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No, religious dogma just like Marxist dogma is
irrelevant. What matters is God's Word. DaveH is in
agreement about one event in history, however his sect both adds to and takes
from God's Word why complicate the issue Lance?
Still waiting - judyt
Kevin's question and, Dave's answer are
significant. In light of Jt and DM's view of Jesus it may be that we have more
'perspectivalism' on TT (even by it's founder) than one might have thought.
Kevin questions 'as if' dogma mattered. Does it? (to DM and JT)
DAVEH: Easy,
Kevin. Jesus walked the Holy Land and was seen much differently by
many people. Some recognized him as their Saviour and King, while
others viewed him as a major threat. Even though they each had their
differences of opinion as to where he came from, what he was doing during
his ministry, and what his relationship to deity.....wouldn't you agree they
were all focused on the same Jesus. When Jesus hung on the cross,
there was not a question of which Jesus hung on the cross. The only
question was who's view more accurately represented the real Jesus.
Do you suppose that after the tomb was sealed
that all of Jesus' followers continued to believe he was the Messiah, that
he was God who could not be defeated by his enemies? Or....do you think
there may have been more than a few who might have been thinking their view
of Jesus might have been wrong? If you think there was no doubt.....go
back and read the accounts of those who first saw Jesus after he
arose.
The point being.....no matter what
the perspective of those who saw Jesus hanging on that cross.....he was
still the same person.....Jesus.
And FTR, I
will repeat this again so there is no mistake on your part or any other
TTer. The Jesus I believe in is the same
Jesus who hung on the cross by his enemies, and 3 days later arose in a
resurrected state of exaltation. That is my Jesus, and I
believe he is your Jesus. That we may have
different perspective of some of the details about his attributes
does not mean that we are not talking about the same Jesus that hung on the
cross as explained in the Bible.
Kevin Deegan wrote:
How can your Jesus have different attributes than my Jesus and
still be the same person?
Amos 3:3 Can two walk together, except they
be agreed? Dave Hansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
DAVEH:
Logically, the onus is not upon me to define the Jesus I believe in, but
rather it is on the person who suggests I don't believe in Jesus.
FTR....I have not said that the Jesus Kevin, you Perry or any other TTer
believes in is a false Jesus.
Lance Muir wrote:
DaveH says "Kevin, I believe in Jesus."
IFF we are going to engage in a conversation that entails reality,
then we have to continue to build upon that which has been said
previously.According to you THE JESUS TO BE BELIEVED IN IS MOST
FULLY AND ACCURATELY DESCRIBED WITHIN MORMON TEACHING. Is this
so? The Jesus believed in by Kevin, Perry, Lance et al is a false
Jesus. Is this not also so? (unwieldy but, you get my point)What, IYO,
are the eternal consequenses for non-Mormons?
Mr. Moderator:Please grant DaveH the
opportunity of fully answering and, explaining.
-----
Original Message -----
Sent:
June 19, 2005 23:02
Subject:
Re: [TruthTalk] Belief
DAVEH: FTR Kevin, I believe in
Jesus. Therefore can we conclude that you've made the
judgment rather than God?
Kevin Deegan wrote:
He
will!
He Has!
JN 3:18 He that believeth on him
is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned
already
DAVEH:
I fully understand that, Perry. But I'd feel more comfortable
letting God make that judgment than you.
Charles
Perry Locke wrote:
> David,
>
> Romans
10:9,10 : That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord
> Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath
raised him from
> the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with
the heart man believeth unto
> righteousness; and with
the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
>
>
But, as I have stated before, the right jesus and right god must
be
> at the center of one's faith. I am not just
harassing you, Dave, I
> honestly do believe that the
mormons worship false gods.
>
>
Perry
>
>> From: Dave Hansen
>> Reply-To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
>>
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
>>
Subject: [TruthTalk] Belief
>> Date: Sun, 19 Jun 2005
00:16:42 -0700
>>
>> DAVEH: Yeah........Pretty
quiet on TT tonight..
>>
>> Do you believe
that those who believe in Jesus are saved, as I've
>>
heard many Christians proclaim? If belief is inadequate, what
else
>> is needed, Perry?
>>
>>
Charles Perry Locke wrote:
>>
>>> Dave,
this is great. Midnight, just me and you on TT, mano y mano,
>>> so to speak :-)
>>>
>>>
I guess I am biased in that way, because both you and Blaine
admit
>>> to following the christ and jesus of
mormonism, so it is my opinion
>>> that you are
lost since I believe that they are false gods. If I
>>> thought that you guys were saved in spite of
the teachings of the
>>> mormon church I would not
be spending so much time exposing the
>>> false
nature of the mormon church to
you.
>>>
>>> But, the bottom line is
that God makes that ultimate decision, not
I.
>>>
>>>
Perry
>>>
>>
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dave Hansen
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.langlitz.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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