Blaine: You'd make a grand astrologer, Wm, you ought to go to Hogworts for an advanced degree. LOL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Wm. Taylor" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 11:15 AM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] astrology
> I just consulted the stars and, well, good news and bad. The bad news is, > they said you are not going to get a job, in any field, because you're not a > farmer [:>( The good news is, you might get one somewhere else {:>) > > hehe > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 8:20 AM > Subject: [TruthTalk] astrology > > > > > > Astrology is testable? Here's a test: I was born on Dec 20, 1950. > > Predict for me when I will find a job. For bonus points, tell me in what > > career field that job will be. > > > > vincent j. fulton > > > > > > On Wed, 24 Mar 2004 20:32:11 -0700 "Blaine Borrowman" > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > Blaine: This has nothing to do with my Mormon upbringing, but I beg to > > differ with your statement, > > > > " Astrology is not science. They make observations, but they have no > > > theories to explain the universe or any part of it. Their ideas cannot > > be > > > tested. > > > > Anyone familiar with the subject of astrology will tell you much > > research has already been done. For instance, the Rosecrucians did > > elaborate research on the relationship between astrological sign of birth > > (sun sign) and longevity. This is definitely testable, and in fact the > > results were rather astounding--women born in the sign Gemini > > consistently tended to outlive women born in any other sign, and the same > > with men born under the sign Taurus, with Gemini men coming in a close > > second. For both men and women, Sagitarrius was the shortest lived sign. > > > > > > I believe I could also show that certain signs favor certain others in > > choosing marriage partners--or friends. This would be a simple test, and > > not hard to design an experiment using all of the known statisical > > methods familiar to scientists. > > > > Your comments actually show your almost total ignorance of the subject of > > Astrology--I could say much more, but will suffice for now. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 6:14 PM > > Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] POLYANYI > > > > > > > > > > Science needs math, but math doesn't need science. > > > > > > Mathematicians and theologians both can and often do start with > > > premises which they find interesting but are not necessarily rooted in > > > the real world, then they follow out the logical implications of those > > > premises. The analogy breaks down in that theologians' conclusions can > > be > > > tried against God's truth as revealed in the bible, but there's no way > > > that I know of to check the conclusions of mathematicians. > > > > > > Astrology is not science. They make observations, but they have no > > > theories to explain the universe or any part of it. Their ideas cannot > > be > > > tested. They cannot tell the future as they claim to do. They cannot > > > explain peoples' personality quirks as they claim to do. Astrology is > > to > > > astronomy as professional wrestling is to the olympics. > > > > > > vincent j. fulton > > > > > > On Wed, 24 Mar 2004 14:49:57 -0500 "David Miller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > writes: > > > > Vince wrote: > > > > > Theology is more like math than science > > > > > > > > I'm not sure what you mean by this. Math is the language of > > > > science. > > > > Without math, science cannot do what it does. Maybe you can > > > > elaborate > > > > on what you had in mind when you said that theology is more like > > > > math > > > > than science. > > > > > > > > Vince wrote: > > > > > you start with an assumption or set of assumptions, > > > > > regardless of how much they do or do not seem > > > > > to reflect a real-world situation, then you derive > > > > > conclusions from those assumptions. > > > > > > > > Interesting. I'm not trained in theology, but it sounds like you > > > > are > > > > saying that theology does not care how much the assumptions they > > > > make > > > > fit the real world? Is that really what you meant to say? > > > > > > > > All disciplines of study, whether theology or science, make > > > > assumptions > > > > and reason from those assumptions. > > > > > > > > Science reasons from the premise that Truth can be apprehended only > > > > through the physical senses. Theology maintains an additional > > > > assumption, that we can gain knowledge through the spirit. > > > > > > > > Vince wrote: > > > > > Astrology is founded on fairy tales, superstition, etc. > > > > > To those who accept the basic premises of astrology, > > > > > that heavenly bodies have some sort of influence on > > > > > peoples' personalities and the events which occur in > > > > > peoples' lives, it's easy to believe the stuff pumped > > > > > out by astrologers. It makes sense to those who believe > > > > > the basic premises. > > > > > > > > Are you saying that there is no foundation at all for astrology? > > > > Doesn't Gen. 1:14 say, "let them be for signs..."? Doesn't Daniel > > > > 6:27 > > > > and Acts 2:19 affirm this also? Wasn't the birth of Christ marked > > > > with > > > > a star? > > > > > > > > I do not believe astrology is right for the believer in Christ, but > > > > I > > > > think you go too far to say that astrology is founded only on fairy > > > > tales and superstition. I think Blaine would disagree too. :-) > > > > You > > > > are presenting a belief from your own culture and value system which > > > > is > > > > rooted in objectivity and materialism. > > > > > > > > Vince wrote: > > > > > Astronomy is, like all of the hard sciences, based > > > > > upon the scientific method. Observation with quantified > > > > > measurements of tangible things like mass, temperature, > > > > > speed, etc. Brainstorming / dreaming / imagining a > > > > > hypothesis. Making logical predictions based upon that > > > > > hypothesis. Experimenting to test those predictions. > > > > > Confirming or denying the validity of the hypothesis > > > > > based upon the results of the experiments. Reproduction > > > > > of the experiments and results by other scientists. > > > > > Peer review of the final package. > > > > > > > > You may not realize this, but astrology also proceeds along these > > > > paths. > > > > They observe the heavens, calculate positions, and they correlate > > > > it > > > > with events on earth. So what is the difference? > > > > > > > > Well, one philosopher has suggested that astrology attempts to > > > > modify > > > > their theory such that eventually their theory becomes > > > > unfalsifiable. > > > > Astronomy, on the other hand, has followed a method called "Strong > > > > Inference" whereby they disproved theories and constructed new > > > > hypotheses which they also attempted to falsify. So the idea is > > > > that > > > > progress toward truth is better made when we construct hypotheses > > > > that > > > > are potentially falsifiable and then attempt to falsify it. The > > > > underlying thinking here is that it is much easier to demonstrate > > > > one > > > > disproof to dismiss an erroneous idea rather than an infinite number > > > > of > > > > proofs to try and bolster an idea. > > > > > > > > Peace be with you. > > > > David Miller, Beverly Hills, Florida. > > > > > > > > ---------- > > > > "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you > > > > may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) > > > > http://www.InnGlory.org > > > > > > > > If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you > > > > have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. > > > > > > > > > > > ---------- > > > "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may > > know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) > > http://www.InnGlory.org > > > > > > If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a > > friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. > > > > > ---------- > > "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may > know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) > http://www.InnGlory.org > > > > If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a > friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. > > > > > > ---------- > "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org > > If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. > ---------- "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.