in NY, and then managed against
infinitesimal odds to drop a few in a hospitable location that
blossomed into a colossal die-off significantly stretches credulity.
A much more likely scenario involves an infected or carrier bat(s) as a
stowaway on international shipping (or somewhat less likely, but still
way more believable than a human vector, an international passenger or
cargo flight). Howe Caverns is 32 miles from the Albany international
shipping port on the Hudson River. There are other ports up and down the
Hudson at greater distances, but several are within a bat's ability to
reach Howe Caverns.
I suspect WNS will run its course much like the West Nile Virus and
decon will eventually be known as ineffective and unnecessary, and
equivalent to slapping individual mosquitoes to control West Nile.
I would change my perspective if some hard facts show otherwise, but
given the lack thereof to date (after apparent intensive investigation)
it would seem that anything cavers do or don't do has any demonstrable
effect on encouraging or preventing the spread of WNS. That, of course,
doesn't prevent agencies from instituting access restrictions as a
knee-jerk reaction, even in the absence of any demonstrated need. The
federal closures in NM are an excellent example of this.
--
Stephen Fleming
_______________
*FEAR is the THIEF of DREAMS* -- Unknown
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Read the studies. Viable Gd spores were picked off of packs that were deconned
before entering the cave. I'm not saying I like the closures. I'm just saying
better to err on the side of caution until we know more. Lots of good people
are working hard to get a handle on this thing.
Andy
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
People are asking the wrong question. It is of course impossible to
prove that white-nose syndrome can't be or hasn't been spread by
cavers. It is impossible to prove it isn't God's revenge for some sin
committed by a bat buff, either. But it unquestionably can be spread
by bats. No cavers gave it to "over a million bats." Given that, the
real question is whether all the decontamination procedures and caving
moratoriums are likely to prevent its spread _indefinitely_. Certainly
not. (That would be true even if cavers were the sole source of
transmission, because some will flout the rules.) But perhaps they can
delay its spread. So what? Well, maybe a cure could be found soon
enough, if it spread slowly enough. But is there any real possibility
of a cure or preventative that is practical, ecologically sound, and
effective? Fungal diseases are hard to prevent or cure in individual
people. Bats are highly mobile wild animals.
People who are grasping at straws are not balancing the fragility of
those straws against the harm produced by keeping cavers from going
about their everyday business. I personally think that the enjoyment
some people get from trying to do something, anything about the
problem does not justify forbidding the enjoyment other people get
from unimpeded caving. (Those people who are doing things because it's
their job or because some law says they have to don't count, of
course.) -- Mixon
----------------------------------------
If a thing is not worth doing, it is not worth doing well.
----------------------------------------
You may "reply" to the address this message
came from, but for long-term use, save:
Personal: bmi...@alumni.uchicago.edu
AMCS: edi...@amcs-pubs.org or sa...@amcs-pubs.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Bill,
You could have just quoted your tag line.
Andrew G. Gluesenkamp, Ph.D.
700 Billie Brooks Drive
Driftwood, Texas 78619
(512) 799-1095
a...@gluesenkamp.com
________________________________
From: Mixon Bill <bmixon...@austin.rr.com>
To: Cavers Texas <texascavers@texascavers.com>
Sent: Tue, March 15, 2011 5:41:38 PM
Subject: [Texascavers] spread of WNS
People are asking the wrong question. It is of course impossible to prove that
white-nose syndrome can't be or hasn't been spread by cavers. It is impossible
to prove it isn't God's revenge for some sin committed by a bat buff, either.
But it unquestionably can be spread by bats. No cavers gave it to "over a
million bats." Given that, the real question is whether all the decontamination
procedures and caving moratoriums are likely to prevent its spread
_indefinitely_. Certainly not. (That would be true even if cavers were the sole
source of transmission, because some will flout the rules.) But perhaps they
can
delay its spread. So what? Well, maybe a cure could be found soon enough, if it
spread slowly enough. But is there any real possibility of a cure or
preventative that is practical, ecologically sound, and effective? Fungal
diseases are hard to prevent or cure in individual people. Bats are highly
mobile wild animals.
People who are grasping at straws are not balancing the fragility of those
straws against the harm produced by keeping cavers from going about their
everyday business. I personally think that the enjoyment some people get from
trying to do something, anything about the problem does not justify forbidding
the enjoyment other people get from unimpeded caving. (Those people who are
doing things because it's their job or because some law says they have to don't
count, of course.) -- Mixon
----------------------------------------
If a thing is not worth doing, it is not worth doing well.
----------------------------------------
You may "reply" to the address this message
came from, but for long-term use, save:
Personal: bmi...@alumni.uchicago.edu
AMCS: edi...@amcs-pubs.org or sa...@amcs-pubs.org
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The post-earthquake nuclear crisis
The Japan syndrome
Mar 15th 2011, 17:05 by The Economist online
Here is a nice. clear, and unemotional analysis of the Japanese nuclear
problems. The Economist has done their usual clear and informative writing,
but it does help if you are technically oriented.
http://www.economist.com/blogs/babbage/2011/03/post-earthquake_nuclear_crisis
DirtDoc
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--- Begin Message ---
There has been a lot of non-cave, non-caving, and non-caver posting here
lately. I remember (and subscribed to) a separate list that I understood was
expressly for that sort of stuff: cavers posting about non-cave-related topics.
Does anyone else remember this? Seems that my mailbox set to receive caving
stuff is getting filled up with other, unrelated material.
I expect to read about WNS, caving trips, convention and meeting announcements,
news about fellow cavers, cave cleanups, cave publications, and other
information I can't find anywhere else, or nearly anywhere else here on the
Texas Cavers list. Is it that difficult to post other material in a separate
place?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I did transgress. Got carried away with the other posts. SORRY
DirtDoc
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
How do we subscribe to the off topic list? I enjoy these campfire conversations.
Don's iPhone.
On Mar 15, 2011, at 9:32 PM, dirt...@comcast.net wrote:
> I did transgress. Got carried away with the other posts. SORRY
>
>
>
> DirtDoc
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
R D asked,
"Is it that difficult to post other material in a separate place?"
Unfortunately, it is quite difficult for anyone who has no clue about how to do it, and I suspect that most of the subscribers to Texascavers fall into this category. During the last several years, I've seen a number of messages on this list asking people to take various topics to the mysterious OT list, but I don't think I've ever seen a message explaining how to do that. No wonder nobody (or practically nobody) uses it!
If we want people to make use of a "REAL OT List" then we need to make sure that there is an easy way for people to read it and to post messages there, and we need to publicize the directions enough on Texascavers so that people will actually know how to do it. Also, whenever a new discussion thread begins on the OT list, it would be useful for someone to alert us with a brief message posted to Texascavers. Otherwise, people interested in an OT topic are liable to miss the discussion by not checking the OT list, in which case, writers will be tempted to post everything to the regular Texascavers list, because they think no one is reading the OT list.
Rod
----------------------
From: R D Milhollin
Sent: Mar 15, 2011 9:28 PM
To: Cave Texas
Subject: [Texascavers] Off Topic - Where's the REAL OT List?
There has been a lot of non-cave, non-caving, and non-caver posting here lately. I remember (and subscribed to) a separate list that I understood was expressly for that sort of stuff: cavers posting about non-cave-related topics. Does anyone else remember this? Seems that my mailbox set to receive caving stuff is getting filled up with other, unrelated material.
I expect to read about WNS, caving trips, convention and meeting announcements, news about fellow cavers, cave cleanups, cave publications, and other information I can't find anywhere else, or nearly anywhere else here on the Texas Cavers list. Is it that difficult to post other material in a separate place?
|
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Yes,
Including fancy drafting tables:
http://www.swicoauctions.com/viewItem.php?itemid=101416
http://www.swicoauctions.com/viewItem.php?itemid=101417
Cheers,
David
On 3/15/11 9:39 AM, Jim Kennedy wrote:
Another auction is being held the 23^rd of March. Thereis a 1981 John
Deere backhoe with a high bid (so far) of only $550. Many other items.
Go to_http://www.swicoauctions.com/viewAuction.php?auctionid=276_toget
the details and see the rest of the list.
Several other auctions are listed under the�Onsite Auctions�tab,
including one at the Texas Forest Service in Lufkin on 16 April. Lotsa
vehicles at that one.
-- Crash
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Howdy all you Texas vertical cavers,
Becky Jones and I will be hosting the following workshop at the Spring
Convention:
On rope - Gear adjustment and safety workshop
Saturday, 5 - 7 pm
This is for everybody who owns vertical gear.
Do you feel you are lacking efficiency when climbing on rope? Do you
have basic knowledge on how to get up and down a rope, but you never
learned (or have forgotten) about basic safety protocols and
precautions? Do you have particular questions about aspects of single
rope technique or pieces of your vertical kit?
This will be a loosely structured workshop, based on participants' needs
and interest. The objective is to review whatever questions you might
have, with the goal of improving the overall safety awareness and
competency of Texas' vertical caving community. Bring your own gear - we
will aim to have ropes set up for gear adjustment and review of
techniques, but this is *not* an introduction to vertical caving for
those who have never been on rope. (Ask your local Grotto for such
training opportunities.)
Cheers,
David
On 3/11/11 6:40 PM, ellie :) wrote:
*
Hey all!
Spring convention is getting closer and some have asked for a schedule
of events to expect during the convention. Here is the best overall
schedule I have so far, as always, everything is subject to change.
*F**riday, April 1st*
* *
Arrival & Registration at Rendezvous Park
*
* *
Vendor set-up outside Service Center (vendors can secure items
inside service center during evening, please contact me with
questions)
*
*Saturday, April 2nd*
* *
8am - Registration in Service Center
*
* *
*
*
9am-5pm
*
* - Presentations in Service Center
*
* *
10pm - Deadline for entries into Map & Photo Salon
*
* *
12pm-1:30pm - Lunch on own, s*
alon viewing in Service Center, visit vendors outside of Service
Center
*
*
* *
*
Directly after talks- TSA meeting
*
*
* *
7pm - Group Feed outside Service Center
*
* *
8:30pm (or *
*
after everyone is good and fed)
*
**
- TCMA Auction
**
*
*
in Service Center
*
*
*
*
* *
The rest of the night- Shiner beer, personal slide shows in
Service Center, fun and hanging out in Service Center &
Campgrounds(no fire if burn ban is in effect)
*
*Sunday, April 3rd*
* *
First thing- *
*
*
Easter egg hunt for the kid
*
*
**
*
*
* *
*
8am - TCMA breakfast!
*
*
* *
9am-10am - *
TCMA meeting
*
*
* *
*
10am & 11am - Two separate trips to Kickapoo Caverns
*
*
*
*
Also, here are links to a couple of maps to help orient everyone.
*
*
*
*
*Map of areas we are using at Fort Clark Springs (adapted from Gill's 94
convention map):*
*
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0BzP7GaKdftjDOWE5NjBlOGEtY2RiNC00YmJjLWJkYjYtNDJkNmUyMzJhNTA2&hl=en
<https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0BzP7GaKdftjDOWE5NjBlOGEtY2RiNC00YmJjLWJkYjYtNDJkNmUyMzJhNTA2&hl=en>
**
*
*
**
<https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0BzP7GaKdftjDOWE5NjBlOGEtY2RiNC00YmJjLWJkYjYtNDJkNmUyMzJhNTA2&hl=en>
*Service Center Dimensions:*
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0BzP7GaKdftjDNDljNzg1YWEtMjRiYi00Njk4LTg0MTktMjlhNjMxNTljMWMx&hl=en
<https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0BzP7GaKdftjDNDljNzg1YWEtMjRiYi00Njk4LTg0MTktMjlhNjMxNTljMWMx&hl=en>
If anyone has any questions, please don't hesitate to contact me at
ellie.tho...@gmail.com <mailto:ellie.tho...@gmail.com>. If you don't
ask....you wont get an answer.
/
/
Ellie Watson
TSA Vice Chair
Bexar Grotto
/The TSA Spring Convention will be in Brackettville, TX from April
1-3rd, 2011. /
Convention website: http://www.cavetexas.org/events/TSASC/tsasc2011.html
Facebook Event Page (members only):
http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=118366598218649
Photos on facebook (viewable by non-members)
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=229140&id=507449505
<http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=229140&id=507449505>
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forward from the VAR list:
The 2011 NSS Director Election is underway. Look for your official ballot in
the mail soon!
This year, the Nominating Committee is pleased to offer a slate of 11
candidates for 4 Director positions on the NSS Board of Governors.
Please study each candidate's platform statement carefully--they will help to
lead our Society for the next three years. Be sure to mail your ballot by May
1, 2011, so that your voice will be heard and your vote will be counted.
For further information, please go to the NSS Website:
Nominating Committee Home
Candidate Platforms
Sincerely,
Allan Weberg
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On this last trip to CB we took a jaunt down to see Gorman falls and it was
noticed that down by the edge of river the water appeared to be boiling.
Closer inspection found many bubbles roiling out of the sediment packed into an
obvious fissure in a few inches of water along the creek bank below the viewing
area. The shallow pool in the crevice looked like a pot nearly at a full boil
with the bubbles seeming to discharge in waves separated by short periods of
inactivity.
Has any research been done to determine the makeup of this gas and its origin?
We all wagered that this was probably the source of the dred carbon dioxide
that plagues the caves in the park. I hadnt heard any discussion on this topic
and thought it might make an interesting thread.
SS
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