So is there any new timeline for this right now or is it in the "beats me" territory? Dody G.
On Sun, May 24, 2009 at 4:05 PM, Dody Gunawinata <empirebuil...@gmail.com>wrote: > Bummer. Thanks for the info. > > > On Sun, May 24, 2009 at 3:43 PM, Curt Hagenlocher <c...@hagenlocher.org>wrote: > >> Judging by the last internal email I saw about this on Friday, I'd guess >> not... :( >> >> >> On Sun, May 24, 2009 at 5:25 AM, Dody Gunawinata <empirebuil...@gmail.com >> > wrote: >> >>> Is there any chance for this to come up today? I know it's weekend and >>> the summer. >>> >>> On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 10:21 PM, Jimmy Schementi < >>> jimmy.scheme...@microsoft.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Woops, I meant 2.6. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> *From:* users-boun...@lists.ironpython.com [mailto: >>>> users-boun...@lists.ironpython.com] *On Behalf Of *Dody Gunawinata >>>> *Sent:* Friday, May 22, 2009 11:39 AM >>>> *To:* Discussion of IronPython >>>> >>>> *Subject:* Re: [IronPython] IronPython for ASP.Net >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> IronPython 2 Beta 1 ? >>>> >>>> On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 1:11 AM, Jimmy Schementi < >>>> jimmy.scheme...@microsoft.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> I completely agree with your points; we have a finite amount of >>>> resources and choose to focus on language compatibility over .NET web-stack >>>> integration. Though IronPython has done that web-work in the past, we’re >>>> purely focused on compat. I’ve forwarded on the previous mail to the >>>> ASP.NET team; I want to see IronPython and IronRuby be used on the web >>>> more too. =) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> That being said, *I’ve just finished packaging up >>>> Microsoft.Web.Scripting.dll that works against the released IronPython 2 >>>> Beta 1, and I’ll be releasing it either today to tomorrow* … so end of >>>> conversation? =P Na, I this is a good conversation to have, but in short >>>> you’ll be able to use IronPython 2 Beta 1 in ASP.NET very soon again. >>>> Hopefully the next beta of IronPython 2.6 will include the DLL and source, >>>> otherwise I’ll make this package again. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ~js >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> *From:* Dody Gunawinata [mailto:empirebuil...@gmail.com] >>>> *Sent:* Thursday, May 21, 2009 4:23 AM >>>> *To:* Jimmy Schementi >>>> *Cc:* Discussion of IronPython >>>> *Subject:* Re: [IronPython] IronPython for ASP.Net >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> The refresh was unusable because it contained the version of IronPyton >>>> that is not compatible with .Net 3.5 framework (I think it was built on IP >>>> 2.0 Beta 3/4); >>>> >>>> I'm griping about this issue in this list because I don't think this is >>>> a completely separate issue from the DLR programming languages. Maybe it is >>>> not a direct responsibility of this team, but the impact is direct for the >>>> following reasons: >>>> >>>> - Nobody adopts a language as is. The libraries matters. The >>>> existing community of Python and Ruby are not going to move to Windows >>>> platform just because IronPython and IronRuby are being worked on and >>>> released. They have had a multi platform runtimes with de facto >>>> standards >>>> that are capable of doing wonderful things for more than a decade. >>>> - There is much bigger market for language adoption for existing >>>> .Net/Windows based developers (and new developers) and these guys/gals >>>> are >>>> using mostly standard Microsoft stacks. And they are using .Net via >>>> mainly >>>> C# and VB.Net. If the DLR languages do not have proper support at least >>>> for >>>> the major technology stacks (I would consider ASP.Net/Silverlight as >>>> major >>>> stacks), many people will not consider using the DLR based language for >>>> their production systems. >>>> - I know ASP.Net MVC is open source and it's free to be extended >>>> etc, but ASP.Net WebForm have be en deployed massively and that's not >>>> going >>>> to change anytime soon. And theres is already a support, albeit poor >>>> and not >>>> up to date, for ASP.Net webform stacks in IronPython. Not having it >>>> fully >>>> updated is a waste of opportunity. >>>> - .Net 4.0 and C# vNext contains dynamic language support but >>>> really, what is good for if the DLR languages can only be used in much >>>> more >>>> limited scenarios because some major technology stacks are not >>>> supported. >>>> - You raised correctly that Django and RoR are being used to >>>> validate the languages. But I would argue that the existing technology >>>> stack support validates the DLR platform, not just the languages. >>>> >>>> So yes, I'm not happy with the level of investment being put on >>>> supporting the technology stacks because I think it is pretty short >>>> sighted. >>>> No, I don't blame this team for this but at least if I complain on this >>>> list, it might have a chance being forwarded internally because this is one >>>> of the best community mailing list for Microsoft technologies. >>>> >>>> Dody Gunawinata >>>> >>>> On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 5:17 AM, Jimmy Schementi < >>>> jimmy.scheme...@microsoft.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> First off, it hasn’t been three years: a refresh was released 8 months >>>> ago, and sent to this very list: >>>> >>>> >>>> http://lists.ironpython.com/pipermail/users-ironpython.com/2008-September/008497.html >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Secondly, rather than just producing these one off releases (where are >>>> very taxing on the team), we’re doing it right and getting the source code >>>> released and Ms-Pl’d, so we can include it on Codeplex sources, builds, and >>>> nightly builds. Then it can be included in each IronPython release, just >>>> like Silverlight binaries are. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Lastly, IronRuby and IronPython are programming languages, made by >>>> programming language teams. We’re very interested in running as many >>>> existing Ruby and Python programs as possible. It just so happens that >>>> Django and Rails are popular, complex pieces of software that help find >>>> bugs, and give the languages street cred for running them. If those web >>>> frameworks didn’t run, theirs probably something wrong with our language. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Running in ASP.NET and MVC require a significant amount of work * >>>> outside* of the language, so it really isn’t a language team’s purpose >>>> to build that. Sure they provide good demos as conferences or blog posts, >>>> but they’ll only be toys. We’ve invested in those technologies before, >>>> which >>>> is why the ASP.NET and Silverlight integration exists, but no one is >>>> working on enabling web-technologies full-time (though I have spurts of >>>> diving back into Silverlight from time to time). If you don’t like the >>>> level >>>> of investment in dynamic languages for Microsoft web technologies, that’s >>>> something that you should communicate to the ASP.NET team; Phil Haack ( >>>> http://www.haacked.com) or Dmitry Robsman ( >>>> http://blogs.msdn.com/dmitryr) are good people to address. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ~Jimmy >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> *From:* users-boun...@lists.ironpython.com [mailto: >>>> users-boun...@lists.ironpython.com] *On Behalf Of *Dody Gunawinata >>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 20, 2009 1:22 PM >>>> *To:* Discussion of IronPython >>>> *Subject:* [IronPython] IronPython for ASP.Net >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Is there any update for IronPython for ASP.Net? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> It has been three years since IronPython support for ASP.Net introduced >>>> with the release of the whitepaper ( >>>> http://www.asp.net/DynamicLanguages/whitepaper/) and the first binary. >>>> Since then I think we've had Katrina, a Beijing Olympic, a new President, a >>>> financial collapse and two James Bond movies - yet until now there is still >>>> no up to date support for the technology. I know that the legal team, etc >>>> are working on the source release, but I think it is pretty galling that >>>> Microsoft's own web framework stack is barely supported by its own dynamic >>>> language technology, both on the 'classic' ASP.Net and MVC stack. I mean >>>> there is more energy put into having IronPython and IronRuby to run Django >>>> and RubyOnRails web framework instead of ASP.Net stack. This just doesn't >>>> make sense to me. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> nomadlife.org >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> nomadlife.org >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Users mailing list >>>> Users@lists.ironpython.com >>>> http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> nomadlife.org >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> nomadlife.org >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Users mailing list >>> Users@lists.ironpython.com >>> http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com >>> >>> >> > > > -- > nomadlife.org > > -- nomadlife.org
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