************* The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org ************
2011/12/23 <trom-requ...@lists.newciv.org>
> Send Trom mailing list submissions to > trom@lists.newciv.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > trom-requ...@lists.newciv.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > trom-ow...@lists.newciv.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Trom digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Trom Digest, Vol 89, Issue 17 (Pete McLaughlin) > 2. Re: Trom Digest, Vol 89, Issue 17 (Paul Tipon) > 3. Re: Trom Digest, Vol 89, Issue 17 (Leo Faulhaber) > Dear Pete Thank you for your wishes. You have quite an understanding of games. Merry Christmas to you and to all the readers of this list. For those of you who do speak German: I recently found an interesting site on the web that seems to implement some basics of TROM. You can find it here: http://www.der-kodex-xxl.bplaced.net/ All the best Leo Faulhaber Switzerland ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2011 09:59:30 -0800 (PST) From: Pete McLaughlin <pete_mclaughlin_93...@yahoo.com> To: The Resolution of Mind list <trom@lists.newciv.org> Subject: Re: [TROM1] Trom Digest, Vol 89, Issue 17 Message-ID: <1324576770.18140.yahoomail...@web162101.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi LeoActually I think Dennis' point, and I agree with it, is that I cannot leave this universe until I am willing to let go of ALL of the games I am playing.? I will have to let go of the property and tools and even my attachment to other people in my family in order to be able to leave. Any where I create a dichotomy of must have versus must not have or must know versus must not know I am playing a game compulsively. So if I want to be good and not be bad, or have good tools and not have bad tools, or want to have my money and not let the government take money away from me, I am creating dichotomies which are compulsive games play.? I must let go.? This is why Jesus said "It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to get to heaven". You are correct that I will not let go of these games concerning my stuff and my family until I "win" them. However,? I recognize that this is only a temporary condition in this universe.? A game won is no longer being played so a new game must be created or I will get bored and pull in any game.? This can have unpleasant consequences. Look at anyone who gets sick or has conflicts with others or gets their email account hacked. Unproactive pulling in of old games conditions will occasionally be unpleasant. It is better to run RI for a while and create lots of stuff to keep unpleasant games out of my space or better yet create a game of creating pleasant effects for others,? Like a Boy Scout, do a good deed.? Or get out my Harmonica and play some music or plant something in the garden. Absolutely, survival is a game.? "must live" "must not die". It cannot be won as each of us die at least once every lifetime.? The objective then is to reduce the importance of playing this game also.? Reduce the importance of survival to zero and be free to leave this universe.? Of course, I will not be willing to let the body die till I am willing to let many of the other games go that I mentioned above. Survive is a more basic game than having money or tools or family but still a junior game to Be Known versus Not Be Know or? Knowing versus Not Knowing. My objective is to understand these things on all the games I recognize as being played in this universe then let go of my need to be here playing these games and go else where to see what games are played there. I suspect this is foolishness and that I should just chuck everything and go to continuously meditating at Being, Joy-filled and harmless to everyone.? However, I'm having to much fun learning to be willing to do that at this time. Thanks Leo for this interesting conversation and letting me rant. Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays, whichever applies. Keep on TROMing Pete >________________________________ > From: Leo Faulhaber <leo.faulha...@gmail.com> >To: trom@lists.newciv.org >Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2011 11:09 PM >Subject: Re: [TROM1] Trom Digest, Vol 89, Issue 17 > >************* >The following message is relayed to you by? trom@lists.newciv.org >************ > > >4. Complimentary Postulates (Leo Faulhaber) > >Dear Pete > >Excellent analysis and answer. > >It seems that there are a couple of games that need to be won in order to survive. > >So one could make the conclusion that survival is a game and as such not necessarily reasonable or rational ... > >There are some ramifications with this. > >Leo Faulhaber > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: < http://lists.newciv.org/pipermail/trom/attachments/20111222/12df8e34/attachment-0001.html > ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2011 17:57:51 -0800 From: Paul Tipon <pti...@proftitleserv.com> To: Pete McLaughlin <pete_mclaughlin_93...@yahoo.com> Cc: trom@lists.newciv.org Subject: Re: [TROM1] Trom Digest, Vol 89, Issue 17 Message-ID: <8743753d-b1f7-4fa7-8185-b61fe472e...@proftitleserv.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Hi Pete, This is from your post. "I will have to let go of the property and tools and even my attachment to other people in my family in order to be able to leave." In your endeavor to achieve the above, it is each of us who are the creators and makers of games. Given the ability to leave, one will likewise have the ability to arrive. For when you leave, you must be arriving somewhere other than where you are leaving. Even arriving in your own private untraceable universe that not even you can locate, is leaving and arriving. One action is not a singular one- way flow. Without this viewpoint of ability, we can look at the action as a loss and in fact a permanent loss. There is such a fear of loss that one makes sure things are solid and more solid and never to be lost or missing and therefore unrecoverable. The idea of something being really 'REAL'. From a true game player's viewpoint, he only takes this dilemma (that there is a loss involved) on to make the game of value and of importance. The dilemma is necessary so that one does not know that he put it there and can take it away. (would that be cheating ?) The ol' not know postulate. The idea of such a thing as overwhelm actually existing is such a consideration and that's all it is. There I go into considerations again. Once again on the path to freedom we can see that importances are the key. Importances are what created the mind, created universes, identities, bodies. After that there then became an infinite number of games being played and on top of that an infinite number of new games to be created in the future. An infinite now and an infinite future. The only thing finite is the past but only because one seldom creates there, although that can be done. Paul, Level 5 in progress ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Trom mailing list Trom@lists.newciv.org http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom End of Trom Digest, Vol 89, Issue 19 ************************************
_______________________________________________ Trom mailing list Trom@lists.newciv.org http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom
