Sometimes the simplest things are the hardest to remember :-) Ladder Cave it is! George is it in the file? Should be from the KCCP days..
On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 4:06 PM, Amanda Scott <mamaarsc...@gmail.com> wrote: > I think the name of the cave is drum roll please............. LADDER CAVE. > If my memory serves me correctly. > > > On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 3:37 PM, Joe Ranzau <jran...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> The cave you are thinking of is on the Anderson ranch just north of CWAN. >> The name is escaping me... Maybe Karen, Blair or Allen remembers... Emory >> was the ranch hand. >> >> To the best of my knowledge it doesn't go under the Guad. Not deep or long >> enough. Only used one extension ladder (a long one) to get down. But it did >> go for quite a ways and got muddy after a keyhole. >> >> George correct me if I'm wrong but a cave would need to drop at least 100' >> to get under the Guad from up where CWAN, Alzafar, Golden Fawn, Spring >> Creek, Phillip's water cave etc are located. >> >> Joe >> j...@oztotl.com >> >> Sent while mobile >> >> On Jul 11, 2008, at 3:24 PM, "George Veni" <gv...@warpdriveonline.com> >> wrote: >> >> *Travis,* >> >> * * >> >> *While I've moved to New Mexico, I continue for the time being to >> maintain the TSS files for Kendall County (as well as Bexar and Comal). No >> cave in the files is reported to extend under the Guadalupe River. Can you >> or Joe Ranzau (who I know is neck-deep in wedding preparations and other >> matters) send me more information on the cave you mentioned below. Are you >> sure it wasn't Cricket Cave, which is north of CWAN and on CWAN property? If >> the cave is in the database, I'll get you more information on it. If it is >> new to the database, then Texas is officially one cave richer. * >> >> * * >> >> *On the question of air-filled caves extending under rivers, the >> potential for it depends on the elevation of the water table. Generally >> speaking, a river is the surface expression and extension of the groundwater >> table. By definition, all spaces below the water table are filled with >> water. The Guadalupe River is one such stream and so no air-filled caves >> should exist below it. However, many streams have "losing" reaches where the >> water table is below the stream bed and the streams lose their flow the >> further they extend over such areas, often going completely dry. Most of the >> streams that extend across the Edwards Aquifer Recharge Zone are losing >> streams and places where you can find caves below stream beds. I can think >> of several examples.* >> >> * * >> >> *While karst aquifers are known to rapidly transmit water underground, >> they are also good at perching water for short distances (relative to the >> overall scheme of things). These aquifers are triple permeability (the >> measure of how fast water flows through rock or soil) systems. The bedrock >> or matrix permeability transmits water at rates of meters per thousands of >> years and provides the bulk surface on which losing streams flow. >> Significant water loss in losing streams occurs in fracture permeability, >> where groundwater may be months or decades old, and in conduit permeability. >> Hydrologically, conduits are generally any continuous cavity more than about >> 15 mm in diameter or width. Caves are just big conduits that people can >> enter. In terms of how water flows, its chemistry, ability to transport >> sediment and provide habitat to critters, and vulnerability to >> contamination, conduits and caves are largely indistinguishable. And I don't >> think I need to describe to cavers how fast water can move in caves.* >> >> * * >> >> *George* >> >> * * >> >> * * >> >> *From:* tra...@oztotl.com [mailto:tra...@oztotl.com <tra...@oztotl.com>] >> *Sent:* Friday, July 11, 2008 11:50 AM >> *To:* <Texascavers@texascavers.com>Texascavers@texascavers.com >> *Subject:* RE: [Texascavers] RE: Explore a cave? >> >> >> >> I seem to recall going into a cave north of CWAN back in the day, maybe it >> was called Chimney Cave or something? It was in a definite karst area (no >> soil) and had a ladder going down into the entrance pit. Beyond the >> entrance room, it was a series of stoop walking passages with places to >> stand up here and there. Anyways, I was told it went directly under the >> Guadalupe River near it's terminus, but I have no idea if that is true.. >> There were mostly SA folks (I can remember Ranzau being there as a mere high >> school senior just getting his feet wet in the caving world), Spencer Woods >> and Amanda and I. Anyways, was this ever confirmed by a survey? >> >> TS >> >> (I think I even took a video camera and recorded the cave from entrance to >> near the end, need to find that..) I also remember coming out of the cave >> one night late and becoming COMPLETELY lost with fading lights and no >> batteries. About the time we resolved to just sleep on the ground, we >> stumbled onto the trail. We slept good in the owners spare quarters with >> the heater that night. >> >> >> >> Actually, there are a number of caves in various places where you can walk >> or crawl under active flowing streams. Blackhouse Mountain Cave in >> Tennessee is a great example as one of the passages in this multi-mile long >> cave goes completely under a flowing stream and has an entrance on both >> sides of the creek. >> >> >> >> Geary >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >
